Flash Powder not giving any loud report.

[Randomguytom]

Hey Everyone.

I'm having a few problems trying to make some small flash bangs. My first actual "pyrotechnic".
I made 2 test powders. One was made Using BaNO3, Al and S (4/2/1) and the other KNO3, S and Al (5/3/2).

I used half of a toilet room with tape on the bottom and pressed bentonite clay in the bottem, pressed a good amount of the flash powder in the tube and then bentonite again on the top, pressed down. I used a party sparkler as the fuse and put generous ammounts of duct tape around the whole construction.

When I lit it, it did not give me any loud report, it just acted as a large, rather spectacular fountain. As amazing as it was, it was not the end result I was hoping for.

Thanks in advance.

[sparky]

you should prob stop messing with flash powder before you get hurt flash should not be pressed and if you done any homework you would know that it needs to be loose and fluffy, seriously you should do alot of reading before messing with something that can delimb you or even death,

[LambentPyro]

Make sure you are using a fine Aluminum powder. Is the BaNO3 a fine powder, and if so, is it clumped up? Ba and Sr Nitrates are pretty hygroscopic compared to other chemicals we use.

 

What I should say/ask instead, is how are you mixing this? Pressing flash in the first place is a huge risk alone. Honestly, I think it'd work better unpressed to begin with. Pressing makes a propellant based device, so that's why you probably got the fountain effect.

Edited January 10, 2014 by LambentPyro

[Randomguytom]

you should prob stop messing with flash powder before you get hurt flash should not be pressed and if you done any homework you would know that it needs to be loose and fluffy, seriously you should do alot of reading before messing with something that can delimb you or even death,

With the amounts I'm working with, It is nearly impossible for me to lose my life. I'm not stupid. I know its not safe! None of it is. Do you think danger has stopped people from doing things in the past?

 

I do thank you for your imput though.

[Randomguytom]

Make sure you are using a fine Aluminum powder. Is the BaNO3 a fine powder, and if so, is it clumped up? Ba and Sr Nitrates are pretty hygroscopic compared to other chemicals we use.

 

What I should say/ask instead, is how are you mixing this? Pressing flash in the first place is a huge risk alone. Honestly, I think it'd work better unpressed to begin with. Pressing makes a propellant based device, so that's why you probably got the fountain effect.

I all ways thought you pressed it so the particles were close together. I am just mixing in a container with a teaspoon and softly swirl it and shake it. Any better methods? I am using 400 mesh Al, not sure on the micron. I crushed up the BaNO3 in a mortor and pestel before hand and the KNO3 was all ready a very fine grain. Could it be an issue with my confinement?

 

Thanks for the help.

[MrB]

In the world of pyrotechnics...

Nothing that is meant to go "boom" should ever be pressed.

 

And for gods sake. Playing around with flash, not knowing what your doing, is a great way to get your self killed. Quit. Now.

Learn shit, and then start over. We'll help by answering (most) questions.

 

B!

Edited January 10, 2014 by MrB

[Maserface]

In the world of pyrotechnics...

Nothing that is meant to go "boom" should ever be pressed.

 

And for gods sake. Playing around with flash, not knowing what your doing, is a great way to get your self killed. Quit. Now.

Learn shit, and then start over. We'll help by answering (most) questions.

 

B!

 

 

slight nitpick, many things that we commonly press WILL go boom if not pressed, BP, whistle, flash. In fact in the PGI anthology there is a rocket propellant that is literally, flash powder.

 

As for the kewl guy OP, duct tape, sparkler, and first post being about "flash bangs", my best advice is to take a walk around the internet, do some research, there is so much solid information to be had, hell, even an hour on APC and you should learn a few things that could save your life. As expressed by MrB, we will (usually) be happy to answer questions you have.

[LambentPyro]

If you're starting out in Pyro with Flash Powder, you need to take a step back, hell a 100 steps back. Read a couple Skylighter articles, and to begin, get some BP chems and just make a batch, get a feel for what Pyro is about rather than just making 'bangs.'

 

Even if you do not want to invest in a ball mill, make some BP, there are many methods you can achieve good quality BP without a mill. I and many intelligent others on this forum did not begin pyro with making flash, we began with research, patience, and comprehension, and to be honest, we will always be on that level, trying new methods, and learning about the success from the experience of others.

Edited January 10, 2014 by LambentPyro

[Zumber]

Ba and Sr Nitrates are pretty hygroscopic compared to other chemicals we use.

 

Barium Nitrate is not hygroscopic.

[LambentPyro]

Barium Nitrate is not hygroscopic.

I've milled Barium Nitrate many times, and it has always clumped back up on me. Even stored with a silica gel packet. You must have ACA in yours, because every lb. of BaNO3 I have bought has always given me the issue. Not as bad as SrNO3, but the problem is still there.

 

For those who have FMC brand Barium Nitrate, have you encountered the issue?

