My process for super-hot BP!

[nwpyro]

This technique has made me the hottest meal that I have discovered so far... It's pretty easy and not that time consuming in large batches.

 

Also, this is especially helpful for those who have lower efficiency ball mills, improper lead ball sizes, or low drop distances, too short milling times, etc... If your BP is weak, give this a shot!

 

1. First ball mill like normal until you have a decent meal.

 

2. Add around 25 parts water to your meal(saturate the same as for ricing), mix it thoroughly, then bake in a thin layer inside a covered aluminum or stainless steel baking pan at 210f for 30 minutes. The BP should all be heated to near boiling by that time. Check using a temperature probe to the center... If your doing a thicker layer of BP, you might need a longer time.

 

3. Dry it out in the sun then mill it again for 1/3rd the original milling time. Done! Now you should have super-hot meal which can be riced or used for whatever! If your ballmill is particularly crappy, you can repeat this process twice.

 

Also, I recommend a good charcoal made from Alder Buckthorn, Poplar, Willow, etc...

 

For those who worry about a BP baking accident... If you properly cover the BP and don't overheat it, it will not lose enough water to be able to produce a violent explosion. Probe thermometer through the oven door into center of pan with temperature alarm recommended when doing this for the first time!

Edited May 27, 2014 by nwpyro

[taiwanluthiers]

I am sure its safe, but I would never put bp anywhere near anything that glows red hot or have open flames (in the case of gas oven). I'm sure with careful heating you can be safe but it's too risky. Also charcoal makes a bigger difference anyways. I recommend more using other means to fast dry bp such as dehumidifier or non flame/spark producing heater...

[nwpyro]

I am sure its safe, but I would never put bp anywhere near anything that glows red hot or have open flames (in the case of gas oven). I'm sure with careful heating you can be safe but it's too risky. Also charcoal makes a bigger difference anyways. I recommend more using other means to fast dry bp such as dehumidifier or non flame/spark producing heater...

 

You didn't read the post. The BP is NOT dried in the oven. It's sun dried. The point of heating it while saturated with water is to get KNO3 throughly into the charcoal pores as much as possible.

[nwpyro]

As for why you need to heat the wetted meal... Here is KNO3's water solubility.

316 g/L (20 °C)
2460 g/L (100 °C)

 

At near boiling, about 7.7 times more KNO3 will have dissolved into the water than at room temperature. This results in MUCH more KNO3 crystalizing out inside the charcoal pores.

[schroedinger]

Why do you wan't to mill first? Why not straight start with fine charcoal and sulfur and dissolving all kno3 in water add charcoal, stir and the dry or add ethanol like in the cia process and mill that powder?

[Mumbles]

How positive are you that you're crystallizing nitrate inside of the pores of charcoal? Also, do you have any burn tests or actual numerical comparisons between this and conventional BP?

[nwpyro]

Why do you wan't to mill first? Why not straight start with fine charcoal and sulfur and dissolving all kno3 in water add charcoal, stir and the dry or add ethanol like in the cia process and mill that powder?

 

I would prefer to mill only, however... My ball mill doesn't make the highest performance BP.

 

 

How positive are you that you're crystallizing nitrate inside of the pores of charcoal? Also, do you have any burn tests or actual numerical comparisons between this and conventional BP?

 

I am not sure exactly what is happening, but the resulting BP is much faster than merely milled in my ballmill. Maybe the KNO3 is coating the charcoal? I can video two spolletes burning with the exact same density of meal. One simply milled, and one through this proccess if you want to see... Meal gone through heating while saturated with water and repowdered is faster.

 

My theory is I need to design a new ballmill that doesn't let the BP cake against the ends. I don't think it's as fine as it could be as it starts to cake up. This little brute force workaround works! And no, my powders and charcoal are not moist. All are stored sealed with Dry-Z-Air dessicants.

 

Edit: I should clarify in my first sentence in the topic post... This method has resulted in the fastest homemade BP I have ever made. I don't have any commercial BP to compare to. I got the idea from CI-A method and multi soak/dry/milling's of certain charcoal star compositions for faster burn. Some charcoal stars with very low oxidizer will barely burn without a double wetting/drying/remilling.

Edited May 27, 2014 by nwpyro

[Bobosan]

Very hot, almost boiling water, does the same on meal without the dangers of oven ignition. The oven is just too risky.

[nater]

What concerns me is using an oven, especially since that implies you are doing this inside a kitchen. BP ignites around 800 degrees, your oven is set well below that. However, ovens cycle on and off and the elements get much hotter than the temperature they are set at. The thermostat, burner or heating element could also fail, and now what is the cost?

 

There are plans around for simple drying boxes using a light bulb or ceramic heater for heat amd baffled designs to prevent any comp from contacting electronics. Rapid drying is known to help create faster BP, and there are better ways than using an oven indoors.

[FlaMtnBkr]

Wouldn't a crock pot be better than an oven? It doesn't have an exposed element and can be placed outdoors.

 

Or add the nitrate to an appropriate amount of boiling water, add to the other chemicals, dry, and re-mill.

 

I share the other's concern that the oven is not safe. Not only do ovens cycle on and off to maintain a set temp, but the thermostats are notoriously incorrect. Also, there have been quite a few accidents involving ovens and pyro that I know of, including the ignition of BP. Is your kitchen, house, or life worth it for hotter BP? Just use more of the slow stuff.

 

Also, I think most people have BP clump. Many have speculated that clumping is a sign of BP completion. When many chemicals get to a certain particle size they start to clump. Some literally rock hard. So when the BP starts to clump it is because it has reached a sufficiently small particle size and is essentially done.

