Floydism Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 I've recently been given a couple of old tins of "Nobel 80" smokeless shotgun powder. What sort of thing could this be used for? I've read that it's probably a bit too frisky to be used as lift for large shells, but should be ok with small ones, as long as the mortar's a good 'un. would it work as a break charge, maybe used in a sort of "flash bag"? It'd be great to find a good use for it as I hate to waste anything, especially if it's flammable!
Mortartube Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 Much depends whether it is straight NC or double or triple base powder. i.e whether it contains Nitro Guanidine or Nitro Glycerin. The flame projectors that you see at rock concerts are NC powder. A wide squat tube contains NC loose and is ignited.
Floydism Posted October 12, 2012 Author Posted October 12, 2012 Anybody know where i can get info on what kind of powder it is, i can't find anything other than reloading data and the tin's not marked as single/double base, although being a nobel product it's probably double base.
Mortartube Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 Try a small test in a squat tube and see if it flame projects. something like 40mm wide by 40mm high.
gelamex Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 No 80 is a shotgun powder and if memory serves, quite fast. I had load data for 80 years ago, I will look through and see if I still have it.
gelamex Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) I have just had a look but cannot find the data. Best thing may be to dissolve some in acetone and use as NC for ignitors. It will not give you the same burst effect as BP without quite marked confinement. Edited October 12, 2012 by gelamex
FlaMtnBkr Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 It won't work well for lift. Unless you only want to lift it a few feet. I'd assume it also wouldn't work for break. If I had it I would make NC lacquer.
Mortartube Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 NC lacquer is a good use. That lot should last you far years.
TheArchitect23 Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 (edited) There is not many uses for smokeless powder in pyro other than NC, but i have used it once upon a time for lifting small fish mines a few feet. its also great for fire pans assuming it was free and you dont reload. Edited October 13, 2012 by TheArchitect23
psyco_1322 Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 Maybe you should take it to your local gun store and donate it to them. You'd at least have to have some kind of pyrotechnic knowledge and experience to put it to good use.
TheArchitect23 Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 (edited) Maybe you should take it to your local gun store and donate it to them. You'd at least have to have some kind of pyrotechnic knowledge and experience to put it to good use. I Don't See Where There Is A Lack Of Pyrotechnic Knowlage In His Post...?All I See Is A Genuine Question, Multiple Answers, Unless I Read Something Wrong There.Smokeless Powder Doesn't Really Have A Popular Place In Pyro, Unless You're Holding Secrets From Us Someone Who Has Had Little Or No Exposure To The Material Would Be Curious To Any Other Uses, Especially New Pyros Who Are Most Likely No Stocked On Chems And Supplies. A Constructive Response Might Have Been A Bit Better Choice Of Words.... Edited October 13, 2012 by TheArchitect23 1
usapyro Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 (edited) ... It has lots of uses... Fuse coatings, dragon eggs, stiff stick fuses (Add acetone enough to soften then push out with acetone safe syringe), and more... Smokeless powder isn't fast enough for use in lifting shells and breaking unless initiated with a primer... And there is no practical way to do that. Edited October 13, 2012 by usapyro
Floydism Posted October 13, 2012 Author Posted October 13, 2012 (edited) Maybe i should mention that i have a couple of boxes of shotgun primers! they'll probably end up in stars at some point but i'm not at that stage yet. it's not really worth making NC lacquer for me as I don't really use very much. but i might have a go with a small batch just to see how it's done. I'm here because i'm trying to (safely) explore and expand my pyrotechnical experience, isn't that the whole point? My local gun club certainly aren't going to get the powder, I'd rather put it to good use! Edited October 13, 2012 by Floydism
FlaMtnBkr Posted October 15, 2012 Posted October 15, 2012 A primer isn't going to get it lift any better. NC has to have high pressure to get a fast (and powerful) burn. A tightly fitting bullet in a barrel provides the pressure needed. A primer is just an ignition source.
gelamex Posted October 15, 2012 Posted October 15, 2012 Maybe i should mention that i have a couple of boxes of shotgun primers! they'll probably end up in stars at some point but i'm not at that stage yet. it's not really worth making NC lacquer for me as I don't really use very much. but i might have a go with a small batch just to see how it's done. I'm here because i'm trying to (safely) explore and expand my pyrotechnical experience, isn't that the whole point? My local gun club certainly aren't going to get the powder, I'd rather put it to good use!To be honest, I think most folks who reload in the UK would not touch it any more. Its old, stored in unknown conditions and getting load data can be a pain. The primers might get you a few bob if you find someone that loads for anything other than 12 bore, most folk who shoot 12 bore dont bother reloading as there is little economic benefit.
