My new homemade tooling and el. launch pad

[Oinikis]

so, i've made a new set of cored rocket tooling. the design i used is by NightHawkinLight (big thanks), used for 60/30/10. i just scaled it down bit.

http://imgur.com/mXpKXGD

then there is a launch pad. that red worm is actualy red hot nichromium wire. i suppose, when i lower the rocket, putting the wire into the nozzle is easyier and cheaper way for launching finned rockets.

http://imgur.com/X1qplb5

tool i used are axe, knife, drill and a peace of sandpaper. material is strong peace of wood, saved from being burned. needs some polishing, but functionates, and thats the main thing i want.

i will try t post a video soon.also, what do you think, how rocket BP fuel and sugar rocket fuel compares? this one is designed for BP, so i guess it could be also used for KNO3/Su fuel? also, have anyone tried to fire a naked roket motor, from a tube, or launcher pad? would it still fly in random directions and kill everything on it's way?

 

Oinikis

Edited February 4, 2013 by Oinikis

[Seymour]

I imagine some sort of coating on the spindle, as well as a slight taper will help with getting it off the rocket, however at the size you are making your rockets you have a lot more tolerance. With larger rockets issues develop in to problems where there were none with smaller ones.

 

While both 60/30/10 are core burning fuels, and KNSU may work with your tooling, Sugar has a lot more power, potentially more than double. Sugar is also, in my experience a lot more fiddly and unreliable in firework type rockets. The steep increase in surface area as the core expands seems to have a much more pronounced effect with sugar than 6/3/1, and I've seen many a sugar rocket with firework like cores have a slow and unsafe lift off. However as I said earlier, smaller rockets have less problems, so perhaps you'll have sugar working perfectly on your tooling first time, but on average I'd say people will need to do a bit more development on sugar than 6/3/1 to get it working.

 

Additionally, you don't get much effect from sugar at night. While the noise with no or very little flame could be worked in to a display perhaps, the charcoal tail of 6/3/1 can be very attractive. On the contrary during the day the greater quantity of smoke from sugar looks better. Unfortunately Sugar suffers relatively badly to hygroscopicity (using sucrose).

 

also, have anyone tried to fire a naked roket motor, from a tube, or launcher pad? would it still fly in random directions and kill everything on it's way?

 

I don't know about killing everything, but yeah, it seems to fly in quite random directions most of the time. Sometimes they go quite a lot in one direction. I've heard that in some adventurous places this is a traditional ground firework, complete with salute. More conventionally in most of the world this is done in the air with sparky "rocket motors" which are called serpents.

[Oinikis]

thank you. yes i agree, 6/3/1 is better due to tail and hydroscopisity. and yes, i will work on a spindle, i'm going to make it narower to the top abit, so it would be easier to remove. actualy it is 2 mm too long, had no time to form it, also, this is a smaller motor, so i do not think it would be very hard to remove it. ok, going to form the spindle now, and to make some fuel.

[Oinikis]

It keeps CATO'ing. it starts thrusting for about half a second, and explodes, shooting plugs out. i think my bentonite is bad, becouse it is not rigid, weak. the granules seem to be strong enough, and i ram it hardly (city litter). the fuel i use is 6/3/1, made with shop charcoal, whitch is sparky (for BP i use homemade). that charcoal is kinda slow, but plugs just shoot out, and leaves tiny peaces. would milling it help? and any tips? it is posible to make it stronger? like mixing tiny bit of glue, or something. i tried to use it as a clay, and made object are strong.

[Col]

If its bentonite cat litter, blitz it in an old food processor until its around 30 mesh. After blitzing a few kilo`s, I heat it up on the stove in an old pan and add 8% paraffin wax.

Edited February 5, 2013 by Col

[Mumbles]

Recessing the nozzle, such as in Col's image really helps to get it to stick in there. From the look of your tooling, the nozzle is flush with the end of the tube.

[Oinikis]

well, on the bag it says it is made out of natural mineral bentonite. the granules are very rigid. if i mill it very nicely? so if granules are very rigid, then the problem is compressing them together to make rigid plug, so i guess, if it is a very nice powder, it should make more rigid plug, shouldn't it? if no i will do the paraffin method. and recessing the nozzle. how does it help?, the surface it hits the tube is the same... well anyway, any tips are welcome, i will try them. Edited February 5, 2013 by Oinikis

[Mumbles]

When you ram a nozzle, the tube will bulge slightly. If you do this on the end it can slide out. If you do this recessed in the tube a little, the unbulged tube below it helps to hold it in. This picture isn't the clearest I've seen, but it's freely available on the internet. There is a better picture on passfire if you're a member there.

