DeAdFX Posted November 19, 2006 Posted November 19, 2006 Name of composition: Golden PowderComposition Type: Lift powder/propellant with other possible usages as a black powder replacement.Creator: Do not remember.Color/Effect: The Composition: (by weight) Potassium Nitrate 60%Ascorbic Acid/Vitamin C 40% Any Precautions/Incompatabilities: None that I am aware of Precedure/Preparation: Weigh out 12 grams of KNO3 and 8 grams of Vitamin C and dissolve in 25mL of water. Heat the solution until boiling. After 10-15 or so minutes of heating the solution should begin to get viscous and change from colorless to a golden like color. Make sure that you constantly are stirring the solution as you do not want the solution to charr. When the solution has the consistancy of macoroni and cheese turn off heat*. When the solution cools it will become a very hard and brittle mass. The solid golden cake can be crushed with a motar and pestile safely and easily to a golden powder. I cannot compare this mix to standard 75:15:10 BP as I have never been able to make a BP of acceptable quality. You will have to experiment to find the right amount for subsitution. However golden powder makes a great lift powder and propellant. I made a toy cannon(cardboard tube with a hole for fuse and a plugged end) and was able to propell and small projectile ~25 feet. Golden powder could be used to make fuse too but I think subsituting some vitamin c for binder and sugar would be a good idea(to slow down burn rate). Another usage for golden powder is sulfurless primer for chlorate based stars. Properly made golden powder burns with a woosh. If your golden powder doesn't produce a woosh sound then.... Your golden powder is still too wet or you didn't heat for long enough. * Since I have prepared golden powder before I usually stop the heat a few minutes before the macorini and cheese "phase". More info can be found at rec pyro http://groups.google.com/group/rec.pyrotec...d9b4cdbd2b43dac
artificier Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 Yeah its a good homogenous powder! ,but first,how i buy pure ascorbic acid ? and second,you have the burning VOD?
DeAdFX Posted November 20, 2006 Author Posted November 20, 2006 Ascorbic acid can be found at vitamin stores, drug store/pharmacy, GNC or natural food stores.... If you can find ascorbic acid for $20/3lb(not including shipping) then you are set. You can find online sources via froogle. I do not have any velocity of detonation vigures.
artificier Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 ok thank DeADFX ! ascorbic acid its actually not really expensive,but the KNO3 its very expensive for me.5$/100g !! other oxidizer work with vitamin C ?
ltf Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 I saw in ither places that you should react the vitamin C with NaHCO3 in order to meke it natural, is it better?A nice thing after making gp put the wet powder on a paper, after it'll dry you'll have a crackling paper..
Rocket007 Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 this powdr isnt good enought for me. it is only good for smoke bombs thats my thinking.
shadopyro Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 Rocket, that might be because you got your vitamin c from the tablets from a pharmacy. These tablets contain alot of fillers, mainly cellulose, as i realised this when i tried it a while ago.
artificier Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 its the real recipe of the golden power:60.54% Potassium nitrate37.34% Ascorbic acid (can be found in Vitamin C pills)2.12% Potassium bicarbonate (optional, sodium bicarb should work also) procedure :Then pour the powders into a beaker and add the water. You'll probably need to heat the soultion to get all of the powder to dissolve, or you can add more water. I heat it because I hate waiting for that extra water to evaporate. When the powders are completely dissolved you can filter out the binder if you used pills, or you can just let the water evaporate. Now pour the solution into a shallow pan and put it in a toaster oven and run it at about 220*C.You can leave it in the beaker and put it in the regular oven if you want, but I think it's easier to scrape it out of the shallow pan. Anyway keep an eye on it as the water evaporates, it will turn brown in color. Once you think all the water has evaporated, take out a small bit of it and let it cool, then squeeze it in your fingers and see if it's moist. If it's moist, leave it, if it's dry, take it off. Now scrape the stuff out of the pan and let it cool.
DeAdFX Posted November 20, 2006 Author Posted November 20, 2006 ok thank DeADFX ! ascorbic acid its actually not really expensive,but the KNO3 its very expensive for me.5$/100g !! other oxidizer work with vitamin C ? Yeah other oxidizers will work. I have tried potassium chlorate and Ammonium Perchlorate. I just mixed the oxidizers with ascorbic acid as powders. I was to afraid to heat the chlorate and ascorbic acid in solution due to fear of an explosion. Potassium Chlorate/ascorbic acid burns fast(between KClO3 sugar and BP) while Ammonium Perchlorate/Ascorbic acid burns slower(like a flare). I think it might be possible to safely make Ammonium Perchlorate golden powder and possibly Potassium Perchlorate golden powder without to much worry of an explosion. @ITF I don't think the bicarb/carbonate is really necessary but whatever floats your boat.