 

Maybe describe your ball mill and media. Even inefficient rock tumbler mills can make satisfactory BP with enough milling time. Also, what charcoal are you using and what is the source or method of manufacture? Maybe your charcoal isn't as good as you think?

[taiwanluthiers]

I made straight milled bp and it worked well enough. I mill them until it almost cakes. For the record I mill in 2 steps. First step is 75% kno3 + 5% charcoal, the next step is 10% charcoal and 10% sulfur. The two is then screened together and makes sufficiently fast bp. It is safer in my opinion than milling the whole mix. Neither of the 2 parts burns until combined.

[Maserface]

I like to add 15% ground unicorn horn to my bp, makes it nice and hot and it tastes great!!

[nwpyro]

I like to add 15% ground unicorn horn to my bp, makes it nice and hot and it tastes great!!

 

LoL!

[nwpyro]

Wouldn't a crock pot be better than an oven? It doesn't have an exposed element and can be placed outdoors.

 

Or add the nitrate to an appropriate amount of boiling water, add to the other chemicals, dry, and re-mill.

 

Maybe describe your ball mill and media. Even inefficient rock tumbler mills can make satisfactory BP with enough milling time. Also, what charcoal are you using and what is the source or method of manufacture? Maybe your charcoal isn't as good as you think?

 

You mean like a rice slow cooker? That would work, but it would be a bit slow. My oven only has a temperature fluctuation cycle of 40 degrees.

 

I only add 25 parts water by weight. If you add hot water, the resulting temperature of the wetted meal ends up dropping by more than 2/3rds the difference between the meal and the water temperature. You end up with around 35-45C meal, which doesn't cut it!

 

I use the pacific northwest variety of Alder Buckthorn. I have fully cross compared all viable local wood types with videotaped meal spolletes pressed to the same density and length and burned. It's better than willow or anything else around speed wise.

 

Pacific Alder Buckthorn - Rhamnus Frangula Purshiana

Genus: Rhamnus

Subgenus: Frangula

Species: R. purshiana

 

European/Asian Alder Buckthorn - Rhamnus Frangula

Genus: Rhamnus

Species: R. frangula

Edited May 27, 2014 by nwpyro

[nwpyro]

Oh, here is an additional tip... Do not get the meal too wet! Just wet enough like you would for ricing.

 

Too much water and you will get too many large crystals of KNO3 forming during drying.

[dagabu]

Wait, in a house, in an oven right? hang on there sport, let me show you a few pictures of what you will end up looking like if you dont have enough water, if you temp it in the oven, if the BP pops up from the heated sheet when you move it, on and on.

 

For God's sake, do not do this people, it will never be worth the risk to you, your house and especially your family.

 

Never bring BP in the house, never, never, never.

 

[nwpyro]

That sucks, Dag... Was that in MN in winter? Low humidities in that area during the cooler months can build static like crazy indoors.

[BurritoBandito]

"I would prefer to mill only, however... My ball mill doesn't make the highest performance BP."

 

My first ballmill was a National Geographic 1 lb rock tumbler, and I used marbles as grinding media. Even with this setup I could get decent quality BP (albeit slowly). What type of mill/media do you have? What is your loading procedure and mill time? I would have to run my little NG mill for 24-48 hours and periodically knock the caked powder off the walls.

[dagabu]

That sucks, Dag... Was that in MN in winter? Low humidities in that area during the cooler months can build static like crazy indoors.

 

Out doors, emptying a ball mill, spring, 75% humidity, just snowed the day before. NEVER bring BP in the house, NEVER.

[Mumbles]

 

Out doors, emptying a ball mill, spring, 75% humidity, just snowed the day before. NEVER bring BP in the house, NEVER.

 

 

I will second that from experience.

[nwpyro]

Who ever said anything about bringing anything in the house? I use the oven in the guest cabin. Nobody ever uses it except my sister when she rarely visits in summer...

 

A good trick is to just set the oven off timer and come back after the heating element has cooled. No worries about spilling BP on the element. It wouldn't throw flame far enough anyway. Electrical!

Edited May 28, 2014 by nwpyro

[dagabu]

Cabin, house, barn, any building at all, electric or gas, it's all the same. If you wish to behave foolishly, it is your prerogative, do so but don't give it a thumbs up and decry it as "Safe" when it is anything but. I know for a fact that you cannot dodge BP or any energetic fuel when it catches and just for the record, BP burns much better when it has dampness, not wet or moist but damp.

 

A good trick is to not do this, ever. Take an oven outside, control the element remotely and never open it when hot and I wouldn't care but to tell others it's safe to do so is libelous.

 

"No worries about spilling BP on the element. It wouldn't throw flame far enough anyway. Electrical!" Rubbish!

[Bobosan]

nwpyro doesn't seem to be listening or want to hear about the dangerous procedure he is doing. Must be a troll.

[BurritoBandito]

"I would prefer to mill only, however... My ball mill doesn't make the highest performance BP."

My first ballmill was a National Geographic 1 lb rock tumbler, and I used marbles as grinding media. Even with this setup I could get decent quality BP (albeit slowly). What type of mill/media do you have? What is your loading procedure and mill time? I would have to run my little NG mill for 24-48 hours and periodically knock the caked powder off the walls.

Edited May 29, 2014 by BurritoBandito

[skid68]

 

Out doors, emptying a ball mill, spring, 75% humidity, just snowed the day before. NEVER bring BP in the house, NEVER.

 

Do you know what caused the ignition?