Thermite

[Tetrahyd]

So I've read up that this particular substance is able to burn through iron, or rather melt it, but ive only seen it placed on some sort of surface (metal pan). Is their anyway of keeping it in some sort of container and still have the same effect. I have this shed outback that is chained up, lost the key awhile back and I'd like to get creative with removing the chain, is this possible ?

[Shizznt]

Yes, it probably is, but it might burn part of your shed as well. Be careful because a thermite burns very hot and it is used for melting metal. Have fun getting the chain off.

[Shadowcat1969]

If the shed is wood, I would not use thermite anywhere near it, you would likely end up with a fire.

 

If it is metal, you probably could arrange to do this, but will risk holes or melted parts of the shed, and damage to whatever is inside.

 

If there is anything remotely flammable or under pressurs (gas cans, spary paint, etc) inside the shed I'd say probably not to try it.

 

I don't want to come off as negative, but I think there are plenty of things to consider with this one. I'd definitely urge experimentation with thermite in a safe way before trying something like this.

[hindsight]

Hacksaw. Boltcutter.

Wanna get creative-- Liquid Nitrogen and a hammer.

[Mumbles]

Anyone who claims that thermite will burn through significant amounts of metal, or through an engine, etc. has almost certainly never actually used thermite. It can burn through thin metal sheet, but I suspect that is mostly due to the metal melting or softening and being ruptured by the mass of molten iron on top of it. It would probably have a better chance to burn through something relatively low melting like aluminum rather than steel. Over a pound of thermite failed to burn through a cast iron skillet. It did end up cracking it and leaking out, but the amount of "burn through" couldn't have been more than 1/16" I'd guess.

 

I know it's way less fun, but mechanical tools probably will be your best bet.

[Jonathan]

I'd suggest an old, retired army intelligence agent (collection or counter-intelligence). He'd know how to pick your lock.

Edited October 16, 2013 by Jonathan

[Tetrahyd]

Thanks for the tips fellas, do you guys know if it'd be possible to synthesize liquid nitrogen with some homemade chemicals or would I have to go shopping ?

[hindsight]

I'd suggest an old, retired army intelligence agent (collection or counter-intelligence). He'd know how to pick your lock.

 

He would know that shooting a lock off is dangerous and ineffective.

 

 

 

 

 

Someone who served as an officer 1970-72 and received his country's Army Commendation Medal but knows little about current intelligence techniques, Jonathan?

Edited October 17, 2013 by hindsight

[hindsight]

Thanks for the tips fellas, do you guys know if it'd be possible to synthesize liquid nitrogen with some homemade chemicals or would I have to go shopping ?

Tetrahyd--Nitrogen, like oxygen, can be obtained from air by differential distillation. It is made liquid by increasing pressure on it, while removing the heat caused by compression of the gas. It isn't synthesized per se but is obtained by physical means, unless things have changed in the last few years.

 

There are internet sites which tell you how to "make liquid nitrogen" but they use dry ice (CO2) with a boiling point of -78.5 C to make liquid nitrogen which has a boiling point of -196 C. Clearly bogus kitchen chemistry.

Edited October 17, 2013 by hindsight

[mike_au]

One principle that has served me well when working with pyro (and lots of other things) is "Use the right tool for the job". In pyro it could easily save you from some rather nasty accidents.

 

The right tool for this job is a pair of bolt cutters.

[hindsight]

One principle that has served me well when working with pyro (and lots of other things) is "Use the right tool for the job". In pyro it could easily save you from some rather nasty accidents.

 

The right tool for this job is a pair of bolt cutters.

Yes, Mike, that is one of my favorite aphorisms.

In construction, the rule that usually gets followed is, "Everything is a hammer, except a screwdriver, and that's a chisel."

 

Then in the world of repair it's, "If you can't fix it, get a bigger hammer."

[Pyro1]

Even 1000 pounds of the stuff didnt get the job done

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIpa1K51os4

 

 

Paul.

[Jonathan]

Another approach, which requires some protective gear to be completely safe, is to locate the weakest-looking part of the chain and drip sulfuric acid on it. If the chain is made out of a metal that corrodes, the acid will eat away a portion of the weak section in fairly short order.

[schroedinger]

Well thermite would work, but still won`t recommend it, the amounts you would need are just not reasonable.A flowerpot can hold the mixture.

Also you would get holes around, before the chain is through.

 

Mumbles i allready saw thermite cutting through an engine, it works perfectly, as long as you take the right amount.

 

Be creative, get some liquid nitrogen and a banana, freeze both and brake the chain using the banana as a hammer.

