oldguy Posted September 20, 2011 Posted September 20, 2011 http://www.rotometals.com/Antimony-s/1.htm
oldguy Posted September 21, 2011 Author Posted September 21, 2011 Are you unhappy with the Zirc M? LOL, I am so happy with ZIRC M that I still cannot believe how well it functions.I wouldn't use anything else. I swear by it. But, Zirc M is VERY hard to near impossible to find @ reasonable prices.I just posted the link, as I also cast bullets & am also tinkering with a few low temp melt metals in hot ptimes.But, thought some might want to cast some antimony/lead balls for milling.
stckmndn Posted September 22, 2011 Posted September 22, 2011 Thought for a second you found something better. LOL. You're the one who turned me on to the Zirc M and I love it.
Killerinc Posted September 22, 2011 Posted September 22, 2011 I am trying to figure out where to buy this milling media it is even better than ZIRC M but can not find it anywhere Density is 6.0 Vickers hardness is 1250 wear Resistance is Excellent and it is Absence of Contamination http://www.noboran.com/page.php?page=13/Yttria_Stabilized_Zirconia#top
oldguy Posted September 22, 2011 Author Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) Google > "YTZ" grinding media.http://www.norstoneinc.com/grinding_depot.html You will find it's $100 ++ a pound new. Rare earth prices have gone through the roof.Is why in-part its so spendy. Edited September 22, 2011 by oldguy
Killerinc Posted September 22, 2011 Posted September 22, 2011 (edited) I was searching YSZ Grinding Media since thats what they were calling them on there site. all i could find was places that i could request a Quote and not somewhere to just order them. 100$+ a pound is a big investment for grinding media but i think they are worth it EDIT: I found this price list is at the bottom of the page http://www.glenmills.com/grinding-media/ceramics.html 25mm = 209$ for 1-9 kg15mm = same as 25mm10mm = 199$ for 1-9 kg5mm = same as 10mm Edited September 22, 2011 by Killerinc
oldguy Posted September 22, 2011 Author Posted September 22, 2011 I would not invest in it, unless you have money to burn.About the only real differance is the media density. It weighs a tad bit more than Zirc M.But, not enough to justify the HIGH price.I doubt an average pyro could wear out Zirc M in a lifetime of hobby milling.Sometimes Zirc M comes available slightly used on ebay @ decent prices.When its there, best to snap it up QUICK, if the price is right.
stckmndn Posted September 23, 2011 Posted September 23, 2011 I bought 20 lbs of brand new Zirc M for $100. That very well may be the deal of a lifetime but no matter, it will last me that long. There's no way to make the math work at $100 per lb even if you ran the mill 24 hrs a day.
oldguy Posted September 23, 2011 Author Posted September 23, 2011 I bought 20 lbs of brand new Zirc M for $100. That very well may be the deal of a lifetime but no matter, it will last me that long. There's no way to make the math work at $100 per lb even if you ran the mill 24 hrs a day. LOL, I bought a 120 lbs of Zirc M (some new - some used) & wish now I would have bought #200 lbs at that price.
stckmndn Posted September 23, 2011 Posted September 23, 2011 No kidding. Let me know if you ever find that deal again. I'll buy another 60 lbs even if I never need it.
stckmndn Posted September 23, 2011 Posted September 23, 2011 For those of you lost in this discussion... The Zirc M media weighs at least 40% less by volume than lead. But it makes up for it in hardness. And that nasty lead poisoning issue is no more. The stress on your mill is dramatically reduced giving it much longer life. And you can easily wash off your media with soap and water in minutes if you like. Personally, my mill is dedicated to good BP only.
oldmanbeefjerky Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I thought i might just throw this in here, but does it matter if media is perfectly round?ive found a way to make near perfectly round lead balls by casting them with a bit more effort then simply squishing a ball between to lumps of clay, but i want to know if its worth it, also, would milling over time, perhaps with the assistance of some grit, turn non perfectly round lead balls, into near perfect spheres? as far as media needs to go?
dagabu Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I thought i might just throw this in here, but does it matter if media is perfectly round?ive found a way to make near perfectly round lead balls by casting them with a bit more effort then simply squishing a ball between to lumps of clay, but i want to know if its worth it, also, would milling over time, perhaps with the assistance of some grit, turn non perfectly round lead balls, into near perfect spheres? as far as media needs to go? Not at all, in fact, cylinders work very well -dag
oldguy Posted November 8, 2011 Author Posted November 8, 2011 The milling media I prefer & use is cylindrical in shape. http://www.norstoneinc.com/grmedia%20_pix/yittria_zir_lrg.jpg http://www.norstoneinc.com/grmedia%20_pix/mag_zir_cyl_lrg.jpg http://www.norstoneinc.com/grmedia%20_pix/cerium_zir_cyl_lrg.jpg
Stinger Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 For the most uses, aluminium oxide milling is perfect. I use ceramic media bought from this shop right here: www.schuba-shop.com Really cheap priced, prices stay the same even with different sizes of the milling media (ranging from 19 up to 63mm)I asked another company for zirconia media but 900 GBP for 5kg of zirc media is way too much for me, so I switched to ceramics anyway. Regards, Stinger
warthog Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I use simple wheel weights like I have been doing for years making bullets. To make them extra hard I drop them into a bucket of water out of the mold. Wheel weights are free from most tire places, sometimes they want money but always bring a 5 gal bucket to switch with the one they are filling for you. To prevent water splashing from the bucket onto the hot lead, I use a towel with a hole cut into it stretched across the top f the bucket. The bucket is also under neath the casting table as an added precaution. I haven't measured these for hardness but they do last a long time. I generally just make .54 cal balls but recently have begun making cylinders for my milling media. Best thing is that as it becomes worn out, it can be re-melted and used again. You do have to watch as you remelt though since it is obviously going to be impregnated with what you have been milling. How I make this safer is to put the remelt media into the pot before heating it up and then let it melt as the pot heats. To add more is verboten, I only use remelt as the pot is warmed up, to top off the pot as I am casting I will only be using my previous ingots or plain wheel weights, ONE AT A TIME!. Wheel weights in a handful can have hidden water in them and you really don't want to drop that into the hot lead. A steam explosion spraying hot lead all over is deadly, it can blind, maim or even kill you so be careful.
