Organic Colors

[Wiley]

Now that I've gotten my lift and burst working, I'd like to make some colored stars. Almost everything up to this point has been made from re-purposed materials, i.e. masking kraft used for anything requiring "kraft paper," stump remover KNO3 , crochet thread for spiking twine, etc. I haven't actually bought any real "pyro chems" and my price of operation has remained quite low. Colored stars of course require said pyro chems, and I want to keep costs to a minumum while still achieving some enjoyable effects. All the formulas below are from Shimizu, and though they are organic, I think they'll be suitable for my purposes. A few questions:

 

1) The blue uses dextrin instead of SGRS. Does it matter in this formula, or any of them for that matter, whether dex or SGRS are used? 5% of either sounds pretty darn sufficient to me.

 

2) The red and yellow formulas contain lampblack, most likely to lower the ignition temperature. Do I really need it?

 

3) Does PVC vs Parlon make any difference to the star's performance?

 

4) Most of these look to be slow burning formulas, based on the amount of carbonate in them. I really prefer long hanging colors. Is this the case?

 

Red Star #1
From Shimizu (FAST), page 215
Parts by weight

Potassium Perchlorate 66

Red Gum 13

Lampblack 2

Strontium Carbonate 12

Polyvinyl Chloride (PVC) 2

Soluble Glutinous Rice Starch 5

------------

Green Star #1
From Shimizu (FAST), page 215
Parts by weight

Barium Nitrate 28.3

Potassium Perchlorate 47.2

Parlon 4.7

Red Gum 14.2

Soluble Glutinous Rice Starch 5.6

----------------

Blue Star #16
Source: rec.pyrotechnics
Parts by weight

Potassium Perchlorate 60

Copper Carbonate 20

Polyvinyl Chloride (PVC) 15

Dextrin 5

---------------

Purple star #4
From Shimizu (FAST), page 216.

Listed under the name "Violet star II"
Parts by weight

Potassium Perchlorate 64.0

Red Gum 9.5

Copper(II) Oxide 5.2

Strontium Carbonate 7.8

Parlon 8.7

Soluble Glutinous Rice Starch 4.8

------------

Yellow Star #5
From Shimizu (FAST), page 215
Parts by weight

Potassium Perchlorate 68

Red Gum 18

Lampblack 2

Sodium Nitrate 7

Soluble Glutinous Rice Starch 5

Edited March 11, 2014 by Wiley

[Mumbles]

I might get to this whole post in more detail later, but Dex vs. SGRS doesn't really matter other than personal preference. If you want to pump any of these, I'd go with dextrin personally.

 

The lampblack is for smoothing the burn, and actually makes a difference to me. I generally just use airfloat charcoal though.

 

Parlon vs. PVC probably makes a difference, but I don't really like PVC. It's very staticy and not always very finely ground. I'd go with all parlon personally, and screen out any coarse bits.

[Wiley]

That's good to know about the parlon and airfloat. I intend to cut all of these for use in shells, but I just might make a couple larger pumped comets. Would dextrin be "best" in the sense that it would work for both of these processes?

[psyco_1322]

That's good to know about the parlon and airfloat. I intend to cut all of these for use in shells, but I just might make a couple larger pumped comets. Would dextrin be "best" in the sense that it would work for both of these processes?

 

Dextrin will be fine for any form of star really, it's probably the most versatile binder and can be subbed in for SGRS. I'd also say to just avoid buying PVC, if you have a formula that calls for it, you can sub in Parlon or Saran.

 

Most water bound color comps burn rather slow to start with, so it's not hard to get the burn times you want.

[Wiley]

Cool. I think I may be ordering some "real chems" quite soon. Thanks for all of your input

[Bobosan]

Can the organic formulas in the OP be safely ball milled?

Edited March 12, 2014 by Bobosan

[nater]

I would not ball mill them or anything other than BP or individual chems.

[Wiley]

Besides, when you can just screen mix them, why wear out your ball mill on it? Aside from the safety issues of course. Anything with perc in it is going to be WAY more sensitive than a BP composition.

[Bobosan]

Just curious. I am milling my component chems seperately but still seem to get small hard granules when I screen the mixed comp. Think Nater posted on another thread where he just tossed the small amounts that won't go through screening and it seems that minor differences in chem percentages will not be an issue. Better yet is to screen the individual chems before mixing and quit trying to take shortcuts.

 

I have trashed the thoughts of ball milling anything besides BP and chalked it up to an early morning brain fart.

[Mumbles]

The two big culprits for that are using parlon and red gum. Parlon contains coarse material that's still parlon. Red gum, at least of lower quality, has sand, dirt, and bark that is usually somewhat coarse. Largely this stuff from both materials doesn't really get ground all that well in a ball mill anyway. I just screen out this stuff since it's garbage anyway. I'd rather get rid of it than crush it up and include it in my stars.

[Bobosan]

The small white and blackish colored granules is consistent with what you are saying, Mumbles. I'm working with Shimizu blue and it has the parlon and red gum.

Edited March 12, 2014 by Bobosan

[nater]

I think it was Mark who posted it, but I do the same thing.