 

You would need to spent a couple hundred bucks to make liquid nitrogen at home, so buying it is much cheaper

[hindsight]

Well thermite would work, but still won`t recommend it, the amounts you would need are just not reasonable.A flowerpot can hold the mixture. Also you would get holes around, before the chain is through. Mumbles i allready saw thermite cutting through an engine, it works perfectly, as long as you take the right amount. Be creative, get some liquid nitrogen and a banana, freeze both and brake the chain using the banana as a hammer. You would need to spent a couple hundred bucks to make liquid nitrogen at home, so buying it is much cheaper

Hallo, schroedinger! Guess that's what you'd call a "banana split". If you know how to make genuine liquid nitrogen at home for a couple hundred €s, please PM me (Englisch/Deutsch).

[hindsight]

Schroedinger sent me a link for making liquid nitrogen at home fairly cheaply. Would never have believed it.

[gasbag]

I've got some queries regarding Thermite....

 

Can Thermite be made with Aluminium + Iron (III) Oxide, as well as Aluminium + Iron (II) Oxide, or is only one type of Iron Oxide suitable? If adding Aluminium and Sulfur to make ignition easier, what's the percentage of Al + S (not just Sulfur on it's own) required as part of the Iron Oxide + Aluminium thermite mix?

Edited November 10, 2013 by gasbag

[Seymour]

I have no experience with with adding sulfur to thermite.

 

You can use a vast variety of oxides with Aluminium to make different thermites. They all have different properties. Using different particle sizes has a significant effect too.

 

In my experience Fe3O4 is the best for producing liquid Iron and melting through things. The red oxide tends to produce a flare and next to no pooling of liquid metal.

[gasbag]

I have no experience with with adding sulfur to thermite.

 

You can use a vast variety of oxides with Aluminium to make different thermites. They all have different properties. Using different particle sizes has a significant effect too.

 

In my experience Fe3O4 is the best for producing liquid Iron and melting through things. The red oxide tends to produce a flare and next to no pooling of liquid metal.

Thanks for your reply.

Unless I'm mistaken....

Iron(II) Oxide = FeO

Iron(III) Oxide = Fe2O3

 

But Fe3O4....?

[Seymour]

As far as I am aware the common "Black" Iron oxide that is available at pottery suppliers (where I have it from) is made up of both FeO and Fe2O3. As such it is Iron (II,III) oxide. Correctly FeO.Fe2O3, commonly referred to as Fe3O4 for simplicity. There are a whole bunch of distinct "Iron oxides" (sixteen I think). At least for me, I can easily obtain Red (Fe2O3), Black (FeO.Fe2O3) and Yellow (Fe(OH).H2O)

 

Red I use for glitters, Black for thermite, when I make it, and yellow I use as a decoration on my shelf, though it is said to be an excellent catalyst in sugar propellant.

[gasbag]

As far as I am aware the common "Black" Iron oxide that is available at pottery suppliers (where I have it from) is made up of both FeO and Fe2O3. As such it is Iron (II,III) oxide. Correctly FeO.Fe2O3, commonly referred to as Fe3O4 for simplicity. There are a whole bunch of distinct "Iron oxides" (sixteen I think). At least for me, I can easily obtain Red (Fe2O3), Black (FeO.Fe2O3) and Yellow (Fe(OH).H2O)

 

Red I use for glitters, Black for thermite, when I make it, and yellow I use as a decoration on my shelf, though it is said to be an excellent catalyst in sugar propellant.

 

Where I live, there are colour oxides available as pigments for cement - black, red, yellow, and an assortment of other versions.

From what you've said, I'm guessing that the black powder is Fe3O4?

[Mumbles]

Both iron (II) oxide, and iron (II,III,III) oxide are black. The second one, Fe3O4, is sometimes more commonly called magnetite, and is probably what they're selling. It's a fairly abundant mineral. You can tell iron(II) oxide and magnetite apart, because magnetite, as the name may suggest, is magnetic.

[gasbag]

Both iron (II) oxide, and iron (II,III,III) oxide are black. The second one, Fe3O4, is sometimes more commonly called magnetite, and is probably what they're selling. It's a fairly abundant mineral. You can tell iron(II) oxide and magnetite apart, because magnetite, as the name may suggest, is magnetic.

 

The products I'm referring to are oxide pigments for colouring concrete. They're labeled as Oxides, but they don't say what specific sort of Oxides.

[Nessalco]

I've had good luck with the oxide obtained by burning fine steel wool in a forced draft.

 

KO

[MWJ]

I have read that Dextrin should be added to mixed thermite. Should I use it and if so how much per Lb of thermite. I also read different mixes of Iron Oxide and Alum. powder to use. What perpotions do you people use?

 

Thanks