Alcohol

[FrankRizzo]

Tentacles,

 

LOL..that certainly is a Frankenstein beer. I admire your courage mixing all of those different malts together; especially adding the wheat malt. I imagine it'll be sorta like running the fountain soda rail...you know you probably shouldn't add the raspberry Lipton but you do anyway and it turns out to be the "secret ingredient" that makes it perfect.

 

Neither of those yeasts are really going to give you the crisp ferment that you want for an IPA, even if you ferment them cool. The 3638 is gonna give that fruity banana and the 3944 will give you the phenolic (especially with that bit of wheat malt). between the two of 'em, I'd use the 3638..that phenol character would probably be overwhelming with no one specialty grain standing out to pull your attention away. The fruity-ness of the 3638 will blend in much better.

 

If you go the low temp fermentation route, make sure to raise the temp at the end of the ferment to ~75F for a day before you've reached your final gravity. The yeast will clean-house a bit and get rid of any buttery diacetyl flavors that might be produced in the cold.

[tentacles]

Mumbles, are you electric or gas for brewing? I line my whole stovetop and under the burner with foil. I've found with the foil under the burner it heats up a good bit faster as well.

 

This summer I may see about brewing on my MIL's grill, it has a 15k btu side burner. Alternatively, I can still do it in the kitchen, but it will be hell on the A/C. Maybe the answer is another keg- I can have 10 gallons on reserve, and if I have another 5 in the lagering chamber... 25 gallons should last me a couple months anyway.

 

Frank: No reason I can't pick up different grains tommorow, any suggestions? Maybe 5.5 2 row, 5.5 Maris otter, with a dash of biscuit? I could pick up some of that Nottingham dry yeast as well, I really don't feel like tossing down another $10 on a smack pack. Although, I DO have a shit ton of baby food jars for yeast washing now.

[Frozentech]

I really don't feel like tossing down another $10 on a smack pack.

That's a little pricey. You mean there's something that's actually cheaper way up here in Alaska ? $7.99 for all the Wyeast packs. No "hop crisis" evidently, either, except for plug hops. Has anyone tried the Amarillo hops ? A lot like Cascade, but a few percent more AA. I picked up 4 ounces by accident and I think I am going to like the results, but won't know for a few weeks.

[tentacles]

Frozentech: Well, it's colder here so it costs more.. lol! Shipping over the border (especially overnight) costs quite a bit more than a regular overnight package. So the extra cost, we brewers must pay. I can't complain, really, what's the bottom dollar on a smack pack? $6?

 

I think the hops shortage is largely dependant on your LHBS's stockpile of hops - when it runs out, be afraid.

 

I'm still paying ~2/oz for hops, and there is a decent-good selection. Hence, I am stocking up like a madman! Every time I start to thick, well, I've got a good bit of hops in the freezer now... I stop to consider how long ~16oz of hops will carry me. That's around 8-10 batches, realistically. So, maybe... october?

 

Also, the prices on grains are not bad at all, and I can call it in, or weigh and mill myself. So far there's been none of that increased malt prices crap, either. Plus, the LHBS owner is a great guy.

 

Frank: Well, how about if I do something more like....

5.50 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 43.31 %

4.50 lb Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 35.43 %

2.20 lb Honey Malt (25.0 SRM) Grain 17.32 %

 

I realize that it's pretty nearly my Wit. Maybe something like...

5.50 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 43.31 %

4.50 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 35.43 %

2.20 lb Biscuit Malt (23.0 SRM) Grain 17.32 %

With a really clean yeast?

[FrankRizzo]

Frank: No reason I can't pick up different grains tommorow, any suggestions? Maybe 5.5 2 row, 5.5 Maris otter, with a dash of biscuit? I could pick up some of that Nottingham dry yeast as well, I really don't feel like tossing down another $10 on a smack pack. Although, I DO have a shit ton of baby food jars for yeast washing now.

Yeah, 50/50 Marris Otter and 2-Row pale with a 1lb of biscuit malt to darken it a bit sounds like a tasty brew indeed. Does your LHBS have Safale dry yeasts? If so, S-05 seems to get real nice reviews. A Wyeast 1056 would be perfect.

 

A agree with FT, $10 for even an activator pack is pretty pricey. I pay ~$5 for my propagator packs. Buying some glycerin and making a yeast bank would be a great idea.

 

EDIT: LOL, you posted right before I hit submit. That second malt bill is gonna give you a pretty bitter beer...something like a St. Pauli Girl/Harp. You might want to substitute a "maltier" malt for the Pilsner. I think your original idea of the Marris Otter is spot on.

