asdercks Posted April 8, 2014 Posted April 8, 2014 Hi huys, looking for videos/tutorials for making dragon eggs I came across this video of Mike Swisher making red lead dragon eggs, check it out!
Zumber Posted April 8, 2014 Posted April 8, 2014 Here is another one from Ned Gorski. http://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=xdNwdY7cgQ8
asdercks Posted April 8, 2014 Author Posted April 8, 2014 Here is another one from Ned Gorski.http://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=xdNwdY7cgQ8I like the one with the new method, where he screen sliced the comp.
TYRONEEZEKIEL Posted April 8, 2014 Posted April 8, 2014 Ned's method is much much better. It cleans up easy makes perfect, uniform, and consistent stars.
Mumbles Posted April 8, 2014 Posted April 8, 2014 I'm with asdercks, and the screen slicing method. Just granulating it through a screen gives a lower density product than the way Mr. Swisher demonstrates. Depending on what effect or purpose you plan to use the crackle for, the density seems important. For crackle comets, either is probably fine as it's a pretty low accuracy effect. If you want a single crack effect, then I'd go with the cutting or screen slicing methods. Commercially, you really can only granulate economically. There is a way to get excellent uniformity and performance out of them, but I don't think all the secrets are out yet. 1
FlaMtnBkr Posted April 8, 2014 Posted April 8, 2014 Ned is a great guy, is very organized and professional, and has the patience and note taking to find what works very well. I just find it funny that so much is attributed to Ned. The vast majority of 'his' techniques are taken from others who have a good reliable technique that he then borrows. And there is nothing wrong with that. In fact it is very smart. But any of us could do the same things he does and very little of what he does is something he came up with. In fact, that is Lloyd S. technique for making crackle. And screen sliced parlon stars were originally tried by Troy Fish, and then Gary S. started experimenting with it and then Ned tried it and wrote an article. Ned is awesome and a great guy to talk to. I just see a lot attributed to Ned when he usually just borrows good ideas and then documents the practice. I don't mind but a few have been pretty darn critical of the practice, especially when the inventor is known but over looked. Anyways...if you want to make crackle my experience is there are much better formulas than Ned uses, that use a lot less bismuth/lead and are quite a bit louder. At least when I was experimenting and with my chemicals. 1
asdercks Posted April 8, 2014 Author Posted April 8, 2014 Ned is a great guy, is very organized and professional, and has the patience and note taking to find what works very well.I just find it funny that so much is attributed to Ned. The vast majority of 'his' techniques are taken from others who have a good reliable technique that he then borrows. And there is nothing wrong with that. In fact it is very smart. But any of us could do the same things he does and very little of what he does is something he came up with.In fact, that is Lloyd S. technique for making crackle. And screen sliced parlon stars were originally tried by Troy Fish, and then Gary S. started experimenting with it and then Ned tried it and wrote an article. Ned is awesome and a great guy to talk to. I just see a lot attributed to Ned when he usually just borrows good ideas and then documents the practice. I don't mind but a few have been pretty darn critical of the practice, especially when the inventor is known but over looked.Anyways...if you want to make crackle my experience is there are much better formulas than Ned uses, that use a lot less bismuth/lead and are quite a bit louder. At least when I was experimenting and with my chemicals.Would you mind sharing some of those formulas, I have some different formulas for making dragon eggs but I would like to compare notes
FlaMtnBkr Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 The best one I have found is: 37.5 bismuth (trioxide or subcarbonate)37.5 black copper oxide25 mgal (200 mesh is a good starting point) A bunch of NC lacquer is added. Usually enough to make it soupy and then allow it to dry before processing. This is to ensure enough NC gets in but some experimenting will show how much is necessary. I also aim for about 3 mm cubes. One of the formulas Ned uses is from Lloyd and has 75 bismuth which is twice as much as above and the expensive component. Lloyd stated it was designed so that multiple pieces will pop, or 'crash', at the same time. He also said they should sound like a good 'lady finger' firecracker. When I made them they weren't as loud as the above. The above sound more like a standard 'BlackCat' firecracker and some almost like a .22 There is also a 30/40/30 formula, and I don't have my notes, but it seems like it worked well but not as good as the first. There are sone others with very low amounts of bismuth but I can't imagine them working better than the first but will be cheaper if that is a concern or bismuth is hard to get. I think dragon eggs are pretty amazing and I spent a lot of time experimenting with them years ago. I figured out how to tune them if your chemicals aren't working. If someone has a problem with them feel free to contact me and we should be able to get them working good. A few turns of paper with a heaping teaspoon of DE that contain up to 10% ti, a pinch of BP to pop the paper, and a fuse make an awesome ground item that throws sparks everywhere in a 20' circle. Also, the previous post of mine is a good example of why I shouldn't post in a lot of pain and should have just kept my thoughts to myself. I guess I was also trying to point out that anyone who reads, talks to others, and take great notes can also make amazing fireworks like Ned does. If you follow what is known and out there you can make great fireworks. You dont have to be a chemist and reinvent the wheel to make pro level pyro. I have met Ned a handful of times and he is one of the nicest guys around. I wasn't trying to discredit him or put him down.