Edited January 10, 2014 by LambentPyro

[Randomguytom]

Thank you all for the help! I do apprieciate it and if you think I should make Flash then I guess I won't

Sorry for my newbieness, it may seem like I haven't done research but I have (sorta). Is there any good channels on Youtube that show you how to make simple "safe" pyrotechnics?

[ddewees]

*popcorn*

[Zumber]

Thank you all for the help! I do apprieciate it and if you think I should make Flash then I guess I won't

Sorry for my newbieness, it may seem like I haven't done research but I have (sorta). Is there any good channels on Youtube that show you how to make simple "safe" pyrotechnics?

buy some books......

[nater]

I've milled Barium Nitrate many times, and it has always clumped back up on me. Even stored with a silica gel packet. You must have ACA in yours, because every lb. of BaNO3 I have bought has always given me the issue. Not as bad as SrNO3, but the problem is still there.

 

For those who have FMC brand Barium Nitrate, have you encountered the issue?

 

Many ball milled powders will amalgamate under its on weight. This clumping has nothing to do with moisture and it is common with the nitrates we use. Once milled, if it clumps up again it is easy to break apart by screening.

[Maserface]

I've milled Barium Nitrate many times, and it has always clumped back up on me. Even stored with a silica gel packet. You must have ACA in yours, because every lb. of BaNO3 I have bought has always given me the issue. Not as bad as SrNO3, but the problem is still there.

 

For those who have FMC brand Barium Nitrate, have you encountered the issue?

 

Do you have issues with kclo3 or kn03?

[MrB]

slight nitpick, many things that we commonly press WILL go boom if not pressed, BP, whistle, flash. In fact in the PGI anthology there is a rocket propellant that is literally, flash powder.

 

Thats my point. If it's to go "boom" it isn't supposed to be pressed, and if it's supposed to be a fountain, rocket, what ever, it should be pressed. Starting out pressing, or even ramming a flash fountain just shows a basic lack of understanding, at a level that can, and probably will get you killed. Hell. Last night i saw a video clip someone linked, where they light of a "ground salute" supposedly made of 1.2kg flash.Superman him self would have a hard time surviving that.

 

Is there any good channels on Youtube that show you how to make simple "safe" pyrotechnics?

 

Youtube isn't really a good source of information. On this topic you will have to read stuff. I'd suggest starting ut here, since you already found your way here. And from here take what keywords you learnt, and google them. If you turn up conflicting information, or find something confusing, ask. In fact, for a while, even if you think you got it right, ask anyway. Saves us from reading about you getting killed in some newspaper.

B!

[Randomguytom]

 

Thats my point. If it's to go "boom" it isn't supposed to be pressed, and if it's supposed to be a fountain, rocket, what ever, it should be pressed. Starting out pressing, or even ramming a flash fountain just shows a basic lack of understanding, at a level that can, and probably will get you killed. Hell. Last night i saw a video clip someone linked, where they light of a "ground salute" supposedly made of 1.2kg flash.Superman him self would have a hard time surviving that.

 

 

Youtube isn't really a good source of information. On this topic you will have to read stuff. I'd suggest starting ut here, since you already found your way here. And from here take what keywords you learnt, and google them. If you turn up conflicting information, or find something confusing, ask. In fact, for a while, even if you think you got it right, ask anyway. Saves us from reading about you getting killed in some newspaper.

B!

Apprieciate it!

[LambentPyro]

If you do not want to read books and all, try subscribing to Fireworking.com, Ned Gorski has tons of tutorials you can use that will get you started off safely and effectively.

 

Do you have issues with kclo3 or kn03?

None at all, because they're different brands. My KNO3 is Haifa that was hammer milled, and my KClO3 is a Swedish brand. Edited January 10, 2014 by LambentPyro

[Maserface]

If you do not want to read books and all, try subscribing to Fireworking.com, Ned Gorski has tons of tutorials you can use that will get you started off safely and effectively.

 

None at all, because they're different brands. My KNO3 is Haifa that was hammer milled, and my KClO3 is a Swedish brand.

I ask because kcl03 has a similar solubility to ban03, and kn03 is a bit more soluble. My bano3 clumps but I don't think it's a matter of moisture

[CannonBall]

Well, when i mill my nitrates sometimes it turns into rock and sometimes fine dust, i don't know why though. And the aluminum you used in your flash, Randomguytom, was way too coarse, i suggest you make/buy a ball mill and make something nicer than just a big bang. I've seen multiple videos where people loose their fingers and hands while playing with flash powder.

And if you still want to make FP firecrackers you better go to YT and search " How to make a polumna firework " to give you the basic idea on how to make them.

When making a FP firecracker you want to have the powder fluffy inside the container.

A saw that you use KNO3/Al/S flash, i use it too but i make it 5/3/2 instead of 5/2/3.

It only takes 0.2 grams of this flash to rip apart a beer can so please be careful with it.

