cocktail76 Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 I live in a urban area and I can’t safely make black powder using a ball mill. Does any one have suggestion for what to use for lift powder? Black Powder made by the alcohol precipitation method or some kind of whistle mix?
weknowpyro Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 Well if you can't make blackpowder safetly in your area, then whistle mix is off the list as this is more dangerous than blackpowder.I don't have to many solutions but making bp the cia method like u said will work or maybe making ammonpulver (im not quite sure thats the name correct me if im wrong) which contains NH4NO3 and then i believe you add charcoal and soak the mix in methlated spirt and dry it. But like i said i am only giving suggestions i have never myself attually made ammopluver so you may need to read up about it.You may want to also look up the ball mill bunker thread in the safety section.
itwasntme Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 Benzolift. Whistle mix that's cut with green mix BP. Do a search on it. Forgot to say, I mill my charcoal and sulfur together then shake in the KNO3 and it makes okay lift, never lifted anything larger than a 1/4 star from a star gun though. Put the ball mill in a tote, it takes away all most all of the noise.
DeAdFX Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 Hey don't forget golden powder All golden powder requires is KNO3/Ascorbic acid and a little elbow grease to pulverise the clumps. More information on golden powder can be found in the pyrotechnic compisition side of this forum.
Von Bass` Posted December 30, 2006 Posted December 30, 2006 I live in a urban area and I can’t safely make black powder using a ball mill. Does any one have suggestion for what to use for lift powder? Black Powder made by the alcohol precipitation method or some kind of whistle mix?Is it becuase you are afraid of the ball mill being too noisy? Or is it that you are afraid of an accidental ignition when creating the gunpowder? I think you will find it a lot easier, cheaper and safer in the long run if you get a ball mill going and can make nice safe* lift powder. *In comparrison to benzolift, golden powder or flash powder cut gun powder, lift powder is safer I think.
cocktail76 Posted January 2, 2007 Author Posted January 2, 2007 Is it becuase you are afraid of the ball mill being too noisy? Or is it that you are afraid of an accidental ignition when creating the gunpowder? I think you will find it a lot easier, cheaper and safer in the long run if you get a ball mill going and can make nice safe* lift powder. *In comparrison to benzolift, golden powder or flash powder cut gun powder, lift powder is safer I think.I'm woried about runing a ball mill safley not the noise. What would be the safest way to run a ball mill? Percentage of water, 1/2 full 3/4 full?
DeAdFX Posted January 2, 2007 Posted January 2, 2007 If you use that much water then your potassium nitrate will dissolve in the water and you will end up just milling your charcoal and sulfur.
Mumbles Posted January 3, 2007 Posted January 3, 2007 Actually it'd be worse than that. You'd just make a paste and it'd probably stick to the sides while the balls rolled around. I give it maybe a spray or two of water. It'd be maybe 0.5% if that. As long as you use lead or another completely non-sparking media, you'll be fine. Put it into a wooden box if you're uncomfortable. The most efficient loading of a mill is 1/4 full of material to be ground and 1/2 full of media. More or less material doesn't make it any safer or more dangerous.
ns4life Posted April 28, 2007 Posted April 28, 2007 As long as you use lead or another completely non-sparking media, you'll be fine. Put it into a wooden box if you're uncomfortable I have two homes, one in a relatively dense urban area and one in a rural area. When I mill BP at the urban home, I have an old locking stand up freezer that I converted into a pseudo magazine. I drilled a ½ inch hole in the side and ran conduit into the freezer. I have 3 ball mills one of which I use exclusively for milling. Traditionally I mill about 1lb at a time with the door locked. I came up with using the old freezer as a containment unit after igniting 4lbs of BP inside a locked unit while target shooting in the desert. The locked door bowed and the freezer was deformed but no collateral damage occurred. It’s a cheap way (used inoperable freezer cost me $35) to contain a blast if one were to happen.
al93535 Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 4 lbs of BP inside a sealed freezer and it bowed the door. That is absolute bullshit!If I was in a bad mood I would give a warning for that kind of talk. A freezer is so weak, there is lots of insulation and a thin outter layer. Lets just say (in a fairy type world!) that your 4 lbs of BP WAS contained by the freezer, do you really think it will stop lead balls flying out from a ball mill explosion? No, it wouldn't. Did your 4 lbs of BP come from hand mixing prilled KNO3, BBQ briquettes and dusting sulfer? Thats just so stupid.
