welder1074 Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 I was starting to plan on building a cannon for the next 4th of July. I keep reading that people on here make their own Black powder for it. What I would like to know is how dangerous making black powder is. Why make your own? Is it more powerful than the store bought stuff?? Thank you for any help.
Dr Boom Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 Did you look through this tutorial yet? Black Powder It has almost become a rite of passage for a pyrotechnist to make his/her own BP. Especially when a pound of it can range from 18 to 29$ a pound. For 30$ and a little know-how, a good pyro can crank out nearly 10 pounds of lift acceptable powder. As far as safe goes- I highly recommend "Black powder Manufacturing, Testing and Optimizing" by Ian von Maltitz. A gold mine of knowledge.
Ralph Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 making your own black powder is cheap I think mine costs around $3.50 per kilo or something (i forget) you are going to need meal powder for priming and such and many star compositions (usually components only as somethings cant be milled together) are milled so you will have the chemicals and a mill anyway. plus taking 4 raw ingredients and ending up with this (takes only 4 frames for the whole 15cm to ignite that means its burning at ~1.1m/s in open air) is rather rewarding. As for safety only really common sense is required and a little reading after reading up you will discover that BP is one of the few complete compositions that is safe to mill. that it isnt(very ?)(some argue it is) sensitive to static or shock dont smoke around it try and limit the amount you have stored to a sensible amount (dont make and store a 10 years supply of it) no open flames all just common sense stuff p.s. there is already a place for newbie questions
Richtee Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 (edited) I was starting to plan on building a cannon for the next 4th of July. I keep reading that people on here make their own Black powder for it. What I would like to know is how dangerous making black powder is. Why make your own? Is it more powerful than the store bought stuff?? Thank you for any help.Really... if that's all you are doing is firing a salute cannon a couple times a year...buy it. If you plan on building shells and getting into pyro with both feet, THEN you'll want to make your BP. When a pound if PB lasts you like an hour because you are filling lift cups... it's time to make it. If a pound lasts you 2 years- it's better to just buy it. Edited August 4, 2010 by Richtee
welder1074 Posted August 4, 2010 Author Posted August 4, 2010 Is it possible to make BP louder, than it is by itself? Different additives? I am pretty sure it cant be as loud as flash, could it? I have read the other threads some guy wrote about wanting to put flash in his cannon. And from what everyone said. That is a bomb waiting to blow up in your face. So that is out. Just was wanting the louder bang than the other guys have. I am new to this pyro thing and forum so if I do or say something I shouldnt, please let me know. Thank you
Ralph Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 granulate your bp finely and make sure its fast and you will be very loud there is nothing you could safely use in a cannon that would be better
pyrochris732 Posted August 4, 2010 Posted August 4, 2010 Is it possible to make BP louder, than it is by itself? Different additives? I am pretty sure it cant be as loud as flash, could it? I have read the other threads some guy wrote about wanting to put flash in his cannon. And from what everyone said. That is a bomb waiting to blow up in your face. So that is out. Just was wanting the louder bang than the other guys have. I am new to this pyro thing and forum so if I do or say something I shouldnt, please let me know. Thank you kewl imo
welder1074 Posted August 4, 2010 Author Posted August 4, 2010 When you say granulate your powder, do you mean grind it into a finer powder? How does one do that? Is that dangerous because of the friciton? I dont think I know what kewl imo is? If someone could anserw these simple questions it would be great. Thankyou.
Bonny Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 When you say granulate your powder, do you mean grind it into a finer powder? How does one do that? Is that dangerous because of the friciton? I dont think I know what kewl imo is? If someone could anserw these simple questions it would be great. Thankyou. Granulating is (simply) making the powder into granules or small pieces - by wetting with a binder such as dextrin and pushing through a screen or pressing and then breaking/crushing.Rather than posting questions that have been answered many times, take some time to do some reading on here and you'll learn a lot. There are several threads on black powder, take a look.
jimbo Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 why don't you try to pack more wadding in there to confine it a bit more,b.p probably has a limit where you can't really get it any louder,my brother used to do american civil war re-enacting and they fire blanks in their enfields and cannons they probably got a few tricks to make them louder,should be plenty of those guys in the states.
Mumbles Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 One thing they do (for more than one reason) is to confine it in a casing, and spike it to contain it further.
