Bulk Charcoal Production

[NightHawkInLight]

Here is an interesting method for making charcoal similar to something I used to do much less efficiently:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqI63IEg3MM

 

What I like about this method is that you don't need to waste fuel as an additional heat source for cooking the material. The initial heat from combustion is enough to support carbonation once the air has been sealed off. Obviously there will be some ash content since the material is not fully sealed from the air for the entire process, but it should be a very minimal percentage if done right. I've got a drum that may need to be sacrificed to give this a try.

 

Edit: Also, has anyone tried corn stalks for pyro charcoal? I expect it would make some exceedingly hot BP due to low density.

Edited May 23, 2011 by NightHawkInLight

[Mumbles]

The Maltese make it look way manlier, but same basic idea.

 

 

I've seen the same basic idea presented several different ways. I believe one of the Best of AFN books has a similar method where after the whole barrel is converted to embers, it is sealed face down into mud.

 

I don't know about corn stalks. It's worth a shot. My personal inclination is that they'd be relatively poor. In my mind I'd compare it to hemp, bamboo, grass, or coconut shell, which are all rather fiberous plants, as a analogues. All of which make relatively poor charcoal, and tend to have higher ash contents. I'd be somewhat worried about silica content as well, which is something I want no part of in my charcoal. Were you thinking sweet corn or feed corn? I'd think sweet corn would make a better spark charcoal, assuming the stalks have a comparably higher sugar content. You never know until you try.

[Peret]

I don't know about corn stalks. It's worth a shot. My personal inclination is that they'd be relatively poor. In my mind I'd compare it to hemp, bamboo, grass, or coconut shell, which are all rather fiberous plants, as a analogues.

Shimizu speaks highly of hemp charcoal, but who knows how alike hemp and cornstalks are? Hemp is broad-leafed, not a member of the grass family. The only grass-family charcoal I've heard of is rye charcoal, which produced a powder (cocoa powder) that was simultaneously slow burning and sensitive to shock and friction. Not characteristics any self-respecting pyro would be proud of.

 

As for the method, very traditional I'm sure, but also a bit variable. The old-timey powder makers much preferred retort-fired charcoal, made the way we usually do it these days.

Edited May 24, 2011 by Peret

[moondogman]

Shimizu speaks highly of hemp charcoal, but who knows how alike hemp and cornstalks are? Hemp is broad-leafed, not a member of the grass family. The only grass-family charcoal I've heard of is rye charcoal, which produced a powder (cocoa powder) that was simultaneously slow burning and sensitive to shock and friction. Not characteristics any self-respecting pyro would be proud of.

 

As for the method, very traditional I'm sure, but also a bit variable. The old-timey powder makers much preferred retort-fired charcoal, made the way we usually do it these days.

 

Hmmm Hemp charcoal..... ive made my share of that a couple grams at a time In a couple of my past lives.

 

Steve

[moondogman]

"Shimizu speaks highly of hemp charcoal" Highly hehe

[Blackthumb]

As I mentioned in another post, I burn a wood stove all Winter and Spring. I load it at night over hot coals and then shut the draft. In the Am, there is an abundance of charcoal. I gather it and gently blow off the ash with a shop vac, crush, mill and sift.

In the Summer, we have many campfires....do the same...load the fire over hot coals, cover with a metal lid and charcoal in the morning.

I have achieved...almost....commercial grade BP. Still struggling to get the same burn rate as commercial...going to "improvise" some new mill media....

Edited May 24, 2011 by Blackthumb

[Mumbles]

In Ian von Malitz' book, he mentions hemp gives middle of the road preformance. Even shimizu mentions it has a high ash content, yet mentions it's good for bursting shells. Who knows really, it probably has as much to do with preparation methods as it does starting material. Shimizu gives a detailed prep on page 120 of FAST.

[NightHawkInLight]

Feeding a massive hopper and letting the coals fall into the cooling bucket is genius. Nonstop production. I may have to build a smaller model.

 

All this thinking is for nothing if I don't kick myself into gear and send in my atf papers.

[usapyro]

Here is my personal method... Chimney pipe furnace with a paint can on top. However, lately I have moved to about a 4 gallon aluminum bucket.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkiX0j6W2Xo

 

This method is for those that love to stand around and feed a fire... Haha

[FrankRizzo]

I really like this idea for medium-scale production. The advantage with this technique is that the wood gas flowing out of the inner barrel creates positive pressure and an area fairly devoid of oxygen near the vents of the inner drum so you should get less ash.

