Made my first stars!

[stug161]

 

I made up a 100g batch of Hardt Red Star #3. Screened it together a few times. It says wet with alcohol 25% water 75% I used 91% Isopropyl alcohol mixed 1/4 alcohol with 3/4 water and slowly added it until I had a almost ball forming mass. My glove was not wet or messy. I filled a plastic tube with it and pressed the piece out onto my meal covered plate. Cut it up into similar sized pieces and rolled them to get a good prime. My concern is that after coming out of the tube, the piece almost looked shiny. They took the prime real well, but im a bit concerned that they are too wet.

 

Atleast they kinda look like stars!

 

Thanks, Robert

[KruseMissile]

they look great!!! If they are too wet i don't think it should affect the performance(but thats with my experience) but it will take a bit longer of drying time. great job!!!

Brian

[Ventsi]

If anything I find that if I over wet my stars they become harder and more duarble. Drawback is drying of course.

[Seymour]

What are the stars primed with?

 

They look very good, but make sure they are fully dry before use. There is nothing like some of your your first stars blowing blind!

[TrueBluePyro]

good work mate, you will get much better in the not so far future, you will be choping em up like the towns chinese Susie Man

 

The first batch of stars I made where rolled zinc stars, I just rolled them in a bucket type thing, im not sure why I picked to roll them, it was a very quick way of doing it, atleast with only about 100g, I only did it once and now I cut alot of the time.

 

As seymour said, let them dry before you test em out, let them dry good, they look fairly big. so maybe a day or two.

 

Have you made your first shell yet? if you havent, you will get such a thrill when shotting it, no matter what the size.

[PoorBoy]

well... i just happened to make my first batch of cut stars. They arent as pretty as his but im just happy to have finished cutting that ball of molasses. I looked over the formula I had and i was wondering if the percentage of dextrin may be too much.

 

Organic Fuelled Yellow Stars:

Potassium Chlorate: 60%

Sodium Bicarbonate: 20%

Dextrin: 20%

 

I also made a second batch at the same time with +5% airfloat pine charcoal. I wanted to make original formula and see how it would look with a charcoal tail.

I then wet this powder with 33% Denatured Alchohol and 66% Water inside a plastic bag for mixing. When I tried to work it flat onto cutting bored and off of fingers I realized it was a better adhesive than a pyro comp. I have granulated bp and worked with wet bp before but i have never seen anything this sticky and frustrating. What am I doing wrong or is the dextrin level too high?

[TheEskimo]

Hoo boy. Most comps call for around 2-5% dextrin. No wonder it's so sticky Also, how much water did you add? You want the comp to be like clay for cutting, not wet cookie dough.

[Arthur]

Quote Poorboy;

Organic Fuelled Yellow Stars:

Potassium Chlorate: 60%

Sodium Bicarbonate: 20%

Dextrin: 20%

endquote

 

This comp has a strange but simple formula. Chlorate needs a fuel so the 20 dextrin is about right, the sodium will create a vivid yellow and the bicarb will make the mix slower and safer. Yes it will be very sticky as the dextrin IS sticky when wet. 3 - 5% dextrin is normal when there is an otherwise balanced formula but this formula balances USING the dextrin as fuel.

 

Look at other formulae, or add a non sticky fuel into this nix. As ever with chlorates be careful! watch grain size or you make H3 burst powder, watch sulphur or you get spontaneous combustion.

[firetech]

Set aside 10-15g of composition when wetting. That way if you screw up and over-wet it you have a a backup plan-just toss in the stuff you set aside.

[PoorBoy]

thanks, using binder as fuel makes sense i never considered that. I did add to much water, i had to let it dry for a couple hours before i could work with it. 33% of solvent was alchohol so it didn't take 3 days before i could work with it. but even after it became clay like it just didn't want to cut and it was the messiest substance i have ever encountered. how would this formula balance and would this actualy work.

 

Modified Gorilla Glue Yellow Star Formula:

Potassium Chlorate: 60%

Sodium Bicarb: 20%

Dextrin: 5%

Confectioner Sugar: 15%

 

what would be a good alternative fuel. I have kno3, kclo3, kclo4, al darkpyro, redgum, sulfer, hardwood airfloat, pine carcoal/airfloat, dextrin, all necesary household items like sugar or bicarb.

 

also I just thought about it and realized i cant use meal dust for primer because it contains sulfur. Out of the stuff I have what can i make a decent primer with. I have seen some nice primers for chlorate mixes but i dont have Mg yet. I do however have an order on the way containing 12 mic bright flake Al.

 

Thanks for your help guys. After this if done messing with chlorate colors im gonna do what i should have in the first place and learn with nitrate based stars.

