First batch of BP!

[BlastFromThePast]

I'm stoked right now! I just made my first batch of ball milled BP. It is FAST! I only have ONE problem...When I opened up the milling jar, it looked like my powder had disappeared until I realized that much of it was coated on the lead shot. Is this something that normally happens? And if not, how do I prevent this from happening again?

Once I figure out how to get the BP off of the lead I'm going to upload a movie of the BP just for shits and giggles.

[pyrodundee]

Happens to me on occasion, think it may be down to moisture content of chems/charcoal. As you can see from your results, no great effect on the BP. An everyday kitchen stainless sieve works a treat to clean up the media, just gently agitate them and they clean themselves up fine, leaving a lovely pile of fresh BP.

[BlastFromThePast]

Thanks yeah, I realized that the majority of it was caked on the bottom on the jar because I had it sitting upright for 20 mins, so the media was just covering it up

[Bobosan]

Congrats on your first good powder. Did you use Paulownia charcoal?

[BlastFromThePast]

No I used shingles I bought at the hardware store which were pine. I mean, I've made coffee grinder type BP, without sulfur, using balsa and that was pretty quick even though I wasn't using a ball mill but I'm surprised by how fast this pine BP is. I have a feeling this is going to make very good lift and burst hahaha.

[Bobosan]

Your post reminded me of first time I made a good batch of BP. Paulownia should give you even better performance or at least equal to the Balsa. Haven't tried Pine charcoal yet but will soon.

 

Did you use sulfur in this batch or trying to get best sulfurless BP?

Edited April 4, 2013 by Bobosan

[BlastFromThePast]

This was my first batch with sulfur, and i've got to admit, it sure as hell beats sulfurless. I mean, its quicker, easier to light, and brighter, not to mention, a bigger cloud of smoke which would definitely make it more suitable for lift. One thing though, as quick as it might be directly after milling, won't wetting and granulating make it even faster...? Obviously granulation speeds it up as it allows for more flame coverage but shouldn't I expect it to be quicker simply after wetting due to the KNO3 penetrating the microscopic pores of the charcoal?

What's interesting to me is that I honestly only milled it for like an hour and thirty minutes and it's wayyyy faster than anything I've ever made. Probably fast enough. However when I get the video up I guess you guys can tell me if it's fast enough or if I should mill it some more. I just can't imagine it being any faster than it already is...

[Oinikis]

what size lead shots are you using? i use 5mm lead shots, and coffemilled chems, and it get same result. i remember when i bought sulfur for a first time, it made a huge impact. granulating real BP (good charcoal, ballmilled) makes it almost like flash. i used to mill it for 1 hour also, and i was satisfied, becouse that was fast. once tried 4 hours. that was super fast, granulated was like FP. also hot charcoal makes a hube impact.

 

About pushing KNO3 in the pores of charcoal, ballmill forces KNO3 in the pores. wetting might increase the effect, but it won't let the flame travel trought the powder, while it's still burning. so granulate it. for this fast BP it makes a huge impact.

 

this is my 1 hour BP. when i made it i couldn't imagine being faster, but now i make several times faster stuff. try milling it for 3-4 hours.

Edited April 4, 2013 by Oinikis

[dan999ification]

You can leave your mill on forever but if the powder is caking up it is not being milled, just wearing the media.

I used to call it done when it caked and it was very fast but it would cake up in no time and need breaking up often, the solution is to dry the charcoal and kno3 first, it has not clumped since and mills faster powder faster.

It is easily possible to make bp in 90 mins if you put some prep work in first, I used to think 3 hrs was unbelievable.

 

Dan.

[BlastFromThePast]

I'm using 3/8" lead shot. And I coffee milled the chems separately before throwing them in the mill. It definitely helped a lot. Yesterday I went to HF and bought the 6lb mill and when I went to pay for it I tried using a 20% off coupon so it would be $40 instead of $50 but it wouldn't take the coupon because it was apparently already on sale. I stood there for like 2 minutes trying to decide whether or not it was worth it, and now I can say that it definitely was It's awesome being able to make really good BP.

 

edit- also, what's the proper % of dextrin for BP. I thought I read somewhere that it should be around 5% but skylighter says 1%. I could be getting the 5% from other formulas, though..