[marks265]

Yep, I had mentioned something about chunk tossing. I screen everything through a fine screen once to remove the chunks and to break down any clumping (this is a good time to toss the chunks! hehe). Then I screen everything 3-4 times mixing the comp by pouring it from one pail to another after each screening. I never mill star comps either. If the chems are fine enough to begin with, which they should be, then milling is unnecessary. I would go nuts trying to figure out what all went through the mill previously and if I should clean it or not, or if I should risk it or not....

 

When I make my break and lift powder it sometimes gets to be hilarious because of all the bugs, seeds, hay, or grass I find in it from laying out all day drying. I ignore the smaller stuff and remove the straw or anything else that is sizable when I pack up for the day. I screen that out when I grade the powder to size at a later date.

[Bobosan]

Yes, it was Mark who tossed his chunks first.

 

Back to the OP as I didn't intend to hijack the thread.

 

Wiley, you have the blue formula from rec.pyrotechnics listed and all others are Shimizu's. Why did you choose not to use a Shimizu blue?

[Wiley]

Yes, I noticed that yesterday. That whole list was cut and pasted from a skylighter promotional email, and I assumed that they were all Shimizu. I did find the formula for one of his blues though. Very similar to the other formulas

[Bobosan]

Yes it is. This is Shimizu blue from another Skylighter article.

 

Potassium Perchlorate - .61

Copper Carbonate - .12

Parlon - .13

Red Gum - .09

Dextrin - .05

 

He really likes that red gum!

[Wiley]

Just an aside, but I intend to order all of my chems from Pastime Pyro Chemicals. However, the shipping estimator told me that it would cost $28 to ship 9 lb. worth of chems to eastern WA. Is that normal? I know Hobby Chemical supply "only" charges $20 to ship 9 lb. to the same zip code.

 

More on topic: Would a standard greenmix prime work to light these formulas reliably, or should a step prime be used (intermediate layer of 50:50 greenmix:star comp)?

Edited March 14, 2014 by Wiley

[psyco_1322]

Just an aside, but I intend to order all of my chems from Pastime Pyro Chemicals. However, the shipping estimator told me that it would cost $28 to ship 9 lb. worth of chems to eastern WA. Is that normal? I know Hobby Chemical supply "only" charges $20 to ship 9 lb. to the same zip code.

 

More on topic: Would a standard greenmix prime work to light these formulas reliably, or should a step prime be used (intermediate layer of 50:50 greenmix:star comp)?

 

You should just invest in some stuff to make fence post prime, it will save you headaches in the future. A pound of silicon and a pound of diatomaceous earth will go a long way.

[Shadowcat1969]

The Monocapa Prime from the translated Spanish PDF works very well too:

 

Potassium Perchlorate: 24.6

Potassium Nitrate: 31.1

Airfloat Charcoal (hot liike Willow or Paulownia): 11.5

Red Gum: 4.1

Sulfur: 4.9

Iron Oxide, Black: 7.4

Magnalium 230 mesh, or Dark Aluminum: 12.3

Dextrin: 4.1

 

I have been spritzing my rolled Perchlorate stars with a 10% Dextrin solution then dunking them into some of this loose prime, until the stars won't pick up any more. Usually results in a pretty thin layer of prime, but it has lit everything I've tried it on without any step priming.

[FlaMtnBkr]

If you want some of the best red and green around, check out the rubber stars on Skylighters website. The ones that use strontium and barium nitrate. You won't be disappointed with them. They use acetone and the parlon to bind them. They dry fast and when dry are literally like pieces of plastic. You can dunk them in water, dry them off, and they burn like normal. You can also get some hardware cloth to make screens to slice them if you don't want to splurge on the expensive stainless screens.

 

I wish I knew about the formulas back when I first started trying to make colors. Green can be especially hard to get a good color. I think it was harder than blue when I first started. At least for me.

 

Also, many don't like a sodium yellow. A combination of red and green can give more of a lemon color and also a nice orange in the right proportions.

 

Just another opinion. We all have to experiment to see what we like best as well as the methods we like to make them.

[TYRONEEZEKIEL]

The Monocapa Prime from the translated Spanish PDF works very well too:

 

Potassium Perchlorate: 24.6

Potassium Nitrate: 31.1

Airfloat Charcoal (hot liike Willow or Paulownia): 11.5

Red Gum: 4.1

Sulfur: 4.9

Iron Oxide, Black: 7.4

Magnalium 230 mesh, or Dark Aluminum: 12.3

Dextrin: 4.1

 

 

 

 

The quote option wasnt working for some reason. This is the prime that ned gorski uses exclusively for K perchlorate stars now apparently. I'm definitely giving this a shot after I use all my current prime

[Shadowcat1969]

This is the prime that ned gorski uses exclusively for K perchlorate stars now apparently. I'm definitely giving this a shot after I use all my current prime

 

Yes, his comments about it were why I tried it. I had been having sporadic results even step priming with hot prime and BP on my KPerc stars, but this stuff is GREAT! I haven't had a failure with it yet, although I haven't been using it very long yet. It seems to take fire as easily as a rough BP coating and it burns quick and hot to ignite what it's on.