Smokeless powder uses

[dagabu]

You could pour some on some paper and light it to make a flashbang.

 

Dolt.

 

-dag

[TheArchitect23]

You could pour some on some paper and light it to make a flashbang.

 

really.....

[Floydism]

You could pour some on some paper and light it to make a flashbang.

 

if you were to pour a pound or two into a pile and lit it, yes, it would make a flash and a bang.

 

I'm not sure that would come under the category of pyrotechnics, But you'd probably win a mention in next year's Darwin awards!

 

I use smokeless SG powder to bind comets...instead of making the lacquer first,

I'll mix up to 6% directly into the comp and add acetone. After about an hour the powder is dissolved

and I have a stiff putty to form the comets from.

 

Are there and possible chemical incompatabilities with this method?

Edited October 24, 2012 by Floydism

[dagabu]

if you were to pour a pound or two into a pile and lit it, yes, it would make a flash and a bang.

 

I'm not sure that would come under the category of pyrotechnics, But you'd probably win a mention in next year's Darwin awards!

 

 

 

Are there and possible chemical incompatabilities with this method?

 

No actually, that will not happen. Smokeless will not self confine in the amounts we are talking about, it will burn but really, not that fast at all. We use bullseye smokeless powder for flame projectors and they burn at a rate of (from memory, sorry) an inch per second of burn time. Not very fast at all.

 

-dag

[Floydism]

I'd bet that it wouldn't take much more than a fairly stout paper bag to confine it enough to get something approaching a bang out of it. It'd probably no be a good idea to test the theory with a 'pound or two' though.

 

What would be the critical amount of smokeless needed for self confinement anyway? it's got to be fairly low compared to typical BP.

Edited October 26, 2012 by Floydism

[bob]

I would think that it would be way more then BP but I don't know all I know is my BP and I saw some smokless burnt on the ground a few times it burnt worse then green mix

bob

[Algenco]

I'd bet that it wouldn't take much more than a fairly stout paper bag to confine it enough to get something approaching a bang out of it. It'd probably no be a good idea to test the theory with a 'pound or two' though.

 

What would be the critical amount of smokeless needed for self confinement anyway? it's got to be fairly low compared to typical BP.

 

I'll take that bet

[Floydism]

I reckon you've probably seen a can of smokeless or two in your time! I bow to your senior wisdom .

 

It's academic really as some of the powder has already been loaded into cartridges and tested, it must be 35 years old and it's still good for sending shot downrange! Had an excellent couple of sessions reloading/shooting with the stuff and i've helped get my buddy into pyro too!

[shagaKahn]

Fun thread. And the suggestions for flame projectors and NC lacquer were sensible.

 

Wish I'd ever had any success with a good green-flame projection using NC--but the standard golden-yellow burn seems to wash out any colors towards the cooler end of the spectrum. Red fine; green no luck.

 

As for compressing it to get it to pop,if you are able to confine it enough to make it go off, be aware that it releases many orders of magnitude more heat and energy than BP. (That's why it's so much better at pushing propellants).

 

Once tried some in an old iron mortar I used for BP. BP would concuss with no wadding, just from the confined atmospherics in the tube; the NC just burned so I decided to pack it tight with some paper wadding.

 

It let out a boom considerably less loud than the BP--and blew the mortar to pieces. A friend came up after the shoot and asked if this was mine. It was a flattened piece of the mortar about the size of his hand; he said it had flown right past his head. It was still hot.

[pyrojig]

Hence the reason steel ( metal tubes) are buried. Count that as a get out of jail free card. Your very fortunate your friend was not harmed. ( for both your sakes). Sometimes we have to learn the hard way, but if we learn, then a good thing is accomplished.

[shagaKahn]

And it's too much that he was so good-natured about it. Imagine the lawsuits if it had been somebody without a sense of humor! (Bowed down to all the divinities that day and thanked them for my narrow escape).

[taiwanluthiers]

I think smokeless powder requires high pressure before it will burn fast enough to move anything, that means a tight fitting (and very strong) barrel/projectile. The projectile will have to be made of metal like military shells because paper cannot withstand the pressure that NC generates when fired in its proper way. That would take things beyond the scope of pyrotechnics. There's a reason why military flares that are fired from a cannon have metal casings...

 

In Taiwan gun laws are much stricter than Germany, and is taken very seriously. People have been sentenced to jail time for air rifles that have been made more powerful than allowed. Air rifles sold in Taiwan have been factory set to produce less than 10 joules of muzzle energy and they can be set to higher speeds. It is illegal and if cops find them (they have tamper evident seal on them) the person goes to jail. Firearms related offense carries a minimum sentence of 5 years in Taiwan so its nothing to sneeze at, and they don't care if its a single round of ammunition, modified airsoft guns, or a cache of AK-47's. A fired shell casing will most certainly attract armed response units. Even certain knives and other weapons are illegal too and also attracts very harsh sentence. Therefore I cannot get smokeless powder, the only NC I can get is ones used for wood finishing, for most pyro purpose they are sufficient (its just like pingpong balls).

 

Many years back someone has attempted to use smokeless powder and pyrodex as rocket ejection charge (again, a gentle but hard push is needed like lift charges, 4F is used but since commercial bp is expensive and hard to get, and pyrodex is more available) without much success. The problem is the same, the powder burns far too slowly without confinement to push anything. Everything from hard containers (making NC salutes) to tightly wrapped plastic bags have been tried and the container would burst, throwing unburnt powder everywhere without popping a rocket nosecone. Just stick with bp for lift because there are no substitutes that works anywhere as well. The rocketry guys are actually kind of stuck since not all gun shops sell bp (they require special permits to sell since bp is considered an explosive while smokeless/pyrodex is not) and it is against NAR/TRA codes to use homemade bp in a rocket.

[Floydism]

The law relating to airguns, starter pistols and even replicas state that as soon as you commit an offence with one, however minor, it is treated as a firearm and dealt with VERY harshly, we don't have a huge amount of gun-crime in the uk but what there is gets squashed pretty quick! But unfortunately those of us who enjoy shooting are treated like potential criminals. Very much like pyro I suppose.

[rveline]

Never- mix smokeless with Hexamine it can spontaneously IGNITE!

If you are going to dissolve double base smokeless, avoid contact with skin, the nitroglycerin will give you a pounding headache.

You can find out what kind of composition the smokeless is by looking up the MSDS online.

[Mumbles]

Ammonia can attack nitrated compounds to degrade them. Does hexamine work in a similar manner? Since it can form some small amount of ammonia and formaldehyde, I guess it would make sense.

[AirCowPeacock]

If NH3 can do that, it should be noted that some tap water is treated with ammonia and some with chloramines (NH2Cl, NHCl2, NCl3)