Mumbles Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 I seem to remember someone doing a test on that Al. At least simulate a ball mill explosion. The lead balls don't actually fly very far. It was mostly the shrapnel and such from the jarl.
rocket Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 I seem to remember someone doing a test on that Al. At least simulate a ball mill explosion. The lead balls don't actually fly very far. It was mostly the shrapnel and such from the jarl. I also remember reading about that, IIRC it was on passfire on the milling jar article.
ns4life Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 4 lbs of BP inside a sealed freezer and it bowed the door. That is absolute bullshit! Since its ablsolute bullshit, I will find the picture and post it. Before you make comments like that it might be prudent to understand the type of freezer. It was a 1954 Montgomery wards standup. It weighted 700lb and was out of cast iron/steel. The reason it was taken out to the desert to be blown up in the first place is that it was to heavy for any recycling company (at least in my area) to deal with. The locking mechanism was 2 steel clasps that were installed by my brother. Warm me if you wish, but you have were not present during the test so your first hand knowledge is nill. BTW – Who the hell mills 4lbs at a time. An if the did, the balls would not have the velocity of lets say a bullet and would probably piece 1/8 of steel before being rendered harmless.
al93535 Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 Oh you must be right, I forgot that better heavier containment held BP back. Your post is ridiculous.
ns4life Posted April 29, 2007 Posted April 29, 2007 Oh you must be right, I forgot that better heavier containment held BP back. Do you have any proof to disprove the fact that 4ls of goex ffg, will destroy a large steel container? Or is this similar to the fact that a lead ball from a mill will pierce it too? I will stand with my original post. Maybe you should do some Q&A before flaming somebody.
jaruletzu Posted May 9, 2007 Posted May 9, 2007 Until I have obtain a goood BP for lift I used acetoneperoxide with NC laquer 30/70 not good results but in my opinion BP is the best way to lift your shell. Now I search a company who ships in europe . i want to buy smme KCLO4 here in Romania is unavailable.
pa_pyro Posted May 9, 2007 Posted May 9, 2007 TATP with NC laquer. As a general rule high explosive putties are not used in pyrotechnics, or HEs of any kind, except maybe straight NC, laquer or powder.
Pretty green flame Posted May 9, 2007 Posted May 9, 2007 Until I have obtain a goood BP for lift I used acetoneperoxide with NC laquer 30/70 not good results but in my opinion BP is the best way to lift your shell. Now I search a company who ships in europe . i want to buy smme KCLO4 here in Romania is unavailable. You sir a missing a few brain cells if you are trying to lift shells with AP. Stupidity at it's best. Such shame.
Mumbles Posted May 9, 2007 Posted May 9, 2007 Besides being a complete fucking moron, that wouldn't even work that well. AP produces no gas upon decomposition. You got a warning for discussing HE's outside the HE section, and for being a total dumbass. Do yourself a favor and don't experiment with anything until you actually know what you're doing.
mormanman Posted May 11, 2007 Posted May 11, 2007 Well for a ball mill I don't really use a ball mill I use a magic bullet and the down side to it is that you can't keep it running for 15 minutes and if you do the the blade locks up of the rubber gear melts off (both have happened to me it sucks)
deadman Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 Mormanman are using that for mixed comps are just single components? If you are using it for mixed I think you've been warned before and will learn sooner or later. As for just single components I use a coffee grinder and it works well enough. I mainly use it to get prills to powder and filter via window screen into a ball mill.
mormanman Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 Mormanman are using that for mixed comps are just single components? If you are using it for mixed I think you've been warned before and will learn sooner or later. As for just single components I use a coffee grinder and it works well enough. I mainly use it to get prills to powder and filter via window screen into a ball mill.I use it for mixing but not grinding and yes I have been warned but I will invest in a coffeegrinder of somesort. I tried to make a ball mill but it sucks badly it won't grinder any thing .I know some one that has an old wheat grinder thats broken that I want to fix it. So would that work I think it would? And I found from thegreenman.me.uk a lifts but have not tried it myself it is: NOTE: The zinc/sulfur mixture is not a very efficient propellant due to its low specific impulse. In addition, the relatively high density of zinc adds much weight to the rocket, further reducing the propellant's effectiveness. Zinc powder..............67.1Sulfur......................32.9 Nitrate/sugar-based propellants .........................../Candy propellant\/Teleflite propellant\Potassium nitrate.../.........74.5........\/...............63........\ Sucrose................./.........25.5........\/...............27........\Sulfur..................../.........0............\/...............10........\
deadman Posted May 13, 2007 Posted May 13, 2007 How can you use it for mixing but not grinding? If you mix anything in it, it is going to grind to a certain degree. A wheat grinder, if it's the same thing as a grain mill, is going to be able to powder your chems, but not substitute for a ball mill. What is wrong with the mill you've built? I'd work on fixing that rather than looking for something that may or may not work. Edit: Since the last few posts are way off topic maybe they should be moved or deleted.
Pyro55 Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 I have been wondering if Pyrodex would work for a lift powder. I searched and could not find if anyone has tried.
superspike23 Posted June 11, 2007 Posted June 11, 2007 with can the risk of saying an absurdity, a mixture of sodium chlorate sugar and sugar make lift powder??
Recommended Posts