 

Drums are not especially hard to come by, but they are are hard to transport without a pickup.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1s3yevC9cB8

 

This is kind of a baby version of the above for making small batches:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZIMswFhwfo

Edited May 26, 2011 by FrankRizzo

[Ralph]

44 gallon drum only cost me $15 I could have gotten one for free but the guy was taking his time so just bought one

[Bilbobaker]

Feeding a massive hopper and letting the coals fall into the cooling bucket is genius. Nonstop production. I may have to build a smaller model.

 

All this thinking is for nothing if I don't kick myself into gear and send in my atf papers.

 

Do you have to have atf papers for making charcoal too?

[NightHawkInLight]

Do you have to have atf papers for making charcoal too?

 

No certainly not, but I have no use for charcoal without them.

[Bilbobaker]

No certainly not, but I have no use for charcoal without them.

 

What is the expense of getting all the proper permits and papers?

Time frame etc.?

I've just started and don't know what to expect yet.. I live in Oregon so I understand there will be some difference.

I just bake my charcoal in the fireplace during the winter months using a paint can and it works flawless as I can make a different type each day in small workable batches.

[NightHawkInLight]

What is the expense of getting all the proper permits and papers?

Time frame etc.?

I've just started and don't know what to expect yet.. I live in Oregon so I understand there will be some difference.

I just bake my charcoal in the fireplace during the winter months using a paint can and it works flawless as I can make a different type each day in small workable batches.

 

$100 for a user permit, which is what suits us hobbyists best. I've heard of permits taking between 3 to 9 months to come through. That I'm sure depends on a number of factors.

[usapyro]

I just switched today to a new method of making charcoal... Non-insulated chimney pipe inside some old three foot steam pipe packed with deadfall around it. The steam pipe had three bricks supporting it allowing air in. Holy crap that made charcoal fast...

 

The entire thing got so glowing hot you couldn't stand within eight feet of it... I can't imagine how much heat was being radiated into the center of that thing... This makes enough charcoal for me for now...

 

I shall get some barrels someday!!!

[Ralph]

all these fancy high temp ways of making charcoal obviously work but whats wrong with throwing a can/drum onto an appropriately sized fire it may take a alittle longer but the fastest black powder is achieved with charcoal cooked at low temps as it still contains more volatile material and is less like graphite

[usapyro]

Cook it evenly and when the smoke stops take it off... Good enough! My current system is a bit ridiculous... It cooks perfectly dry wood to charcoal in under 30 minutes... Hahhaahaha

 

None of us have the patience to make perfect charcoal... I have looked over some documents on optimal temperature... If you want perfect charcoal you really need to feed fire into a chamber surrounding your charcoal container with a temperature gauge on it and a control. I'm pretty sure Goex and other good manufacturers have a perfectly controlled temperature process...

 

all these fancy high temp ways of making charcoal obviously work but whats wrong with throwing a can/drum onto an appropriately sized fire it may take a alittle longer but the fastest black powder is achieved with charcoal cooked at low temps as it still contains more volatile material and is less like graphite

Edited May 28, 2011 by usapyro

[NightHawkInLight]

all these fancy high temp ways of making charcoal obviously work but whats wrong with throwing a can/drum onto an appropriately sized fire it may take a alittle longer but the fastest black powder is achieved with charcoal cooked at low temps as it still contains more volatile material and is less like graphite

 

I would only consider a few of the methods shown as particularly high temp. I bet Frank's double barrel method is no hotter than a coffee can in a fire. Not that there's anything wrong with a coffee can, but when I make fireworks I really want the majority of my time to be used building rather than making micro batches of charcoal. If I can make suitable charcoal in bulk amounts I'm going to do it. Especially since any of the listed methods here would no doubt make a better product than commercial airfloat. I know you can also buy good charcoals, but I prefer to do things on my own if I can, just not in micro quantities.

[usapyro]

Here is the video of my new rediculously fast method...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNHaHt4Ye3c&feature=channel_video_title

Edited May 28, 2011 by usapyro

[Bonny]

Not that there's anything wrong with a coffee can, but when I make fireworks I really want the majority of my time to be used building rather than making micro batches of charcoal.

 

I agree! I try and make charcoal once a year or less. The batches I make are in the larger 8-10" diameter popcorn tins. Not huge quantities, but small enough to sit on a campfire in the backyard in the city. A couple batches done over a weekend easily yields enough charcoal for me for a season.

[dagabu]

I too throw the retort on the fire whenever we have one but I still buy charcoal by the bag for every day use. I cant seem to exactly duplicate each batch and the burn times a re slightly off with homemade from batch to batch so a 50# bag of commercial charcoal is the way I keep consistency.

 

-dag