llamazares Posted December 27, 2006 Posted December 27, 2006 Look at this picture, I wish to make accurately this effect. It is a curtain of sparks very dense, persistent, golden and shining that fall softly. Please, anybody know any tried composition that make really this effect? Happy Christmas
ewest Posted December 28, 2006 Posted December 28, 2006 I've never made one but it's called a waterfall if I understand you correctly. Basically it's a bunch of fountains in a line hanging upside down. When the fountains go off instead of the sparks going up, they come down and when done in a series like that they give the effect of a waterfall or curtain of sparks.
Mumbles Posted December 28, 2006 Posted December 28, 2006 Those are shells actually. Waterfall shells, but still different that what you describe. Not 100% as to what kind of formula that is. Definatly a metal fuel. I'd say some sort of firefly Al composition, maybe some mixed mesh FeTi. It's hard to tell if the ends look gold because of the smoke, or if it the true color. The tail is too long and uniform for a glitter. I can describe how to make the shell, but not the comp. If you're on passfire, there's one called slow gold that could be something like that. Theres another called willow diadem which may also be appropriate.
llamazares Posted December 28, 2006 Author Posted December 28, 2006 No, this effect isn't waterfall. It is like thousands of threads of golden sparks falling. It is achieved with rounds stars, which composition I don't know.
cplmac Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 That effect is called a "brocade waterfall" and you can get it in a variety of different shell sizes. they are beautiful effects. We had a 130 shot brocade crown waterfall fan cake the last couple of years, simply an amazing effect. No idea on the comp though, try passfire.
deadman Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 I always thought it was called a horsetail shell. I'm not sure on the structure of the shell or stars. But I would guess a canister shell with the break placed at the top to blow the stars out the bottom of the canister. The stars are most likely a FeTi comp, but I also can not tell with the picture. I think D1 may be able to make a nice looking silver one. Possible even reeper silver would work.
Pretty green flame Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 Rec pyro list this formula for a Japanese style brocade Potassium Nitrate 56Potassium Perchlorate 6Hemp charcoal 11Antimony Sulfide 6Bright Aluminum 17Dextrin 4 This could probably be of some help.
Mumbles Posted December 29, 2006 Posted December 29, 2006 Actually, it's just an alteration in spiking pattern. not sure how to do it with ball shells, but I can with cans. You place the bottom half with burst, and the top half with stars. Vertical spike as usual, but horizontally it's different. Spike nearly a solid band of string along the burst section and nothing along the star part. It causes it to burst out the top part. With ball shells, probably just fill half with burst, and the other with stars and pulverone.
cplmac Posted December 30, 2006 Posted December 30, 2006 A brocade waterfall is a lot like a horsetail, in fact I think it may be just a horsetail with brocade stars. Pretty much a horsetail is any shell that breaks to one side/direction rather than outwards in all directions. The sky mine is a similar effect with the shell breading upwards from the center, basically a horsetail pointed up. Although I think sky mines might be built more through timing the break while the shell is still rising. Thank you for the brocade formula PGF! I have really been wanting to roll some brocade stars.
llamazares Posted December 30, 2006 Author Posted December 30, 2006 I am searching in many places (including books as AFN, Shimizu, Lancaster, Rec. pyrotechnics, Valencia -Spain- , Google, UK Rocketry, of course Passfire) and doing numerous tests, but I do not find the wished formula. No. This so beautiful composition must to be published. But where? Someone must to know it ! Alone I cannot. With you, yes: long Life for APC forum and Happy New Year. I continue searching...
cplmac Posted January 2, 2007 Posted January 2, 2007 I made a small batch of your formula PGF, tried an insert with it and then added five percent eighty mesh charcoal. I will try rolling some stars with it tomorrow.
llamazares Posted January 2, 2007 Author Posted January 2, 2007 Ok, cplmac I wait your news/post. (Also green strobe rocket submission /cplmac's red strobe rocket ) Thanks!
llamazares Posted January 4, 2007 Author Posted January 4, 2007 I made a small batch of your formula PGF, tried an insert with it and then added five percent eighty mesh charcoal. I will try rolling some stars with it tomorrow. Greetings from Spain. I have tried the formula PGF looking the effect (picture above). It does not work.
optimus Posted January 4, 2007 Posted January 4, 2007 Greetings from Spain. I have tried the formula PGF looking the effect (picture above). It does not work. What effect did it produce? Saying it did not work isn't very helpfull - how did you test it and what were the results?
cplmac Posted January 5, 2007 Posted January 5, 2007 I fired a 3/8" rolled star with PGF's comp, but it did not ignite. I'm going to give it a small layer of prime and try again after work tomorrow. That stuff is messy, I hate fine flake american bright aluminum.