[PoorBoy]

well i tested out those stars i made in a 3" shell. I used 70% perc and 30% charcoal as burst with bp rolled on puffed rice. (perc burst powder was mainly to separate bp from chlorate stars) I modifed the star formula a little as follows

Organic Fuelled Yellow Stars:

Potassium Chlorate: 60%

Sodium Bicarbonate: 20%

Dextrin: 20%

*Pine charcoal: +5%*

 

I did make the original but havent launched yet, any how. It actualy came out an awesome orange color with a very faint charcoal tail. It looked the shade of tangerine or a hint darker. maybe the charcoal made it orange instead of yellow but i wont know for sure until i launch original formula. Maybe original is orange too lol. my friend tried to get a picture but forgot to take it after shell left mortar.

 

I also made tiger tail, on rice puffs. I dont know why but my tiger tail shells leave burnig embers falling to ground. I think its the charcoal soaked into the rice crispies. maybe next time i will try a different carrier to see if it will eliminate problem. as for now i have a 500g batch of tt to play with and 600g more of those yellow stars. Next shell im gonna combine them.

[a_bab]

The orange is the normal color for sodium. True yellows are obtained with a bit on calcium salt added to sodium. Sodium alone gives "too dark" yellows.

[Mumbles]

I don't even know where to start with that. You need to revisit a lot of practices, and do a lot of reading.

 

Why is tigertail coated on ricehulls?

Are there two bursts coated on one carrier?

Why use so incredibly much dextrin?

Did you mill the tigertail, and what charcoal did you use?

[PoorBoy]

The orange is the normal color for sodium. True yellows are obtained with a bit on calcium salt added to sodium. Sodium alone gives "too dark" yellows.

 

 

thanks, The formula was on wouter's page as a organic yellow. I guess it was just a really dark yellow lol. It was still a sweet color but thanks for the info that was exactly what i was wondering.

[PoorBoy]

I don't even know where to start with that. You need to revisit a lot of practices, and do a lot of reading.

 

Why is tigertail coated on ricehulls?

Are there two bursts coated on one carrier?

Why use so incredibly much dextrin?

Did you mill the tigertail, and what charcoal did you use?

 

 

The formula i found for tiger tail said it should be rolled for added strength and if its cut its week... so i grabbed puffed rice lol.

I had the bp on puffed rice carriers.

In the shell with chlorate stars glued to hemis, i diaper mixed 10 grams of kclo4 and charcoal then poured 5g in each hemi and rolled the hemi slowly to cover all stars good. then i put bp on puffed rice in center of shell with mill dust to fill in voids.

The kclo4 burst was more a safety precaution than for performance. I just wanted a powder barrier separating the sulfer in bp from the chlorate in the stars.

And in the tiger tail I used white pine charcoal.

As for dextrin, that was the actual ratio on wouter's database its a phiko formula. It uses dextrin as the fuel, and as a left hand to forehead epoxy... tar and feathers cleans up easier.

 

Im pretty sure the embers falling in tt shells where just the cores from the stars, im gonna try to cut them next.

Oh and i ball milled tiger tail for 4 hours and my k nitrate is granular.

[lodcomm]

The formula i found for tiger tail said it should be rolled for added strength and if its cut its week... so i grabbed puffed rice lol.

I had the bp on puffed rice carriers.

In the shell with chlorate stars glued to hemis, i diaper mixed 10 grams of kclo4 and charcoal then poured 5g in each hemi and rolled the hemi slowly to cover all stars good. then i put bp on puffed rice in center of shell with mill dust to fill in voids.

The kclo4 burst was more a safety precaution than for performance. I just wanted a powder barrier separating the sulfer in bp from the chlorate in the stars.

And in the tiger tail I used white pine charcoal.

As for dextrin, that was the actual ratio on wouter's database its a phiko formula. It uses dextrin as the fuel, and as a left hand to forehead epoxy... tar and feathers cleans up easier.

 

Im pretty sure the embers falling in tt shells where just the cores from the stars, im gonna try to cut them next.

Oh and i ball milled tiger tail for 4 hours and my k nitrate is granular.

 

 

Hi Poor,

 

I would say the embers are definetely coming from your puffed rice core. I've had smoldering residue on cheap puffed rice that I rolled with BP to make burst charge. The burn rate on this stuff was absolutely lousy and left rice krispy "burning cinders" after the inital burn.

 

see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBNfQesMTb0

 

In this video I have a photo of some rice hull/KP based burst mix that I blended with the lousy meal based BP coated puffed rice (in lieu of throwing it out, which honestly would have been the best plan!) If you watch closely, when the the whole mix deflagurates, you will see the puffed rice bits get thrown out (burning slower than the kp/hulls).. and litter the rock I tested it on. What you dont see in the video (because it ends too soon) is that the spent puffed rice smokes & smolders a bit afterwards. (I am going to try to screen the puffed rice back out of the blend as it has essentially ruined it!)