LittleOsama Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 Is it possible to make BP louder, than it is by itself? Different additives? I am pretty sure it cant be as loud as flash, could it? I have read the other threads some guy wrote about wanting to put flash in his cannon. And from what everyone said. That is a bomb waiting to blow up in your face. So that is out. Just was wanting the louder bang than the other guys have. I am new to this pyro thing and forum so if I do or say something I shouldnt, please let me know. Thank you How loud the bang is gonna be is determined by how much pressure was generated before it was released. If you weld both ends of your cannon you will get the loudest bang that i can guarantee
Bonny Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 How loud the bang is gonna be is determined by how much pressure was generated before it was released. If you weld both ends of your cannon you will get the loudest bang that i can guarantee Are you a moron? That's about as stupid and dangerous advice as can be given. Welding a tube/cannon loaded with BP???
Pretty green flame Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 How loud the bang is gonna be is determined by how much pressure was generated before it was released. If you weld both ends of your cannon you will get the loudest bang that i can guarantee I'm gonna break down and cry....
Mumbles Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 How loud the bang is gonna be is determined by how much pressure was generated before it was released. If you weld both ends of your cannon you will get the loudest bang that i can guarantee Joking or not, that is still over the line. I don't much like ground salutes, and now you're talking about pipe bombs. We'll be seeing you in 2 weeks.
Fly Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 You got to love post like this.I think they come here to get a rise out of everyone.Mumbles if it wereme he would be gone for good.If he or she is that stupid they don't have a place here anyway. JMOHOP Fly
welder1074 Posted August 5, 2010 Author Posted August 5, 2010 Why would someone give a new guy advice like that! Is he just wanting someone to get hurt or killed. I hope that those kind of people on here are few and far between. I sure dont want to do anything that comprises my saftey, because I have 2 little girls who have to have their Dad around for a long time. That sounds like a bad idea to me. I just was wanting something louder than the other people shooting their cannons. I havent even built anything yet and the more reading I do, the more it pushes me in the direction of not doing it. I wish there was like classes or something like that were someone with alot of experince could take a person and actually show hands on how to do alot of this stuff. Anyway thank you for all your posts and knowledge.
Mumbles Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 There are classes. A lot of them are given at the PGI, but local clubs can be very helpful too. I'm only familiar with what I've personally attended, but there is usually a hands on or demonstration seminar at every shoot I've attended. Below is a directory (hint, the WPAG is the best one ) http://www.pgi.org/fireworks-clubs.aspx
jimbo Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 most modern replicas of cannons these days are that strong you could fill them to the muzzle with b.p and it still wouldn't blow them up,you'd be suprised,but to suggest welding them up is a bad idea considering the age and experience of some of our members and the certain danger which would result,its best to leave jokes aside and be serious about what we post.
dagabu Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 (edited) Drawn Over Mandrel tubing is, inch for inch, 10 times stronger then castings. I see no problems with "welding them up" if they consult someone with a metallurgical background and welding knowledge. I know two of us here that could do the job. If you are refering to welding the tub up soild then you would be in for a big surprise as the first spark touched off the charge. Its hard to say what you meant..... I have a 1" BP canon that takes 1oz of BP on an 8oz sabot. I have been firing it for two dozen years with no sign of fatigue. It's not a joke and no, I do think it best to share it with n00bs so they dont grab a piece of welded tube and try to make a canon out of it and get blinded by the barrel doing a banana split. Edited August 6, 2010 by dagabu
jimbo Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 yeah I meant making a large p.b out of one,not as in making by welding a breech plug in a turning the welds smooth,we got this engineer to make one for us its pretty heavy duty its got a about a 2inch bore its around a 4ft long barrel wall thickness is about 3/4inch with a probably a 1inch thick sleeve welded over the chamber area looks pretty good, havent shot it yet though.
jimbo Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 I'll get a video of it on youtube its pretty good, but we havent built a carriage for it yet when I go to my brothers shed I'll film it to show you,we paid about $700 at mates rates to get it built, its over engineered its being weather treated at the moment then we'll turn it to better dimensions when we put the flash hole in and register it as real one,so we can shoot it at the range it's been weather treating for about 3yrs now not in the rain but in a shed so its got a coating of rust on it
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