Ubehage Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 Will NC made from ping pong balls work for dragon eggs or do i need to use double base smokeless powder also when mixing acetone with the smokeless powder is there a ratio to mix it or do you just dissolve till you get the consistency of ketchup i cant seem to find the answer to thisIt will work just fine.It's not "the best", but good enough.
Mumbles Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 Generally yes. Smokeless powder is mostly NC, with relatively minor amounts of some burn rate modifiers and processing aids.. Double and triple base powders have other propellants in them besides just NC but usually still work fine. Pingpong balls on the other hand have a substantial amount of camphor and tends to be lower nitrated.
memo Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 It will work just fine.It's not "the best", but good enough. i have read that ping pong balls are not nitro cellouse. then on the other hand some say it is. is it or isn't it ?? what are you making when you break them down with acetone.
Mumbles Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 Memo, there are at least two materials that ping pong balls are made from. Some are NC based, and these tend to be the higher quality ones. There are also ones made from cellulose acetate or cellulose acetate butyrate. The NC ones have a characteristic camphor odor.
insutama Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 So i want to get triple based smokeless powder ? or double based ?
Ubehage Posted July 5, 2015 Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) i have read that ping pong balls are not nitro cellouse. then on the other hand some say it is. is it or isn't it ?? what are you making when you break them down with acetone.Modern ping-pong balls are not cellulose at all. They stopped the production worldwide a few years back.The ones we talk about here, are made of pure cellulose, with a few chemical residues from the production.It's not nitro, so it will need a source of oxygen. Other than that, it behaves just like NC. I know that you can order some from the UK here:http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B008KM9O5C Edited July 5, 2015 by Ubehage
insutama Posted July 7, 2015 Posted July 7, 2015 so ideally you want single based smokeless powder right just want to make sure before I go buy some.
Tabun Posted July 7, 2015 Posted July 7, 2015 Fine, I will weigh in now under official action as a moderator. Stop dragging threads off topic. How many fucking times do I need to bring this up? While we're at it, stop posting vague statements that you might have maybe read somewhere on the internet once. If you're under any illusion that you can't be banned, lose that thought. You contribute very little of substance here. The reason that kewls and the like seemingly get more lenient treatment is because they might still be steered into the right direction and have a future. You on the other hand seem like a lost cause at times. The other big reason some people choose not to participate in the online forums is to avoid dealing with idiots. Can we please get back to nitrocellulose at a binder and pyrotechnic material?Mumbles,can you please tell me which is the best type of NC lacquer(the composition,what it contains) used for pyro and which type of NC is used for it?
fckiamdead Posted August 2, 2015 Posted August 2, 2015 There is some talk about the "double base" smokeless powder (gun powder) that when you make lacquer of that the nitroglycerin can if stored/sits in a warm place leak out and make a possible danger do to it's sensitivity. , any thoughts of that? never heard of any issues but want to make as safe fireworks as possible. (I make my lacquer from nitrocellulose prills today but want to go over to duoble base because it's easier to buy.)
Nessalco Posted August 2, 2015 Posted August 2, 2015 There is some talk about the "double base" smokeless powder (gun powder) that when you make lacquer of that the nitroglycerin can if stored/sits in a warm place leak out and make a possible danger do to it's sensitivity. , any thoughts of that? never heard of any issues but want to make as safe fireworks as possible. (I make my lacquer from nitrocellulose prills today but want to go over to duoble base because it's easier to buy.) I make my NC from double-base powder, and have never had any issues. The nitroglycerine will give you a devil of a headache if you don't wear a respirator while making it, but beyond that, nothing. I've stored samples over the winter, in a heated building, without issues. I do use a metal can, and usually only make what I need and avoid storage. Kevin
insutama Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 im having a heck of a time finding a smokeless powder at the local gun shop thats double based they don't carry green dot or any Alliant powders and they dont seem to be to helpful at the store they keep asking what im trying to reload i dont really want to tell them im making Nitrocellulose lacquer
ddewees Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 http://www.firefox-fx.com/ChemN-P.htm Nitrocellulose, Solid 12% Nitrogen, 5.0 to 6.5 sec 4000 series 25% water - [C6H7N3O11] Stock #C163/NCS - FSShipped moist according to regulations - simply dry and disslove in Acetone or M.E.K. for 'lacquer'. 1 to 1.75oz NC/qt of Acetone for binder for stars, smoke, igniters, etc.; 3.5oz/qt of Acetone for thick concentrate. 1 lb makes up to approx 4 gallons of solution. Maximum absorbtion is approx 4.5 to 5.0 oz NC per quart for a jelly-like viscosity. Methanol can be added to both slow evaporation/gelling (extend work time) and lower the solution viscosity. Up to 10% methanol is common practice.http://www.firefox-fx.com/images/order.gif http://www.firefox-fx.com/images/msds.gif Special $11.75/lb For propellants, lacquers, color flash cellophanes, etc.. http://www.firefox-fx.com/_themes/global/glohorsa.gif
Mumbles Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 They almost certainly do not ship to Canada. You don't absolutely need double base powder to make NC lacquer. Single and double base both work. Triple base probably works as well, but not many experiments have been published. Shot shell powder, like green dot, is popular in the industry because of economic and performance reasons. It's also relatively clean burning. You'll have to do some research on your own. Since you've been in there, you probably have at least some idea of what they have around. Brand names, product numbers, etc. Try looking up what you know they have, and getting some information on it. Once you figure out what will work, you'll probably need to get some idea as to what it's legitimately used for, and it should be a piece of cake to buy some.
taiwanluthiers Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 there's been a shortage of shotgun/pistol powders in general.
insutama Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 ya we have two gun shops in my city and both of them are out of shotgun powder and they said they have had orders in for 6 months and are still waiting so there must be a shortage
taiwanluthiers Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 or buy a box of shotgun shell and use the components. A box of shotgun shells should make you enough lacquer for a while. Interestingly while there's a shortage on shotgun/pistol powder there's no shortage on shotgun shells.
ddewees Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 They almost certainly do not ship to Canada. Oops... I missed that part.
nordicwolf Posted January 9, 2021 Posted January 9, 2021 To revive a very old topic...I just received some of the NC solids described below. How much of this should I dissolve in how much acetone to make good performing crackle / dragon eggs? And is acetone the proper solvent to use? Thank you! http://www.firefox-fx.com/ChemN-P.htm Nitrocellulose, Solid 12% Nitrogen, 5.0 to 6.5 sec 4000 series 25% water - [C6H7N3O11] Stock #C163/NCS - FSShipped moist according to regulations - simply dry and disslove in Acetone or M.E.K. for 'lacquer'. 1 to 1.75oz NC/qt of Acetone for binder for stars, smoke, igniters, etc.; 3.5oz/qt of Acetone for thick concentrate. 1 lb makes up to approx 4 gallons of solution. Maximum absorbtion is approx 4.5 to 5.0 oz NC per quart for a jelly-like viscosity. Methanol can be added to both slow evaporation/gelling (extend work time) and lower the solution viscosity. Up to 10% methanol is common practice.http://www.firefox-fx.com/images/order.gif http://www.firefox-fx.com/images/msds.gifSpecial $11.75/lb For propellants, lacquers, color flash cellophanes, etc..http://www.firefox-fx.com/_themes/global/glohorsa.gif
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