black match fuse questions

[tay1392]

Would it be possible to make a fuse by just making a paste with black powder and water an then just let the cotton string soack up the paste?

 

I was just wondering

[weknowpyro]

Yes that does work. But from experience just dumping the string into the mixture gets you very uneven amounts on the string. Thus giving you an uneven burn time.

Get the tub and then make a hole in the bottom and have the mixture above the hole and start threading through the string this will you give a consistent amount of mixture.

[oriansbelt]

here is a link to a Untided Nuclear tutorial on it.

 

http://www.unitednuclear.com/quickmatch.htm

[Mumbles]

I think both of those methods suck. Threading it through BP slurry is a shitty method that doesn't give any BP in the middle of the string. This can crack off and cause hangfires.

 

I make a coil from it, and make the slurry with hot water and kneed it until the BP is cold. Then take it out, and run it between your fingers while hanging it up. Using a sizing hole will result in a completely even match, but I just use my fingers and it's good enough.

[oriansbelt]

It's true about cracking off but these methods work ok if you want quickmatch because it doesn't matter if it cracks off or not in the paper tube. They are also cleaner but that doesn't really matter.

 

Your method Mumbles sounds good but what is the burn rate and how well does it work for quickmatch? BTW your "firebreather" lable sound cool.

[Mumbles]

It burns fairly consistantly at 1 second and inch or so. As a quickmatch it burns pretty fast. Somewhere between the good flat blue plastic coated quickmatch, and the shitty brown stuff from precocious if you are familair with either. Thats 1 strand. 2 strands sounds like a fire cracker.

 

 

And yes, never noticed I hit 1,000 posts. Congradulations to me.

[Phildo]

Mumbles' method has the added benifit of pushing the BP into the string as you squeeze it between your fingers.

[Mumbles]

Actually, the kneeding gets it between the strands. The sliding it between my fingers part just takes all the excess off.

[oriansbelt]

I think the stuff I made with the UN method burns about 1.5 in/sec. so your way ,Mumbles, is better from that stand point. Unfortunatly the only quickmatch I've ever seen is my own so I really don't have a reference. What do you mean by "2 strands sound like a fire cracker?" Is it 2 strands taped together? I've heard that if you tire good quickmatch in a big knot it would make a pop but I never tryed it.

[Mumbles]

No, two strands inside the paper tube. The blue stuff I mentioned had 5 strands for instance. Essentially the more strands the faster. Higher surface area and all that. The speed I gave is just an approximation. I can bend it all over though and not have to worry about it ever going out or jumping around too much or anything.

[oriansbelt]

Oh, I see. Mine was an approximation too.

 

I noticed to day that when I cover blackmatch with paper towel it doesn't speed up the fuse like normal paper does, why is this? I was trying to use up some firepaper(paper towel soaked in kno3) I had made so I thought I would use it to make quickmatch but the speed of the fuse didn't go up any, though it did get rid of the drawbacks of the UN style blackmatch. I tried covering some more fuse with normal paper and that burnt pretty fast so it isn't the fuse. What is it about the normal paper vs. paper towel that makes a difference?

[pa_pyro]

Paper towel is probably to thin and weak for quickmatch tubing and would burn. From what I have seen fuse paper(KNO3 soaked paper) smolders/burns slowly instead of burning like a fuse, and doesn't usually go through fuse holes. It doesn't have the burn speed/pressure needed to be used as quickmatch.

[tay1392]

hey guys thanks for all the responses, I learned a lot and I'm going to try the tutorial oriansbelt posted, thanks for that btw. I did try making the blackmatch with just water/bp mix and it sucks because it got all soft when i tried to stick it through the hole for my fountain.

 

is it true you can make dextrin by putting corn meal or corn starch in the oven for ilke three hours or so? let me know what ya think

[Mumbles]

Yes, that is true. I put it in the oven at about 300 or 350 F until it turns kind of a golden tan. No real time period. Stir it every half hour or so.

 

BTW, BM with no binder will suck.

[Frozentech]

Oh, I see. Mine was an approximation too.

 

I noticed to day that when I cover blackmatch with paper towel it doesn't speed up the fuse like normal paper does, why is this? I was trying to use up some firepaper(paper towel soaked in kno3) I had made so I thought I would use it to make quickmatch but the speed of the fuse didn't go up any, though it did get rid of the drawbacks of the UN style blackmatch. I tried covering some more fuse with normal paper and that burnt pretty fast so it isn't the fuse. What is it about the normal paper vs. paper towel that makes a difference?

Quickmatch works because the hollow piping contains the hot gasses and flame of the blackmatch, and the high pressure pushes the flame front down the tube at high speed. Paper towel doesn't pressurize inside like QM piping.

[tay1392]

wait so do you put corn Starch? or corn Meal in the oven ?

[jacob]

if you live in the us you need to use corn starch, if you don't live in the us you use corn flour,then you just bake it until it becomes golden brown, stirring it every 20 mintes or so.

[Silverturk]

When I am making blackmatch, I'm using my own formula. This is by volume:

 

8 parts meal powder

2 parts KNO3

1 part dextrin

 

Burns very evenly. I noticed that I got a much more steady burn if I added some KNO3. After they are dryed, they are very hard. I can easily balance 1.5m of fuse on my finger, without it's bending off or cracking. I guess that's very good. Burn speed is about 1.5 - 2 sec/inch. Never measured that though.

[h0lx]

Not just corn starch, any starch will do. I also like to add a squirt of PVA to the mix, makes them smoother, stronger and more resistant to bending.