 

I think the hops shortage is largely dependant on your LHBS's stockpile of hops - when it runs out, be afraid.

I ordered 4 Cascade rhizomes earlier this evening from FreshHops.com, so hopefully by next year I'll be brewing with my own supply.

[Mumbles]

It's a gas burner both indoors and out. Obviously boils faster outside despite being 40 degrees and a reasonable windchill. Lining the bottom with Al foil might not be a bad idea. could help to catch future boil overs as well.

 

I get the smack packs for $6.95 I believe, which is about comparable to other things I've seen around via the online shops.

 

Frozen, I haven't tried amarillo, but I plan to soon. They're called for in the DFH 60 min IPA. 4oz for an IPA isn't bad by my calculations at all. Plus if it tastes anything like DFH it will be pretty tasty.

 

Heres the proposed grainbill and notes:

 

Recipe Type: All Grain

Yeast: Pacman (see note)

Yeast Starter: Absolutely

Batch Size (Gallons): 5

Original Gravity: 1.070

Final Gravity: 1.018

IBU: 67.4

Boiling Time (Minutes): 60

Color: 4.8

Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 10 at 63 degrees

Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 10 at 63 degrees

 

13 Pounds 2-row (US)

6 ounces Maris Otter malt

 

.75 Warrior hops 16.4% AA (60 minutes) SEE NOTES ON HOPPING!

.50 Amarillo Gold 8.5% (35 minutes)

.50 Simcoe 12% (30 minutes)

.50 Simcoe 12% Dry hop

1.00 Amarillo Gold Dry hop

Irish Moss ( 1 tsp with 15 minutes left in the boil)

 

Pacman yeast used- took the f.g. to 1.010!

 

Hops were added as continous- first warrior only for the first 25 minutes just a few pellets at a time, then remainder all mixed together and continuosly added, starting at 35 minutes. Starter used, as pacman was reused. Fermentation started within 3 hours, at a nice steady rate for 6-8 days. F.g. was a bit low- ?temperature problems in the mash? I wanted the f.g. to e a bit higher and tried to mash at 153-154. Still, the f.g was a bit lower than I wanted at 1.010. I wanted it to be around 1.018.

Dry hopped 2/13/07 (pellet hops). Bottled 2/24/07.

 

Beer turned out fantastic

 

 

Heres the thread I got it from (Frank has gotten met addicted to yet another forum) http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=25709

There are a lot of good hints and ideas in the thread. I might give the first wort hopping a try. It sounds like it really smooths out some of the bitterness normally associated with an IPA. There are also some alternate ideas about what yeasts to use. I don't know about the rest of you, but the only way for me to get pacman yeast to to buy some bottles of rogue beer, and apparantly only specific ones have live strains.

[Frozentech]

I ordered 4 Cascade rhizomes earlier this evening from FreshHops.com, so hopefully by next year I'll be brewing with my own supply.

How weird is that. Last thing I did before I logged on here was order from Freshops, 2 each of Cascade, Centennial, and Mount Hood rhizomes ! I didn't even know they would grow where I live, but a quick check online at the university Ag Dept seems to show I live in a zone that will work !! A new group of PyroBrewGardeners on the loose ?

 

PyroBrew... I like the sound of that. TRADEMARK!!!!!!

[TheSidewinder]

Heres the thread I got it from (Frank has gotten met addicted to yet another forum) http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=25709

 

 

So! THAT'S where you've been! You cheap slut.....

 

 

 

M

[tentacles]

Frank: So that's what I'll do. How about...

 

6 lbs Maris Otter (Crisp) (4.0 SRM) Grain 46.2 %

6 lbs Pale Malt - 2 Row (Cargill) (2.0 SRM) Grain 46.2 %

1 lbs Biscuit (Dingemans) (22.5 SRM) Grain 7.7 %

1.00 oz Centennial [12.00%] (60 min) (First Wort Hop) Hops 39.5 IBU

0.50 oz Centennial [12.00%] (15 min) Hops 8.9 IBU

0.25 oz Centennial [12.00%] (5 min) Hops 1.8 IBU

1.00 oz Cascade [7.20%] (10 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -

0.28 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc

1 Pkgs American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) Yeast-Ale

 

Est Original Gravity: 1.066 SG

Est Final Gravity: 1.016 SG

Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 6.5 %

Bitterness: 50.3 IBU

 

What do you guys think? I use hop bags so I'd expect a bit less efficiency on the hops than this, but my Centennial are pellets. Maybe like 45 IBU?