Rocket007 Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 a buy 99,99% ascorbic acid i think it sucks. but thats ony my thinking so..
Pretty green flame Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 a buy 99,99% ascorbic acid i think it sucks. but thats ony my thinking so.. I know people who use it with great succes, i have also seen shells fired in person with gloden powder and they flew around the same height as my BP propelled ones. The two downsides i see is the price of ascorbic acid and the fact that gloden powder is hygroscopic. other than that it's cool.
Mumbles Posted November 20, 2006 Posted November 20, 2006 Golden powder also has much less of a flame, so if you had comets on your shells, I'd suggest lighting them with the quickmatch instead of relying on the lift gases. I'd probably crossmatch the time fuse directly with the quickmatch just to be safe.
bubbelpower Posted November 28, 2006 Posted November 28, 2006 Is GP preforming best as powder or granules?
Salute Posted November 28, 2006 Posted November 28, 2006 Better is powder and it must be completely dry. Wet burns much more slowly so it's useless. I have great experience with GP. I have made one shell and one mine and both worked quite good(amost like BP). Very big problem at golden powder is that it is hygroscopic. To dry it you must exposed it to 60-80 degrees for half hour.
fizeau Posted November 29, 2006 Posted November 29, 2006 Tonight I did have to test this Golden Powder. I buyed a bunch of vitamin C(cheaply available in the next door drugstore) and put it on my stove. Comp asposted but I doubled the quantity: 24 KNO3, 16 vitamin C, 50 ml water. The macaroni and cheese “phase” occurred after 17 minutes. I got a pale orange product, by much stirring while cooling it became a fine cornedpowder, the smell was almost like in a bakery. I didn´t think a “woosh" would be a problem so I lit a smallportion with a match. Oh boy, that was violent! I guess some members may be interested how it did burn, so here is the video ofone gram of Golden Powder burning in my kitchen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sI_CzenFfwI Thanks for the excellent recommendation, this forum is really a good place tolearn new things.
Chemguy Posted November 30, 2006 Posted November 30, 2006 That's fast, nice. Quite a bit of smoke so I'm guessing it could be used as a propellant.
Mumbles Posted November 30, 2006 Posted November 30, 2006 Amount of smoke has no correlation with propellant usage. Actually, the more smoke the worse the propellant. Only the hot gases propel, smoke is solid particles.
Chemguy Posted November 30, 2006 Posted November 30, 2006 I know, but looking at the formula of ascorbic acid, C6H8O6 or something, it's going to make CO2, and other gases depending on ratios etc.
Mumbles Posted December 1, 2006 Posted December 1, 2006 CO2 can just as easily be used to form K2CO3 as it can be to form gases. Trying to balance the equation is MUCH more indicative of propellant use of a relatively fast burning powder, rather than just assuming because it burns fast it will make a good propellant.
DeAdFX Posted December 30, 2006 Author Posted December 30, 2006 For anyone that cares... Titanium Powder or Titanium 90/6/4 alloy can be added to golden powder for an impressive show of sparks. I have not tried other elemental fuels like C/Mg/Al but I assume they would work too.
DeAdFX Posted April 28, 2007 Author Posted April 28, 2007 Can't believe I didn't think of this earlier but... Hmm diluting slow black powder with golden powder averages burn rate while significantly improving flame envelope. I ignited 6 grams of 50/50. The mixture was a little slower burning than straight golden powder (5-15% maybe?). When the mixture burned I felt much more heat radiating than straight golden powder. I guess this wouldn't be too bad of a mix for those who are stuck with mediocre grade charcoal (mesquite kind). This is better than using metals to make it burn slightly hotter
jaruletzu Posted April 28, 2007 Posted April 28, 2007 I use the GoldenPowder formula since 2005. My chem teacher , teach me about the procedure of making GP. It's good but not the best. For me , BP is the best way to lift a shell.Here in Romania I try to buy smme KClO4 but here is not available.Can u offer me a chemichals company name maybe in Europe , a good one. Maybe from Spain??? help pls
Mumbles Posted May 1, 2007 Posted May 1, 2007 Use it for what? You really need to start specifying what you're looking for in your posts.
mormanman Posted May 2, 2007 Posted May 2, 2007 Use it for what? You really need to start specifying what you're looking for in your posts. Oh sorry about that I just thought it was known but it fine......Um can you use strontium nitrate for Golden Powder instead of KNO3.....
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