nater Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 (edited) I didn't take it as disrespect for Ned. Some of his videos are condensed, but when he shows you something in person or in seminars, he credits the people before him. He has a knack for explaining things step by step, so if one follows along without much experience you should have predictable results. I wish we had some of the formulas for the crackle found in Chinese 1.3g shells, the crackle that echos. It is often called timed rain or something similar, but it is even louder than the other hobbyist DE I have seen. Edited April 9, 2014 by nater
pyrokid Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 Nater what do you mean "echoes?" Is that meant to convey the magnitude of the noise or is there some effect I'm forgetting? In my experience with consumer items, the "dragon flower" stars that contain the Ti in the smolder coating are much quieter than the stars whose only purpose is to create an audible effect.
FlaMtnBkr Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 I don't suppose you have a link to some video? Or any more details? I bet they use the same chemicals. But I have noticed some interesting things with DE when they are/are not primed and when they are exposed to extreme heat such as a camp fire. Also, I have had a lump the size of a nickel sound like it donates and sounds more like a shot gun. I would be curious to hear a bit more about them.
asdercks Posted April 9, 2014 Author Posted April 9, 2014 The best one I have found is: 37.5 bismuth (trioxide or subcarbonate)37.5 black copper oxide25 mgal (200 mesh is a good starting point) A bunch of NC lacquer is added. Usually enough to make it soupy and then allow it to dry before processing. This is to ensure enough NC gets in but some experimenting will show how much is necessary. I also aim for about 3 mm cubes. One of the formulas Ned uses is from Lloyd and has 75 bismuth which is twice as much as above and the expensive component. Lloyd stated it was designed so that multiple pieces will pop, or 'crash', at the same time. He also said they should sound like a good 'lady finger' firecracker. When I made them they weren't as loud as the above. The above sound more like a standard 'BlackCat' firecracker and some almost like a .22 There is also a 30/40/30 formula, and I don't have my notes, but it seems like it worked well but not as good as the first. There are sone others with very low amounts of bismuth but I can't imagine them working better than the first but will be cheaper if that is a concern or bismuth is hard to get. I think dragon eggs are pretty amazing and I spent a lot of time experimenting with them years ago. I figured out how to tune them if your chemicals aren't working. If someone has a problem with them feel free to contact me and we should be able to get them working good. A few turns of paper with a heaping teaspoon of DE that contain up to 10% ti, a pinch of BP to pop the paper, and a fuse make an awesome ground item that throws sparks everywhere in a 20' circle. Also, the previous post of mine is a good example of why I shouldn't post in a lot of pain and should have just kept my thoughts to myself. I guess I was also trying to point out that anyone who reads, talks to others, and take great notes can also make amazing fireworks like Ned does. If you follow what is known and out there you can make great fireworks. You dont have to be a chemist and reinvent the wheel to make pro level pyro. I have met Ned a handful of times and he is one of the nicest guys around. I wasn't trying to discredit him or put him down.Thanks for sharing, funny I have used the 37.5 formula before but when I was done cutting and crushing the DE I mixed them up with some other batch I had laying around so I never got to compare the performance of the DE, oh well!
nater Posted April 9, 2014 Posted April 9, 2014 I couldn't find a video with the effect I was after, but it would be hard to capture on film anyway. We often shoot barge shows, so we can hear the breaks and some effects echo across the lake. I'm not terribly fond of crackle, it is like the song that has long been played out on the radio but is still on the regular playlist rotation. However some crackle shells stand out. The shotgun analogy was a good one for what I am thinking of. Much louder than the DE which sounds like a ladyfinger, but still a softer effect than a beraq. The spritzles are bigger and the sound is like a shot gun or an audience applauding.
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