Frozentech Posted January 5, 2007 Posted January 5, 2007 I fired a 3/8" rolled star with PGF's comp, but it did not ignite. I'm going to give it a small layer of prime and try again after work tomorrow. That stuff is messy, I hate fine flake american bright aluminum. Cplmac, I agree, -325 bright flake is hell to work with, nothing like turning your entire area into an Etch-A-Sketch and looking like the TIn Man from the WIzard of Oz ! The only thing I found that really cleans it up good is SImple Green.
cplmac Posted January 5, 2007 Posted January 5, 2007 The stuff air floats like nothing else too. It not only floats all over the place, it just stays there. I'm not to worried about aluminum, but I will don the respirator on occasion just because there seems to be so damn much of it floating around. Smells like crayons, and smears all over absolutely everything it touches. It's like grey lampblack.
llamazares Posted January 5, 2007 Author Posted January 5, 2007 I fired a 3/8" rolled star with PGF's comp, but it did not ignite. The same thing happens to me. Then I say that does not work... cplmac: if you can ignite the PGF formula, explain/ post one small video, Please! I do not have vídeo camera. Attached video, I believe that siffup comp can be the correct. I need to try it, urgently!
cplmac Posted January 6, 2007 Posted January 6, 2007 Here you go. For the record the stars rolled like crap, and the video didn't roll much better. Looked pretty nice in person, they were very small stars so a little fatter and these would have looked really nice I think. Took a decent coat of BP prime and I put about an ounce of meal in the mine with the stars to get 'em to light. 3" brocade mine, Pretty Green Flames formula
Mumbles Posted January 6, 2007 Posted January 6, 2007 The stars look decent, but less of a tail than I would expect. I would probably try adding some coarser Al. Maybe replace 5 of the 17 parts with medium flitters to make a longer tail. Maybe replace some of the C with 80 mesh, or even 36 mesh in large shells.
cplmac Posted January 6, 2007 Posted January 6, 2007 I think if I make the stars a little bigger the tail will be fatter, probably won't trail any longer though. I would like to get a batch of these done right and adjust from there, this batch just didn't quite go smoothly enough for me to adjust off of. I think I would like to try some charcoal brocades first as the bright flake is such a mother to work with. When I make this again mumbles I will add some coarser al or maybe some of my 100 mesh iron.
llamazares Posted January 8, 2007 Author Posted January 8, 2007 Thank you for your video, Cplmac. Really PGF's formula does not have the wished long tail... It is not persistent; does not leave threads-stele in the sky. Lamentably I do not have vídeo-camera: the break in the ground of one round shell failed, has damaged my video function. Sorry. The composition of siffup (waterfall formula) is very interesting. Certainly beautiful. Try it. Please.
cplmac Posted January 9, 2007 Posted January 9, 2007 I don't have the siffup formula. I would like to try PGF's formula with some 80 mesh charcola and 100 mesh iron first. Like I said earlier, the stars in my mine were very small, and I think larger stars would make a big difference. I'm just having a hard time convincing myself to break out the bright flake american again. Maybe after I get the vetilation system installed.
llamazares Posted January 9, 2007 Author Posted January 9, 2007 I don't have the siffup formula. Go to link: http://www.pyroart.de/trade-video/gf-43-C-351.wmv (siffup Posted: Jan 4 2007, 08:07 PM) brocade horsetail 46% - potassium perchlorate18% - bright aluminum (300-400 mesh)14% - granular aluminum (50-100 mesh)14% - spherical titanium(may change this to coated iron to get a golden tail)8% - dextrin
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