Short5 Posted October 15, 2012 Posted October 15, 2012 Maybe i should mention that i have a couple of boxes of shotgun primers! they'll probably end up in stars at some point but i'm not at that stage yet. You are going to try and put explosive filled metal primers in stars? That is a shrapnel bomb, not anything having to do with display fireworks. What kind of stars? Are the chemicals and solvents in those stars compatible with what is in the primers? You, of course, do know what the primers are constructed with, right?
FlaMtnBkr Posted October 15, 2012 Posted October 15, 2012 Actually quite a few people have used primers to roll on to give a report before Dragon eggs were popular. I think it's a lot more common than you think. Although I would think shotgun primers would be way to big.
gelamex Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 Actually quite a few people have used primers to roll on to give a report before Dragon eggs were popular. I think it's a lot more common than you think. Although I would think shotgun primers would be way to big.May well get him into quite a bit of bother with the police too as many of the Forces in the UK take a rather dim view of using these things for anything other than what they were intended for. Be careful if you do use them for stars.
nater Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 If it is similar to Green Dot, you can make neat flame projectors. Try mixing 10g strontium nitrate or barium nitrate with 100g of the smokeless powder for red or green flame. Pour it in a cardboard mortar from a consumer kit or spent cake. Use an e-match to light it from the top.
usapyro Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 May well get him into quite a bit of bother with the police too as many of the Forces in the UK take a rather dim view of using these things for anything other than what they were intended for. Be careful if you do use them for stars. He wouldn't get in trouble. Why would anyone know what is in his stars? They would just think it was dragon eggs... Your such a tool! lol...
gelamex Posted October 17, 2012 Posted October 17, 2012 He wouldn't get in trouble. Why would anyone know what is in his stars? They would just think it was dragon eggs... Your such a tool! lol...You patently have not had much dealings with the police or the behaviour of members of the public within the UK. When fired blank rounds discovered in a field can result in a full armed response unit being called along with all attendant nonsense, you may begin to understand the problem and to think quite carefully on the advice given to those who have to live here. Having previously been involved in searches after an incident, I can assure you that something as big as shotgun primers will be found, even in large open fields. Smaller finds have resulted in convictions in the past.
TheArchitect23 Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) You patently have not had much dealings with the police or the behaviour of members of the public within the UK. When fired blank rounds discovered in a field can result in a full armed response unit being called along with all attendant nonsense, you may begin to understand the problem and to think quite carefully on the advice given to those who have to live here. Having previously been involved in searches after an incident, I can assure you that something as big as shotgun primers will be found, even in large open fields. Smaller finds have resulted in convictions in the past. well, that plain sucks... sorry to hear about the strictness of your country. however, in the US that wouldnt be as big of a deal unless you were shooting these in a public area.I must admit, rolling 50+ shotgun primers in my star roller, and hoping they dont pop isnt going to number one on my list. not to mention the not so round stars....? $50 US For 1,000 #209 primers, $20 + $15 Shipping = $85 USfor $85 You Can Get Enough Chemicals To Make 10+ Lbs Of Dragon Eggs In The Size You Need / Want With No Metal Fallout To Injure Or Start Fires. or even for those tree huggin hippies... no non-bodegradeable trash left over. Edited October 20, 2012 by TheArchitect23
Floydism Posted October 20, 2012 Author Posted October 20, 2012 The primers and powder are off to a freind of mine who has legitimate use for them and as payment he's letting me have use of his land for a bit of pyro fun for a few hours! (i knew they would have a use!). As for the police attitude to firearms, they take our gun laws VERY seriously. And having seen first hand an armed response unit responding to reports of a youth with a handgun (turned out to be a toy!) it was swift and firm to say the least! i don't fancy the idea of attracting there attentions. I maintain that I have a right to the knowledge of the 3000 year old technology that is BP/pyrotechnics but with that right comes the responsibility to use that knowledge only for good. And not to endanger others in my pursuit of this knowledge. 1
brimstoned Posted October 20, 2012 Posted October 20, 2012 I use smokeless SG powder to bind comets...instead of making the lacquer first,I'll mix up to 6% directly into the comp and add acetone. After about an hour the powder is dissolvedand I have a stiff putty to form the comets from.
Minecraftundead Posted October 23, 2012 Posted October 23, 2012 You could pour some on some paper and light it to make a flashbang.
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