Edited April 4, 2013 by BlastFromThePast

[Oinikis]

Once I figure out how to get the BP off of the lead I'm going to upload a movie of the BP just for shits and giggles.

i'm curious.

[BlastFromThePast]

i'm curious.

 

I'll go take that movie right now. Keep in mind this is prior to granulation. Give me like 10 minutes

[BlastFromThePast]

Alright here's the link. This is .2grams of 75:15:10 ball milled for 1.5 hours. Non-granulated (yet)

 

 

Can anyone speak to my question regarding what percentage of dextrin should be used for granulating the BP. I also have a whole 1000mL bottle of premixed 75/25 and am wondering approximately how much water/alc you guys use when to wet it. I have a 100g batch I'm trying to granulate and I really don't want to over wet it as it's a pain in the ass having to wait for it to dry when you add too much water and it turns to a slurry.

Edited April 4, 2013 by BlastFromThePast

[Mumbles]

It looks pretty good. You might want to check for residues. I found that my meal didn't appear to increase in speed much at a certain milling point, but the residues continued to go down considerably. One of the tests I like is to burn some of the powder on a piece of white paper. Good meal should leave it barely touched. If the paper chars or starts smouldering, I know it can still benefit from more milling. It's hard to describe how to tell when a batch of meal is done. For me, it's more the sound it makes when it burns, not the actual burn. Mine makes a small pop when it's at optimal "hotness".

 

Keep in mind that if you are stopping milling when it's "hot enough", you will probably run into consistency problems. I prefer to get the maximum out of the mix. That way I know that most batches will be generally the same and can be used identically.

[BlastFromThePast]

Anyone regarding the dextrin percentage?

[Bobosan]

Try using the 1 to 2 % that Skylighter suggests. If the final product isn't hard enough, up the percentage until you're happy with it.

 

You can always remill the granules again and add the extra dextrin to reach 5%.

[BlastFromThePast]

Alright thanks! I was holding off on granulating until I knew for sure.

 

This is completely unrelated to the topic however I need to know for safety reasons and didn't want to start a new thread.I apologize in advanced for this being irrelevant:

 

I have 2 unmarked container (from years ago) and they contain either KClO3 or KClO4 or one of each...Now I don't have sulfuric acid and unfortunately I don't have the money to purchase some, yet I need to know which is which. I know that if you mix chlorate with sulfur and strike it with a hammer it will react, quite violently too. Would it be feasible to do a test in this manner? I'm asking if its possible because I don't know if sulfur + perchlorate will also "detonate". If it doesn't, then this testing method could work. Keep in mind I would be doing this with miniscule amounts of the chems. By miniscule I mean quantities less than half the size of the cursor on your computer screen. So i need to know, would KClO4 + sulfur also deflagrate, making this test meaningless?

Edited April 4, 2013 by BlastFromThePast

[Bobosan]

I'd be wary of these unknown chems and would not try the impact tests you are describing.

 

Mumbles and several others can advise on correct chemical testing.

[BlastFromThePast]

Not trying to disagree with you but I know for certain that it's only KClO3 or KClO4, but I WILL agree that the more I think about it the less I want to do it hahaha Edited April 4, 2013 by BlastFromThePast

[Bobosan]

There is a chemisty forum here on APC where you might want to ask about safely testing to find out which is which.

 

I've found stuff in the past here that I neglected to label and usually threw it out to be on safe side. Fortunately, it was small quantities and I have since broken that bad habit of not labeling things.

[Mumbles]

Unfortunately both potassium chlorate and potassium perchlorate are sensitized by sulfur. The sensitivity is probably too close to differentiate them via just crude impact or friction tests. I'll look for something viable for you.