 

http://www.skylighter.com/images/newsletter/89/nozzle-001.jpg

[Oinikis]

oh, now i understand, but the problem i not in the plug shooting, but in plug collapsing. it does not want to be one thing. as i mentioned, granules are very rigid, so the plug should be, but it isn't, so maybe the problem is in it not connecting together. i rammed the granulated for thou. so maybe milling it to a nice powder, or parafin method, thats what i wanted to say.

[Col]

Milling cat litter isnt very effective even with steel media. It doesnt take long in a food processor with a curved blade, its best to pulse the motor in short bursts.

Here`s a comparison of bulkheads made with litter straight from the bag and processed litter. The same pressure was used on both.

[Oinikis]

food processor is basicly gigantic coffemill. and these second bulkheads were made also with paraffine wax? Edited February 6, 2013 by Oinikis

[Col]

Aye, like a giant coffeemill with a clear plastic container and locking lid. The smooth bulkheads on the right used the blitzed cat litter with added wax. My latest batch of nozzle mix is vanilla flavoured.. the scented tea candles were on special offer

 

Here`s a pic of a nozzle that was used in a wheel driver (endburner), it handled 20 seconds burn without much erosion.

Edited February 6, 2013 by Col

[Oinikis]

ok, going to make some nozzle mix. i have found plain parafin, and some vanilla flavored, so it will smell nice. i do not have food processor nor coffemill, so i crush it with hammer.

[AirCowPeacock]

You think a vanilla flavored nozzle will make make vanilla flavored smoke?

[dan999ification]

it will stink less/smell better when adding it to the clay thats about all. I was going to use the cheaper scented candles but worried the few % essential oils added or whatever it is for smell would change how the nozzle functions, seems not.

 

Dan.

[Oinikis]

You think a vanilla flavored nozzle will make make vanilla flavored smoke?

lol nope.

 

and i first should heat the clay up into high temperatures, and only then add paraffin, so it will melt from the heat of the clay? or mix it and heat? also tried a rocket with that nozzle mix. it CATO'ed, but from sparks i saw bottom nozzle did ok, i didn't pressed the top one well. it was dark and i walked for about half of hour with a torch, but didn't find it

 

 

 

EDIT: went looking for it now, saw it in neighbour's yard. they are psyco old people (bad meaning) and have spiked wire over their fence. started looking for a place where i could climb over, but got spotted and had to disappear. also when making mix, i put everything in a can and heated it on my homemade bunsen burner. i think i ruined it bit.

Edited February 7, 2013 by Oinikis

[Oinikis]

redid the test, and i was right, the top plug shooted. the nozzle did very well. tried to crush it with my hands, but failed, so i'm happy with that. i have made tube few milimeters too long, and folded it bit, so the nozzle had recessing type effect, whitch from my experiance helps. maybe gonna do that with top one also. top plug shooting changed the trajectory drasticly, and almost hit me in my head. luckily it didn't, and the speed wasn't was big, becouse i was far, but still, that wasn't was funny. anyway any tips for the top one?

[Col]

Sounds like you had some positive progress. Heat the ground cat litter until its hot then add the wax. When the wax has melted stir the mix and pass it through a coarse sieve a few times, reheating in the pan if necessary inbetween.

I dont use top bulkheads but you shouldnt need more than 1 tube id at the most. Folded tube doesnt sound good, you shouldnt be able to fold it

Edited February 7, 2013 by Col

[Oinikis]

well, i use handrolled tubes, and i'm able to fold the edge a litlle. i do it mostly to make it shorter, becouse too lazy to cut 2 exccess milimeter. also i have tried 2/1 KNO3/Sugar fuel, and the top plug shooted after making like 4 meters. so after some progress and reaserch, both fuels could be used. now how 6/3/1 and KNO3/Sugar compares in :

Burn time

power

total made work (altitude)

so i could choose, becouse not everytime i need fancy tail. also i do not have sieve. just screen from granulating.

and you do not use top bulkheads, instead you ram delay comp? i saw one dude has smarter method, he adds disc on top of fuel, with a fuse in the middle, and then, pours some bentonite on top, and ramms with drilled rammer (for fuse) and gets bulk head with fuse, and the fuse acts as delay. and if you ram delay, you ram it as much as the ID of the tube is?

Edited February 7, 2013 by Oinikis

[Col]

You can tell when the wax is well integrated when you have an even colour, the unwaxed litter is a lighter shade, waxed is darker.

I use handrolled tubes too, no way i could shorten them by folding over the end, i`d have to use a saw. If your tubes are that flexible that will contribute to the nozzle/bulkheads not holding so well.

[Oinikis]

well, i use pliers made new batch, but it's late, gonna do some more testing and reasearch tomorow