 

I roll tiger tails all the time and I use either lead shot or bird seed for the cores.

 

Here is a vid and some photos of some tails I recently rolled. (I was running the roller too fast an they rasberried a bit.. but for plain tiger tail over core, rasberry stars perform just fine!)

 

 

Tiger Tail & Spider stars are among my all time favourites.. Inexpensive, easy to make, you *always* have the ingredients on hand, they are relatively safe to work with *and*...... almost everyone l know loves to see them in action.

 

-todd

Edited August 26, 2009 by lodcomm

[Seymour]

The orange is the normal color for sodium. True yellows are obtained with a bit on calcium salt added to sodium. Sodium alone gives "too dark" yellows.

 

True, Sodium yellow is normally on the yellow side, but after that I think you have confused yourself. Calcium gives a red-orange, and would not purify a sodium yellow, unless you are wanting it to be more on the orange side.

 

Adding metals or Barium can have some effect on making the yellow, as one person described it, 'sunnier'.

 

For a pure pure yellow, It seems that the thing to do is do a blend of Barium and Strontium, which in the right ratios trick the eye in to seeing pure yellow, or by changing things, a number of shades of impure yellow!

[PoorBoy]

thanks for input guys, yea my bp is on the same puffed rice and it burns the rice out completly (I know this because in my flying fish shells there are no smoldering embers) but The same puffed rice leaves smoldering embers when used as a core for tiger tail. I have read of using lead shot as a rolling core before, I strayed away from it for safty reasons, I pictured balls of lead raining down on people or people's property. Bird seed is a new one for me though, I was wondering when you say lead shot, what size are you refering to. Sizes range quite a bit in the sporting goods store. I imagine you are refering to something smaller than the bb's for a bb gun. I also read some where some body used lead fishing weights. I think ill try bird seed next, I'm planning on making shells for new years eve party and am thinking in terms of safety for people spectating. I switched to fiber glass mortars instead of pvc already thanks to you guys on another topic . whats your experience with lead shot, would you use it in your stars knowing shells were going to be fired at a party? Also what is your experience with cotton seeds I read that was a good core.

 

On topic of color, I used sodium bicarb. Formula was for organic yellow and i made two batches. One had +5% pine charcoal, i wanted to see what difference the introduction of charcoal would make. The other was made as written. I launched a shell with my modified +5% charcoal and it wasn't yellow it was a neat orange. The original formula may actualy make a yellow but i havent tested it yet, i dont have a star gun yet so i test stuff in shells. Either way i did like the orange though it wasn't like the other oranges i have seen before. Im imagining it was the yellow combining with the charcoal dust to make the orange or something but its all speculation at this point. I'll be making a few more variations of this formula to eliminate and test variables. My hypothesis is that by adding more charcoal it will become a darker orange and less or none will bring it closer to yellow. When i figure it out i'll post results.

[Mumbles]

I think you're confusing the term "core". There are star rolling cores, and burst cores. They are not interchangable. They have pretty much opposite ideal properties. For rolling stars you'll want to look for something round. Not all bird seed is good. The seed you're looking for is called millet. They sell it for human consumption too.

 

I've never heard accounts of lead raining down. From what I gather it more often than not melts and vaporizes from the heat of the comp.

[rcmanic]

I wonder if the lead actually vaporizes. Lead vaporization temp is ~1750 C. Do you think these stars burn that hot and for a sufficient period of time? I've head of horror stories where molten lead has resolidified during fallout, injuring viewers, all unsubstantiated of course.

[Mumbles]

If you're worried, test burn a star on the ground. I've never noticed any substantial amount of lead afterwards, even with relatively cool burning comps such as tigertail.

 

It does make me worry though, so I would never use lead. I'd prefer to try to learn how to roll on grains of sand than use lead. It's possible to roll on sand by the way.

[Ralph]

does any one care about their environment or their wallet use star chips as star cores if you cant find anything useful lying around rather than wasting money and harming the environment on lead buy some tapioca or some mustard seeds (i use both of these with great success)

[Swede]

Small peppercorns? A nice rough surface that absorbs some moisture and helps gather comp.

[Seymour]

Small peppercorns are what I use when I'm feeling too lazy to start with the small cores of millet or mustard seeds. They work very well, but I'm aware that they are taking up more space than neccisary!

[KruseMissile]

i use small dragon eggs from those crackling balls(can make my own but i havent bothered :/ ) or small bits of stars