[itwasntme]

When I am making blackmatch, I'm using my own formula. This is by volume:

 

8 parts meal powder

2 parts KNO3

1 part dextrin

 

Burns very evenly. I noticed that I got a much more steady burn if I added some KNO3. After they are dryed, they are very hard. I can easily balance 1.5m of fuse on my finger, without it's bending off or cracking. I guess that's very good. Burn speed is about 1.5 - 2 sec/inch. Never measured that though.

That would probably counteract the KNO3 leaching out of the black match but if it's hung up from a piece of tape, were would the KNO3 go? This might help me with making BM as I don't have a ball mill or hotplate so I can't make too good of BP. I used green mix and I got 1 inch per second and it burned completly and worked in rockets through a 3mm(1/8th inch) hole. My BM now burns horribly and only burns on one side.

[whitewolf_573]

the wednesday i made my first black match , using the traditional mix dextrin / bp. I dampen it with the alcohol isopropyl / water mix , (1/3) and then i impregnate the 3 pranced strings with the mass. Then i put the fuse in a part of the dextrin / bp mix , (that i had separated previously wet it , for use in this step ) when the string was impregnated whit the powder , i put it to dry. The yesterday morning i prove it , and burn very fast .

 

But yesterday , i decided to make more fuse (i only did one the wednesday , for prove).

 

I take 100 g of ball milled bp , and 30 g of dextrin ( 3g dextrin for 10 g bp ) ( i just realize , that the bp /dextrin ratio is 10 / 1 , so for 100 g of bp i should have used 10 g not 30 )

 

I added 10 g of charcoal , to the mix , as i read that makes more sparks , and make a bit slow the pb (i only want it to have more sparks , but i don't think 10 g can be usefull )

 

Then i dampen it with 60 ml ( i do a 60 ml mix , but i not used all ) of a alcohol isopropyl / water mix ( ratio 1 : 4 ) just it was sticky.

 

Then i put the strings in the mass , to permit to impregnate it , and a minute later , i use my fingers to clear de excess of mix.

 

Then i do more , about two of 3 m , and other two of 1 m , and i leave it dry.

 

This morning i cut a part of one fuse , and light it , it was horribly slow.

 

I think now (not one hour ago when i light it , that i didn't know what the hell i had done bad ... ) that is my mistake in the proportions of the mix dextrin / bp could make it so slow.

 

Because i used another ratio of water / isopropyl (yesterday i used 1/4 and the wednesday i think 1/3) i don't think it can make much difference.

 

And not use a dry mix part , separated previously (that yesterday i forget do it ) t impregnate the fuse , i don't think that is so important (could contribute to improve the fuse , but not do it , will not slow it ).

 

So , what do you think i did bad , the mix dextrin/bp , or another thing ?

 

One thing more , is better to use the fingers to clear de excess of wet mix , or is better to use a hole in a plastic ? ( also ,

have a more thickness layer of wet mix , because the hole in the plastic is bigger , is better for improve the fuse , or is better to use a lless thickness layer of mix ? )

[ewest]

30g of Dextrin in 100g of BP is way too much, you only need 4 parts Dextrin to 100 parts of any mix to make it hard when it dries. So for your 100g fo BP, use 4g Dextrin not 30g.

 

I wet mine with 25% Isopropyl Alcohol/75% water and make a slurry and put it in a plastic container with a 1/8" hole in the lid to pull it thru. It doesn't work as well as the finger method but it's a lot cleaner and it makes nice stiff blackmatch for me. I make mine in 3 foot pieces and hang them on a coat hanger to dry in the garage. The next morning you have to physically crack them to bend them over, they're pretty stiff and burn well.

 

Oh yeah, make sure you're using cotton string or another type of string that actually burrns. You can't use nylon cord or anything like that for example.

[itwasntme]

This is somewhat related because I didn't want to start another thread so here it goes. I've made some blackmatch, but don't have my ball mill yet so I was using green mix and 10% dextrin. It basiclly sucks, it won't become quick match even in a 3/32 inch hole. Most of the time it doesn't burn completly and burns half-way then smoulders. I added a little Goex to it to speed it up but sucks still. It's been drying for two days about so I think it's done by now. My green meal burns ok in a loose powder form using poplar charcoal and I use a coffee grinder to grind the chems individually about 40 seconds. The KNO3 is flour fine but the charcoal is about 50-60 mesh and the sulfur is similar to flour, so I think that's okay. I've tried using a mortar and pestle for my charcoal but it didn't do that much after about 20 minutes . I coffee grind the charcoal for about 3 times 20 seconds each with cooling in between them. When I take the charcoal out there's a nice sized dust cloud floating and eventually disipates so that means that is there is _some_ airfloat in there.

 

When I wet it I use 25% alcohol and 75% water to like tooth paste. Insert about 2 feet cotton string and kneed it with gloves for a few minutes then run it through my fingers to get the rest of it off. The water is room tempature so maybe I should try using hot water? I even added more KNO3(25% about) and sucked even more then. Any ideas?

[tay1392]

So I made my blackmatch and everything with the dextrin but it still just kinda smolders and sparks every onece in a while and it wont go through small holes. I am pretty sure it's because the source of blackpowder i am using is just crushed up stars from old mortars i had. I am just guessing it would work alot better if I got or made some Real black powder

[Mumbles]

Another problem is perhaps that you are using crushed stars, which arn't BP generally. Stars burn (generally) signifigantly slower than black powder.

 

Back to itwasntme. I would try to get it a little more wet than that. Something on the order of pudding or yogurt. Not really sure what else to tell you. It is probably the lack of ball milling. I would make sure the charcoal is finely powdered. When you rub it between your fingers you shouldn't feel any graininess or particles or anything. Also, less dextrin will also make it faster. Try 4 or 5%.