[dan999ification]

Popcorn.

 

Please don't make flash, if you think that a toilet roll tube half or full is not enough to kill you you seriously need to do some reading on it first.

 

If you can't get it to report you should not be making it, you obviously don't understand what you are doing.

Not tying to be an arse just that you may live to regret starting with bangs for many reasons.

 

Dan.

[LambentPyro]

And if you still want to make FP firecrackers you better go to YT and search " How to make a polumna firework " to give you the basic idea on how to make them.

When making a FP firecracker you want to have the powder fluffy inside the container.

A saw that you use KNO3/Al/S flash, i use it too but i make it 5/3/2 instead of 5/2/3.

It only takes 0.2 grams of this flash to rip apart a beer can so please be careful with it.

This is terrible advice. There is no other advice to give rather than to take the damn time to learn and research about Pyro and make simple comps and then begin to work your way up gradually. Suggesting that if someone still wants to make Flash, they can search it on YouTube and learn that way has no other words to describe it, but absolutely retarded.

 

If you come to pyro just for bangs, you're an absolute and utter moron. You pose a threat to yourself, property, and others around you, no question about it.

Edited January 10, 2014 by LambentPyro

[schroedinger]

Hey

If you really wan't to get started, the first thing will be to read about it.

For the first beginning the best would be to get the book F.A.S.T. from Takeo Shimizu (Print or even available online). This book gives you the best base and understanding you could get. It really covers all the basics (and a lot more). Specially really carefull read the safety part, and why some things are done, the way they are done. I know this sounds really odd, but it isn't. Better spend a couple hours of your time, then spending a finger or more.

 

Then have a look at the skylighter plans, turbo pyro and the projekt book from skylighter.

Have a god look at the tutorial section of this forum and the rest too.

 

As sonn as you think you understood the basics, you are at the point where you should really start asking questions, but pls use the search first. Everyone will be happy to give you some advice, specially if they think that you are serious about this.

If you got early questions, where you are not sure if it is right to post em in a public topic, look around who is doing things in that direction and pm them, but again first do you own search.

 

Youtube is really a perfect source for informations, but atthe same time the most awfull source too. You really need to learn the basics first, to be able to determine yourself if a movie 7s good or crap. Some channels really containing goodjnformations for a beginner to advanched (so i would say after readibg the shimizu book) are e.G. the skylighter movie channel, displayfireworks 1, vh718, nighthawkinlight or handmadefireworks. (We reallyshould have a stiky with all these things in the newby section)

[mx5kevin]

Several mistakes have been made here the first is the choice of raw material. With Ba(NO3)2, or KNO3, magnesium is the right choice. Nitrates are not very strong with aluminum, but with magnesium they are drastically stronger than with the best dark aluminum. Addition of 10% sulfur is highly recommended. And minimum 400 mesh fine magnesium required or much more finer to get it work. The magnesium powder must be coated with 5% linseed oil and completely dried to get a hard strength coating (this is more than a week drying). Without this the composition will be unstable and the degradation will be fast!

 

The second big problem the toilet roll tube, here a thick, high-quality, strong, rigid paper tube need. Homemade are the best.

 

What is very important is that the oxidizer and other ingredients must be dry and very fine. I heat it up the oxidizer before grinding to get it free from moisture. If don't have a ball mill, it's worth pre-refining a larger portion in a poppy seed grinder several times, than before use in a mortar and pestle grind again. What is also important is that the ingredients must be mixed together safely but completely homogeneously.

 

The problem already occurred during the selection of the raw material. It's not just that aluminum was chosen for the nitrate, but that it is most likely aluminum of an inadequate fineness. Have to pay close attention to the fineness of the metal powder required for the composition for the purpose. Such problems can also arise from misinformation, not only from the fact that someone has not acquired enough professional knowledge. Not many people talk about the differences between magnesium and aluminum powder with nitrates for flash powder. They don't tell you that important fact 0.2g a KNO3/Al/S will never give any report, but with 0.2g KNO3/Mg/S will does in a paper tube. And if they were used KNO3/Al/S for report it only worked with larger amounts. And that the difference in power between the two, regardless of quantity, is drastic.

 

Need reliable timing which does not go out during combustion, it doesn't burn up too fast unwanted way (even starting the product immediately). And the burning time can be precisely calculated. Visco fuse with 1cm/s burning rate are fine. If available it, possible to buy some way it is essential. Black match and homemade fuses are untrusted.

 

The flash powder must be loosely textured filled in the paper tube without any compression. It must be sifted through a sieve before loading to get a lose texture. If it is not made at the same time, it must be mixed because the burning rate a little bit is always different. Must be avoided for the powder to be denser at one point of the tube, or the burning speed to be different.

Edited August 21, 2022 by mx5kevin

[Richtee]

I fail to see the need to reply to this post. And I thought Vitamin F was under the HE heading?