 

Although, I'm a little unclear on how long/how to use the irish moss. I've heard, boil 15 min, also heard soak 30 min, boil 15, or just boil 60. Do I have to filter off the break, or just let it settle as trub in the primary?

[asilentbob]

Ordered 2 hop rhizomes today from Freshhops. Brewers Gold and Sterling.

 

Also counted up my brewing money. $100 set aside including gift certificates. I'm thinking that I'm going to save it and add to it if I can till I have enough to get a 5 gal cornelius ball lock keg, hoses, regulator, and buy an adapter, or make one so that I can dispense with paintball CO2 tanks instead of buying a more expensive bigger tank. Plus you can get CO2 fill ups at many sporting good stores cheaply. A 20oz paintball tank is supposed to be able to carbonate and dispence about 3 2.5gal kegs. I'll get a bigger tank eventually... along with more kegs.

[FrankRizzo]

Once you figure in the cost of the the tank, the $20 on/off adapter so you can depress the pin valve, and the overpriced fill, you've almost got enough money to buy a 5lb tank. The regulator is a cost that you'll incur no matter which way you go. Just buy a 5lb tank (15-20lb is a better value) and be done with it.

[tentacles]

Well, guys, I'm about done brewing my "Peg-leg IPA"... and well, it's coming out quite a bit darker than expected... plus, the OG is looking like.. 1.075+ O_O I guess my efficiency this time is a little over 75%? I did hit my mash temp of 152 *perfectly* this time. I did a protein rest, but my mash in water was a little too hot, so instead of 122F it was more like 130F. It shouldn't be a big deal, since today's malts are sufficiently modified.

 

Incidentally, if anyone cares, or it matters, I didn't have centennial hops as I had thought - they are Chinook. Still 12% AA, and they still smell wonderful. Picked up more Cascade today.

 

edit: It's in the bucket now, with the American 1056 yeast. Final volume was 5.75 gallons, OG is 1.077. That makes for an efficiency of 89%, which is kind of scary actually. I had wondered if I over-sparged, mash in was some 16 quarts (16.25?) but I could only fit in 14 quarts, so I added that 2Q to my sparge - two sparges, one 9L and the second 10. I stopped when I had my desired end volume, about 6.5 gallons.

 

Next time I will only mash 35 minutes instead of 45. I would rather get a lower eff than deal with tannin extraction.

 

I picked up a turkey fryer kit today, $50, 30Q pot and 68k btu burner. I can get the pot to a rolling boil on my stove, but the stove is not happy about that much weight on the one burner... in short, it's bent.

 

ended up using 1.5lbs of biscuit malt, due to a measuring error. Otherwise, the 13.5lbs of grain did just fine in my 5 gallon mash tun. Obviously efficiency was acceptable, and this is going to be one big beer!

[asilentbob]

Frank, I don't have a job right now, and a the local brew supply has 5lb aluminum CO2 tanks for about $90 ... So if I get more money, its going to be a rare occassion and it will probably end up mostly going to other things... plus I don't have enough fridge space for a keg...

 

Someday...

[tentacles]

Why buy new? If time isn't much of a factor, talk to people, I bet you can scare up a CO2 tank locally, used, much cheaper.

[asilentbob]

I'll look into that, but I"m not sure I'll be able to get one cheaply.

[tentacles]

Easiest way would be to make friends with someone who works on restraunt equipment, they run into tanks and regulators and crap *all* the time.

[FrankRizzo]

Brewed my first AG beer this morning...Blue Balls Belgian Wit. I used a 23qt pressure cooker charged with 2gal of water. It easily contained enough energy (with continued heating) to do a nice step mash. I also popped the coil over into my HLT to heat a small amount of water with the residual steam until the cooker was able to be opened, then reclaimed the boiling water for sparging. I'm definitely sold on this method.

[tentacles]

Nice! I like the step mashing process. I'm not sure there is a lot of difference between step and single infusion, but I do enjoy stepping it. Once I stop the steam when the MLT is at 168, I cool the pressure cooker and start heating new sparge water. By the time it's done draining, I pour in my first sparge, etc.

 

What kind of hops did you use, the specified ones?

 

Does your pressure cooker discolor the water at all? Mine did some weird shit there for a while, even to discoloring the aluminum significantly. So I sanded and etched the aluminum and then anodized the inside of it, not a perfect job but much nicer.

