Stunning Silver

[Ventsi]

Name of composition:Stunning Silver

 

Composition Type:BP+metals

 

Creator:Ventsi

 

Color/Effect:Silver streamer

 

The Composition: (by weight)

 

44 KNO₃

44 Charcoal

8 Sulfur

5 Dextrin

4 Aluminum[~100 mesh flake]

4 Aluminum [flitter~30 mesh]

1 Titanium [40-50 mesh]

1 Magnesium [60-80 mesh]

 

Any Precautions/Incompatabilities:Contains Mg and Al I recommend subbing the the Dextrin with RedGum and Alcohol

 

Precedure/Preparation:

 

Balll mill the first 4 chemicals for ~ 6 hours.Wet the composition with no more than 5% water/alc.

Make the stars a bit bigger than you normally would.

A good replacement for Silver Wave.

Does NOT need any priming

 

Pump, cannot be cut or rolled

 

A video :

First is TT 3/8"

Second is Stunning Silver. 3/8"

 

Edited April 27, 2009 by Ventsi

[50AE]

Wow, amazing ! Congratulations for your discovery, very very beautiful silver. Going to buy some titanium soon.

[Miech]

I think this composition could be improved by leaving out the magnesium (for compability reasons) and maybe adding some more titanium to it. Also, don't forget to toss in some boric acid Edit: Never add boric acid when there is magnesium present of course!.

 

It looks like you've made a nice streamer, I'll give it a shot as rising tail.

Edited April 27, 2009 by Miech

[Ventsi]

I think this composition could be improved by leaving out the magnesium (for compability reasons) and maybe adding some more titanium to it.

 

It looks like you've made a nice streamer, I'll give it a shot as rising tail.

 

 

Thanks.

I think the Mg is a bit more important than the Ti since it helps all tha Al ignite properly and makes the whole star way brighter.

They dont need a prime they ligh real easy.

 

All the metals are fairly coarse but coating them is needed.I havent tried coarser Mg but i think it would give a better effect.Potassium dichromate should be used to coat the Mg, and Stearin is recomended for the Al.

I did not include boric acid since one should bind these with either very little water or red gum/alc.

 

I am gladly accepting reccomendations Miech, ill try a small batch without Mg but IMO thats closer to Silver Reeper stars

Edited April 27, 2009 by Ventsi

[Mumbles]

Reeper Silver is BP with aluminum in it. It's nothing new. Just like your is tiger tail with some various metals. Yours is actually much prettier IMO. The magnesium is definitely not needed to ignite the Aluminum. That 100 mesh flake Al will light up without issue. Adding aluminum, is a very common proceedure to brighten the tail, and the coarser aluminum to add a tail. I use a very similar composition (with about 10 parts charcoal replaced by coarse charcoal), and it lights the coarsest Aluminum I have without problem. If you are concerned, replace the magnesium with -325 mesh atomized Aluminum or a MgAl.

[Ventsi]

If you are concerned, replace the magnesium with -325 mesh atomized Aluminum or a MgAl.

 

 

Thanks Mumbles, you are probably right about the Mg .

IDK though it seems like it would make it more bright its just more reactive than Al .

Though i want to save it for Some Lancaster red when I get my Sr(NO3).

 

Btw. the vid didn't show how bright the star was my camera was set on a color pickup setting.

It really lit up bright .

 

Anyway im VERY low on all my metals and out of Ti, so I have to stack up for the 4th.

Can anyone say brooooke.

Edited April 28, 2009 by Ventsi

[PoorBoy]

I think this composition could be improved by leaving out the magnesium (for compability reasons) and maybe adding some more titanium to it. Also, don't forget to toss in some boric acid Edit: Never add boric acid when there is magnesium present of course!.

 

It looks like you've made a nice streamer, I'll give it a shot as rising tail.

 

 

Please excuse the ignorance, but I thought boric acid was what I was supposed to add if i had a comp bound with water and containing mg + nitrates. For some reason I have always thought boric acid was good for Mg and Al if the comps contained nitrates. Do you have to specificaly use something like linseed oil? I have never used boric acid before and havent had a need too, but I have some 200 mesh Mg I have been wanting to play with.

[Mumbles]

Boric acid works with Aluminum and nitrates, but not magnesium. You'll need linseed oil or dichromate to coat the Mg. I'm a little curious about Miech's comment about NEVER using boric acid with Mg though. I can think about no good reasons this should be true, but there are all sorts of misconceptions and backward thinking about boric acid though.

[Ralph]

Mumbles I dissolved some boric acid in some water (admittedly it was warm) than added some magnesium (80-120mesh uncoated) 10-15 min later all the magnesium was gone (ratio of boric acid to mg was probably 2:1)

[Mumbles]

Did you try a control of just warm water without the boric acid?

[Miech]

I did, because someone was asking the same question in the #pyrotechnics channel on Chat4All.