warthog Posted November 8, 2011 Posted November 8, 2011 I thought i might just throw this in here, but does it matter if media is perfectly round?ive found a way to make near perfectly round lead balls by casting them with a bit more effort then simply squishing a ball between to lumps of clay, but i want to know if its worth it, also, would milling over time, perhaps with the assistance of some grit, turn non perfectly round lead balls, into near perfect spheres? as far as media needs to go? Media will round itself out as you mill with it. You don't have to make it perfectly spherical but it should be close. Cylinders work the same way, the ends will wear down and you will wind up with good stuff as it is used. I have been making my cylinders with a piece of wood I drilled holes into and as it burns or breaks, I just make another mold from scrap wood and keep going. The medial that comes out isn't pretty but it works and does smooth itself out after a while.
oldmanbeefjerky Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) ah good. I dont wanna take any chances when i mill BP, since lead is much safer than alumina. Edited November 9, 2011 by oldmanbeefjerky
Blackthumb Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 Some of you pyros have noticed that I like to not only stretch my pyro dollars but love to experiment. Here in the NW, we have an abundance of small/mid sized quartz stones everywhere. One day I gathered a bunch about 1/2 - 3/4 in size and tossed them in the ball mill with a batch of BP. Been using them for months without any noticeble wear and with great results. Almost as happy with that as I was with the addition of sawdust to Bp for my small rockets.... Nature provides once again....I still have to buy 'fertilizer' though for my lawn.
warthog Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) The only trouble I can see is the Piezo Effect when using Quartz as a mill media. Also, a sphere or cylinder is far more efficient at milling than the random stone shapes that you must have mixed in there, especially since they aren't wearing themselves into more uniform shapes. Of course YMMV and if it is a happy thing for you, do it. If it does explode one day, I also want to know so I can decide if I too wish to give it a try. I don't use alumina because a guy I pyro with now and then was using it and one day his mill exploded. He had a big mill too. What an explosion! No one was hurt but it threw bits of milling media and bits of the mill and whatever else was nearby for 100s of yards plus it blew the side out of the barn where he housed his mill. I cast his media now too, we are still finding balls of alumina media in the fields, for a while we made it a sort of game to see who could find the most of it in a day just walking around.No ceramics or Stainless either for me. Unless I have some reason I don't want what I am milling to become discolored, I stay with lead. I know it won't spark and I know it is cheap and easy enough for me to make the media I need for my milling. I too am always looking to save a buck, I am not sure how I manage to pay for pyro at all really. I live off of a really small disability stipend but it is important to me to do this so I make it happen. Edited November 9, 2011 by warthog
oldguy Posted November 9, 2011 Author Posted November 9, 2011 Civil war era to around 1930 “PEBBLE MILLS” were fairly common.Still in use in some 3rd world areas, as quartz pebbles are about the cheapest media out there. Quartz pebbles Tertiary (ancient uplifted) river quartz pebbles for milling were screened out of in California
warthog Posted November 9, 2011 Posted November 9, 2011 Civil War era Mills blew up a lot too. Not trying to make an argument here. Just saying what I am doing and why.
oldmanbeefjerky Posted November 10, 2011 Posted November 10, 2011 to be fair, im pretty sure most rocks will form a suitable media for general purpose milling if milled wet with some grit for a while. since the ball mill aka rock tumbler, makes the rocks smooth and polished. Im talking about crystaline rocks like quarts such as granite
Stinger Posted November 10, 2011 Posted November 10, 2011 I dont understand why you guys use lead, really. It pretty much contaminates all of your ball milled stuff and turns it into highly toxic dust.Still not believing what I told you?Well then, just make some willow charcoal and ball mill it with lead media.Make a small pile ( around 10g ) in your backyard, light it and go inside. What you will see afterwards is a pile of yellowish ash which is caused by the PbO that has formed.Very toxic!Just imagine all of you guys handling that s**t over weeks, months.It might be no problem if proper safety gear is used but there is always a bit of lead that goes into the body and will poison it sooner or later... So guys, better switch to alumina media and use the wet milling method for milling BPApart of that, there are much more enjoyable things in life than just pyro, why take a big risk and handling nasty stuff that can change your life?Not tomorrow, not next week, but maybe in a few months / years.Bad enough, thats why I - personally - never use dichromates or other toxic components to make pyrotechnic devices. Regards, Stinger
Recommended Posts