[FrankRizzo]

I did a 104F-140F-158F step mash with 30 mins per. From what I've read, the step @104 really helps with mash liquefaction. Basically, I did it because I could.

 

My dough-in was 3gal and 9lb of grain (1.33qt/lb). Having only one burner to utilize, I put 5 gal (3 mash + 2 steam) in my pot and heated to 115F. I poured 3gal in the cooler hoping the thermal mas of the cooler and steam manifold would lower the temp to 110...LOL..it didn't. The damn temp stayed at 114F and I had to stir and slosh for 5 mins and even add a few cubes of ice to bring the down the temp before adding the grain...those coolers are nicely insulated. Meanwhile I had added the slightly preheated 2 gal to my pressure cooker and adjusted the burner to get the steam ready for the pending 104-140 jump. After the the final blast of steam to reach 158F, I removed the manifold from the mash. I then took the cooker off the burner and put my brewpot on, filling it with 2 gal of cold water and bled off all the steam pressure through the manifold into it. Once the cooker had released all pressure, I opened it up and dumped the boiling water into the brewpot then added enough extra water to have 3.6gal (2 @ 1.8gal) ready for sparging at 168F. I ended-up with ~78% efficiency.

 

Yep, I used the EK Goldings (1oz for 60mins). My hops started out as 5.0%AA, they're a year old but have been kept at fridge temps in those anti-static vacuum bags. Promash calculates them to have degraded to ~3.76%. The recipe calls for ~17 IBU, so a full ounce gets it real close.

 

No, the water in the pressure cooker was not changed at all. My aluminum brewpot has a nice dark gray layer of oxide coating from exposure to boiling acidic wort though. Once it's seasoned, it's fairly impervious unless you use caustic cleaners. Maybe a little bit of wort got sucked back into the cooker and gave it some color? Or, the excess chlorine in your water was messing with it?

[Mumbles]

My aluminum pot discolored rather oddly. Taking on a redish hue. There was nothing done to the water though. It was as clear in as it was out, no off flavors either. It is definatly the water itself and not my tap water as the lid was discolored as well.

 

I am considering moving to all grain, or at least all grain with a bit of extract if my mashtun can't hold it all. I don't plan on always brewing as big of beers as I have been. I must admit 1.072 was pretty high. I am looking at some 28ish quart coolers. I'd like the capacity to do big ones if I want, or at least a bit of space for sloshing.

[FrankRizzo]

Dunno if you've got a Menards nearby, but they're selling the Gott/Rubbermaid 5gal cylindrical coolers for $18.00 right now.

[tentacles]

Yeah, you can do a decently big beer in a 5 gal tun - just look at this IPA I have in the bucket. Granted, the 85% efficiency was maybe a fluke, but even at 75% it would have been 1.068. As you said, you can always beef it up with a lb or two of extract.

[Mumbles]

Ah yes, I know menards far too well. I was there 5 days a week (including weekends) at 5 AM to be forced to lift water heaters and climb on precarious shelves for a summer.

 

I may still try to go a bit bigger than 5lbs if price and geometry are favorable. The beer I am looking to brew next is 13.5lbs of grain. I'd like to be able to do that comfortably. 13.5lbs would be very close to pushing the limits of 5 gallons.

[FrankRizzo]

Yeah, you can do a decently big beer in a 5 gal tun - just look at this IPA I have in the bucket. Granted, the 85% efficiency was maybe a fluke, but even at 75% it would have been 1.068. As you said, you can always beef it up with a lb or two of extract.

 

Very impressive! You batch sparged too, right? What was your initial boil gravity? Promash says that you got 93% efficiency!

[tentacles]

Yep, batch sparge. Initial boil gravity was, uh.. 1.060 I think? There was about 6.5 gallons in there. It was pretty close to the top of the pot - in fact, I had a little boilover. Thank god I covered the whole damn stovetop in foil this time! I think I could have avoided the boilover - after the initial crazy foaming, it settles down to just having a rolling foamy head. Next time I'll boil a half gallon in the pressure cooker until that business subsides, then add it back in.

 

I should email you my recipes and all - I really like Beersmith, but then again I haven't tried promash.

 

edit: I guess if you consider I ended up with 5.75 gallons, the efficiency was probably even a bit higher. Personally, I think it's definitely getting in the too high zone, where tannin extraction may be a concern. I bet this beer's gonna taste great! The hops had imparted an amazing smell after the boil.