 

I made a serie of solutions of 0%, 1%, 2.5% and 5% concentration of boric acid in demineralized water. Then I made two 50 ml samples of each solution, which were placed in a water bath to even out the temperature of the samples. Then I weighted out eight samples of 5 grams of #200 uncoated granular magnesium powder. The solutions were removed fron the water bath, and the magnesium powder was added while keeping track of the time it took to dissolve the sample to a point where there was no visible trace of magnesium left. The 0% sample took ages to dissolve, actually so long I didn't even write down the time. The other samples dissolved completely in about 8 minutes for the 1% solution, 3 minutes for the 2.5% solution and just over a minute for the 5% sample. The latter two samples got noticable hotter while dissolving, which might have had an influence on the dissolving rate.

 

Therefore my conclusion, magnesium with boric acid is not a good idea.

[PoorBoy]

If you sub the dextrin for red gum and alchohol, does that avoid all dangerous reactions? I reallllly don't want to bother with coating all my Mg when i'm just gonna light it on fire any how. Its like being terminally ill and eating healthy. I coat things I wanna keep, like my house, with paint. Any how, how would you safetly make this star with water? Coat the Mg with linseed oil to protect from boric acid, then coat Al in boric acid to protect from nitrates? Seems redundant. Basically I have 2 questions.

 

Will the reactions that could occur in this comp with water, also be possible with alchohol and red gum?

 

If I am too lazy for the redundant safety procedures required to keep the materials in the comp from arguing with each other, and just use dextrin and water, what are the chances of a reaction taking place? Will a fight break out?

 

EDIT: No I don't plan on doing the latter and storing it under my bed to dry, the second question is more for the sake of learning.

Edited April 29, 2010 by PoorBoy

[PoorBoy]

I'm gonna try a test to answer one of my own questions today. I'm gonna do th control test of placing Mg powder in water... other results indicate it should dissolve in about 8 min or so, and another test of Mg in Denatured Alchohol. I'm hoping it wont react with the alchohol and dissolve. Is this flawed thinking? If it doesn't react I'm gonna add KNO3 to the Alchohol with the Mg to see if a reaction takes place. If it reacts and gets too hot I'll just dump it out on the drive way and let it react.

[Seymour]

With the magnesium content being quite low, and the particle size being relatively high, I do not think that the most pressing issue is it heating up to the point of ignition, especially in the batch sizes most of us work with.

 

The issue that is aparant to me, is that you can make your stars, and they will react, within minutes or days, resulting in the destruction of the magnesium. This may damage the structural integrity of the star. If not, you still have Mg(OH)2 doing nothing but be inert, instead of having Mg metal to burn.

 

Essentially, you can add the 1 part Mg, but it will not contribute to the star if it corrodes.

 

Certainly you can slow the corrosion long enough to make, dry and fire the stars, and you can even give it a long enough shelf life that it will last years.

 

Or you could replace it with one part fine flake Al, or MgAl and avoid all the problems, while saving your Mg for strobes.

[Bonny]

Or you could replace it with one part fine flake Al, or MgAl and avoid all the problems, while saving your Mg for strobes.

 

I was looking at maybe trying this star out, and that is exactly what I had in mind (using MgAl) as I have no Mg anyway. The only other problem I have is that I don't (won't) pump small stars, too time consuming IMO. IF I had a star plate then I would but that's not the case ATM.

[Seymour]

Perhaqps Ventsi can elaborate on why he says the composition cannot be cut or rolled, but judging by what the comp contains, you should definitely be able to cut or roll them, and at worst they will be difficult (but far from impossible) to produce that way.

 

Yep, high charcoal compositions are difficult to cut because they have less room for error with water content, but it is possible to get it juyst right, not a runny mess or a crumbly mess.

 

The metal contents don't look high enough to cause cutting or pumping problems.

[Ventsi]

I have not tried rolling these but I would imagine that the Sponge Ti and Coarse flitter Al which might just be bigger than the cores you start with would render the stars very inconsistent and bumpy when rolled.

 

If you do decide to cut them let us know how it goes. I'd go with SGRS as a binder as it seems to make cutting easier.

[Mumbles]

They'd probably be easier to roll onto a core that has already been built up with another comp to 1/4" or so. Cutting shouldn't be a problem at all, if you lose the Mg, or exchange it with something else.

 

If it does corrode to make Mg(OH)2, it isn't the inert quality that I'd be worried about, it's the fact that it's basic and will accelerate other reactions with aluminum and such.

[Ralph]

Did you try a control of just warm water without the boric acid?

 

yes I did first picture is essentially the initial and the second is after a couple hours as you can see there are some bumbles that slowly formed In the Mg/water one but as you can see in a couple hours the zip lock bag has not notably inflated any more than the tiny amount it did initially were as the one with boric acid burst open several times

[Mumbles]

Now that I think about it, it makes a lot of sense. I'd imagine it's more from an electolyte situation vs. an acid thing. NaCl, or a solution of KNO3 would probably do the same thing.

[Ralph]

here is the initial Nacl not really any more reaction than straight water ill post the after a couple hours pic well after a couple hours

 

 

 

not alot happened the bag is bulging alittle that's it certainly more than with straight tap water

 

Edited May 3, 2010 by Ralph