Fireworks Accident !

[jaysgoh]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyBjQ_jja3Q

 

happends in my cousin house . mortar tube fall off because of vibrations from other tube .

can anyone help me indentify what is the shells size?

 

this is made in china . . they is the gas tank at the tent

[Jst4LOLz]

That's intense, hopefully no one was seriously hurt.

 

I'm no pro, but I'd say 4in shells by the looks, just a guesstimation ofcourse.

[jaysgoh]

i am 16 , its bigger than my paml size . i mean the size of the shells .

fireworks are illegal in my country

but we still can bought some .

[jaysgoh]

may i ask do those shell contain flash powder ?

[Seymour]

Some definitely look like 4" to me. Others look like 3", but they could just be inferior 4" shells.

 

A lot of them are boosted with Flash powder, so yes. You can tell from the bright flash on the first frame or two after they burst.

 

Other ones I'm not sure. I expect that they are a bit of a mix, as Chinese shells are.

 

Most of the time they are KP type burst, that is, just Potassium perchlorate, Charcoal, a binder and perhaps sulfur.

 

Also quite common is for them to be Black powder burst with a small amount of flash powder added. For a 4" shell, anything from 2g to 6g is appropriate. More and it becomes obscene.

 

I expect that they use other burst charges too. I've seen a few formulas of kind of hybrids, where there is an oxidiser and metals (Magnalium and/or Aluminium) with charcoal, sulfur and a binder. I've dissected 4" shells that definitely had a formula containing both MgAl and charcoal coated on to rice hulls.

 

While I've never heard definite cases of Chinese shells containing other bursts (except perhaps Potassium chlorate burst, often referred to as H3 (ten parts KClO3 to 3 parts hemp charcoal to be exact) even if they do not match that description), they do exist. Potassium perchlorate can be added to various fuels from lampblack to various other reactive organics.

 

Whistle mix used to boost Black powder is also quite popular in the hobby world. In small shells (or Bombettes, inserts, are they really shells? ) up to about 1.5" can be burst with pure whistle or flash.

 

Of course, with decent black powder you can get a decent burst without boosting it. Some of the smaller looking shells in that video could be achieved with just BP burst.

 

If you are going to make aerial shells, black powder alone is what you should use until you are quite competent. It will help you develop the skills needed, and if there is a defect that causes it to malfunction (almost bound to happen when you are developing your technique) it will be much less serious.

Edited February 16, 2013 by Seymour

[jaysgoh]

Thanks for your replied and a good answer

basically , do a pyrotechnician or amature need a FP ( perchlorate and al mix ) ? or just blackpowder should do all the job including star , lift charge , burst charge and time fuse .

i canot get proper item in here . but do u guys think that homemade fuse can be use in shells ? i got no idea how to make a time fuse or delay fuse . as ppl said i am impatients , i am sorry because i need to fire a homemade shells next year during CNY . My Family dont think that i can fire it , so i need to show them .

i dont care about the star or pattern , i just like crysanthemum pattern for me , also easy to make , something like bp , sulfur only ?

please answer me , i will only purchase 1 time in 2 years . i mean chemical

following chemical i need to purchase for pyro or what ( Do You Think Which Should i Get )

 

1. Balsa Charcoal ( HM )

2. Potassium Nitrate ( PURCHASE )

3. Sulfur / Sulphur ( PURCHASE )

4. Potassium Perchlorate ( PURCHASE )

5. Aluminium Powder ( PURCHASE )

 

Currently Holding Item :

1. Potassium Nitrate

2. Powdered Sugar

 

Currently Holding Stars :

1. Crackling Stars 40 pcs *1cm width , 1 cm height*

2. Tiny Stars Break 40 pcs *1mm ball*

5.

[nater]

You do not need flash.

 

Being impatient and working with pyro is a recipe for disaster.

Edited February 16, 2013 by nater

[jaysgoh]

you sure we dont need flash to burst the shells ? i can imagine what if the shells lift up but times fuse going and its not going explode !

[nater]

Yes I am positive you do not need flash to burst a shell. Flash or whistle is often used in tiny amounts to boost the break of BP, but neither one are necessary. I have even seen shells perform well (exactly as they were intended) with no burst, just the prime on the stars. BP is all you need and all you should be working with while you learn.

 

You mention a concern that the time fuse might not light the burst, flash is actually harder to light than BP. So if you pursue this hobby, learn by working with BP and stuff made from BP only. It is cheaper and mistakes are not as dangerous as when you use more energetic material.

[dynomike1]

Looks like time to haul Ass to me.

[Seymour]

basically , do a pyrotechnician or amature need a FP ( perchlorate and al mix ) ?

 

I know English is not your first language, but I've answered this question at least three times with you. NO. YOU DO NOT. It's frustrating. Please, I don't want you to ever ask about flash powder again. By the time you are half way ready to make flash powder you will have read so much that you will have no questions to ask about it.

 

All questions are good questions, and I'm glad you are asking instead of going off and making flash powder, however, hopefully you understand that we are giving you the best answers, even if you may not like it.

 

but do u guys think that homemade fuse can be use in shells ? i got no idea how to make a time fuse or delay fuse .

 

You would know if you had done some research. Yes. Lots of people use them. Search the word "Spollette".

 

as ppl said i am impatients , i am sorry because i need to fire a homemade shells next year during CNY . My Family dont think that i can fire it , so i need to show them .