[BlastFromThePast]

Thanks mumbles

[Risk]

Hello people! I am interested if anyone has tried activated carbon that you find at Pet Stores as aquarium media for the purpose of cleaning the water in your aquarium. I have a salt water reef aquarium and just purchased a new batch of carbon. I am planning on taking a little of the carbon and grinding it down with a mortar and pestle. I plan on using this method with the KNO3 and Sulphur that I've managed to obtain. I have also manged to grab 500gms of Dextrose and would appreciate any help as to how to change this Dextrose into Dextrin. Also if your in Au http://www.auschems.com/catalog/ this guy in Queensland is very efficient and fast transport goes with it. Whilst I'm a newbie to this forum I do have an Ass. Dip. App. Sc. (Wk Sfty & Hlth) I'm also an ex-military Electronics Technician (Communications) so safety is engrained in my DNA so I am quite happy to accept any help available be it that with out a ball mill I intend to grind my chems via mortar and pestle unless using a distilled water solution and a drying out period is a better Manner in which to approach the subject. Cheers for any tips, I am sorry but being a newbie I was unable to start a new thread and had to use a reply to an existing post. Thank you in advance.

[BlastFromThePast]

While I have never tried making charcoal with activated carbon, I know that it does not work well at all, so I would advise you not to waste your KNO3 and sulfur on that. If you're going to be using only a mortar and pestle to process your chems, I'm assuming you're not going to be making huge batches of BP. As far as the charcoal goes, search for "TLUD" in google, this is one way to make it. If you don't feel like putting that much effort into making a TLUD burner than you can simply go with the retort method. If you search for how to make charcoal for pyro on google, most of the results will be the second way I just described which will be way easier. All you need is an airtight metal container (such as a paint can), a means of making a hole in the lid, and a means of heating. A google search will give you step by step instructions.

Regarding the dextrin, you want to go ahead and buy some corn starch, I use Argo but anything relatively pure will work. The corn starch is "converted" to dextrin by heating it at roughly 400 degrees until it becomes a light yellow, golden color. Heres an article describing how to do so LINK.

 

If I may suggest, you don't need to buy a ball mill, and maybe at some point you will find you want one, but one thing that goes a long way is having a coffee grinder. If you do invest in one, make sure you only mill your chemicals separately. Never coffee mill chemicals together. Huge accident waiting to happen.

[Risk]

While I have never tried making charcoal with activated carbon, I know that it does not work well at all, so I would advise you not to waste your KNO3 and sulfur on that. If you're going to be using only a mortar and pestle to process your chems, I'm assuming you're not going to be making huge batches of BP. As far as the charcoal goes, search for "TLUD" in google, this is one way to make it. If you don't feel like putting that much effort into making a TLUD burner than you can simply go with the retort method. If you search for how to make charcoal for pyro on google, most of the results will be the second way I just described which will be way easier. All you need is an airtight metal container (such as a paint can), a means of making a hole in the lid, and a means of heating. A google search will give you step by step instructions.

Regarding the dextrin, you want to go ahead and buy some corn starch, I use Argo but anything relatively pure will work. The corn starch is "converted" to dextrin by heating it at roughly 400 degrees until it becomes a light yellow, golden color. Heres an article describing how to do so LINK.

 

If I may suggest, you don't need to buy a ball mill, and maybe at some point you will find you want one, but one thing that goes a long way is having a coffee grinder. If you do invest in one, make sure you only mill your chemicals separately. Never coffee mill chemicals together. Huge accident waiting to happen.

 

Thank you very much for your reply! It is most appreciated mate. Regarding the charcoal, totally noted and I won't waste my time with the carbon. You are right, I'm not planning on anything other than a fact finding mission "at first'' anyway. So I won't be processing large quantities. I will look out for a suitable coffee grinder. As for grinding each chemical, I was planning. On washing both mortar and pestle between each chem, so will apply same method if I grab a coffee grinder so thank you for reminding me in that. I have watched the YouTube video on how to bake corn starch to create dextrin. Now I have not been able to find corn starch. Being in Au it's hard to find any thing. What I have found is Dextrose. I have a 500g bag of that, and I can get liquid glucose if need be. But all I can find in the shops here is Corn Flour. Now my understanding is that corn flour is created by grinding the whole kernel and corn Starch uses the nucleus (I know it's not the correct word but I'm too tired to search for it lol) of the corn kernel. So my dilemma is this : is Dextrose the same as corn starch ? If not. What is an alternative ? Will I get anywhere if I use Corn Flour? Will I get anywhere using dextrose? Will I get anywhere using multi dextrose ? thank you again for your prompt reply!