 

That is no excuse for being impatient. Seriously, there is almost nothing worse that you can do than be impatient when you are starting to experiment with explosives. You have almost a whole year... there is no need to stress about it.

 

I think that if you don't consider getting rid of your impatience the first step towards building fireworks, you will actually take a lot longer to find success, because you will make time consuming mistakes that take even more time to fix, all because you thought you were ready when you were not. Little mistakes mean that all the work involved in making the rest of the firework are all wasted. That might mean that one hour reading cost you six hours building the firework. Six hours building one firework is quite common.

 

You "need to fire a homemade shell" ?

 

NO. You don't.

 

No one needs to. You want to, and that's all there is to it. I fully understand why you want to. Building and firing a successful homemade firework is a truly fantastic feeling, and is one of the ongoing highlights of my life. However your attitude concerns me. I'm worried about you. I don't feel you are listening enough and taking it as seriously as you need to.

 

i dont care about the star or pattern , i just like chrysanthemum pattern for me , also easy to make , something like bp , sulfur only ?

 

I am disappointed that you have so little interest in what the stars are. Hopefully you get more interested in the artistic side of it. Making stars is one of my favorite things in the world. If making a firework is like painting a picture, the burst charge is like the canvas. You need it, but it is the means to an end. The reall effect is from the paint, or the stars.

 

or just blackpowder should do all the job including star , lift charge , burst charge and time fuse .

 

Pretty much. For the Burst, Lift and Timefuse you want decent quality Black powder in the normal ratios. However the stars are a bit different. If you used 75/15/10 to make stars you would have one of the least interesting shells possible, because Black powder is very fast and clean burning, and has minimal effect. However if you increase the charcoal content significantly you can get a good trail of golden sparks, like those you get from stirring up the embers of a fire. This is the basic Chrysanthemum. I suggest you use the formulas Chrysanthemum 8 (C8) or Tigertail.

 

You will also want a binder, for holding Black powder grains together in lift powder, for coating burst on to a carrier, and for binding stars in to strong pellets. While there are many suitable binders, the most common in the hobby world is Dextrin. It can be made easily at home.

 

With Potassium nitrate, Charcoal, Sulfur and Dextrin, you can make every main type of firework. Fountains, Wheels, Rockets, Roman Candles, Starmines, Aerial; shells, Girandolas, firecrackers and the rest.

 

However you can expect to do a few hundred hours of reading to get to a decent level of competency. There is a lot to learn.

 

If you want to add one more chemical that is easy to get and will expand what effects you can do I would get medium size atomised Aluminium. This will expand your effecs to include some White, Silver and Glitter formulas.

 

I suggest you think about charcoal a lot. With Black powder and Potassium nitrate the role it plays is huge. Different types of wood make huge differences. Some burn more than ten times as fast as others. Obviously for some applications, like burst you want it quite fast. However for stars and fountains, spark production, you might want a different type. It might not need to be so fast, and you often use a higher percentage of it. It could be worthwhile to use that lumpwood charcoal you mentioned earlier if it's cheap, but only if it's soft enough to powder without excessive force. It's hard to know because it could be anything.

Edited February 17, 2013 by Seymour

[jaysgoh]

I really want thanks to you and the wonderful answer .

next month i will make a purchase on blackpowder chemical .

thanks for asnwer alll my ques that stuck in my head .

Quote

 

i dont care about the star or pattern , i just like chrysanthemum pattern for me , also easy to make , something like bp , sulfur only ?

Sorry for the limited pattern that i likes , because i can only get crysanthemum chemicals which is bp and ratios only .. with other chemicals . sorry i might not able to get them or what .. although i like the electric white , or plain white is enough for me ..

Thank you guys .. going for bp only !

[taiwanluthiers]

Lump charcoal is great for sparks but don't count on them making safe bp. I said safe because if your burst charge is too weak it means disaster as your shell bursts too low or on the ground, leading to fire or injuries. This also applies to spoolettes as well. It should be easy to obtain paulownia lumber where you are at, and they make fantastic bp.

 

http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%B3%A1%E6%A1%90%E5%B1%9E

Edited February 18, 2013 by taiwanluthiers

[nater]

Strength of the burst does not cause or prevent a low break.

[taiwanluthiers]

I mean lift charges...

[patsroom]

Hopefully, by now gohjiejing you have stated to look up what a spollette is and how it is made. They are simply made, with simple items. Black powder is made with simple chemicals. Once you break each step down you well see that in order to make a 4 inche or even a 12 inche shell that each have certain steps that must be follow one at a time.

But you must beable to make each item correctly or you risk breaking the link to a shell that works.

Start small learn the basics on making the compounds that you need. Black Powder should be mastered first (depends on who you speak with), fuse making (black match, Quick match, spollettes, ect...). Then making stars and using commercial effects to make shells.

Started with something small like a film canister shell then work you way up as you learn the steps needed. It is much cheaper and easier to learn from you mistakes as you move along in this hobby.........Pat

Edited February 18, 2013 by patsroom

[jaysgoh]

guys .. i am sorry that my english are poor and i do not understand Lump charcoal in Pyro dictionary ..

i search up very hard but the ans are still charcoal

[taiwanluthiers]

However you may have to give the OP a little break, his English appears to be limited, and pyro resource in Chinese may be difficult to find because they do not normally share information like Westerners when it comes to craft.

[jaysgoh]

I am chinese but i seldom write chinese or speak chinese , english are my main , but its Malaysian english .