TheNitrateFellow Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 (edited) Hello, I got my hands recently on some printing toner, about 2 oz. of it, and I wondered if it could be of any use in pyrotechnics. I thought "Hey, it's mostly carbon, so it must burn, maybe with some nice sparks" Man, I was wrong. I totally messed up my workshop (Now have black walls, black floor, black ceiling, black hands, black t-shirt, etc.) This thing is like airfloat but worse. And when you aim a propane torch straight at it it will do nothing but melt in a gooey black thingy and smell like burnt rubber. Then I thought "If it smell like burnt rubber, maybe it can be used as a chlorine donor" and I put about +6% of the stuff in meal BP, along with some CuSO4. The green color didn't showed up, and my BP burned so slowly throwing pieces of molten mess everywhere( Thanks blasting chamber) Anyone has an idea of what this stuff could be used for? I have yet 2 oz to use, and many lbs free if I want. P.S. I hate typos! I'm glad nobody read it before I edited it! Edited February 23, 2009 by TheNitrateFellow
Mumbles Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 I don't think you'll be able to do anything useful with it, sorry. My best suggestion would be to use it as a long hanging tail in charcoal streamers. Toner is something along the lines of 10-20% lampblack that is mixed with a polyester polymer. Additionally, you'll never get a color our of BP, even if you used real chlorine donors.
psyco_1322 Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 Mumbles, It sounds like he's done it before with some success. I wouldn't believe much color would be able to mbe made either, but there's always odd noob concoctions that do strange things. On the other hand of usefulness. How abouts some nasty daylight shells. They make them with chaulk all the time, but black toner should work pretty well. A casing full of it with a few grams of burst charge (whistle/flash) in the center. I did end up with a pound of rubber powder for a supplier as a sample, not sure what I can use it for yet, but I'm trying to come up with ideas. Its not quite dust but probably around 150-200 mesh.
50AE Posted February 23, 2009 Posted February 23, 2009 You could use the toner shafts for constructing a ball mill.
TheNitrateFellow Posted February 23, 2009 Author Posted February 23, 2009 (edited) Thanks Mumbles, I'll try to use it as a hanging tail like you described. BTW, I've always managed to get a greenish flame by sprinkling some CuSO4 in meal BP. My BP is a little underfueled, maybe it has something to do with it? Psyco, I find your idea... interesting, but imagine the mess it would make... black toner floating in the air, being electrostatically attached to everything... I had it on t-shirt, and it took two washing cycles to clean it, tough there is some left. Imagine it in your hair, on your car, onto pretty much everything nearby. This thing is almost impossible to destroy, you can just wash it off. This means you can just use it in a desert place, like your anti-pyro neighbor's backyard while they're on vacation 50AE, I havent actually got the cartridge, just the toner in a plastic bottle. Anyway I'll have to find some way to use up my toner, before my workshop becomes so dark I'll get lost in it. Best regards, The Nitrate Fellow Edited February 23, 2009 by TheNitrateFellow
andyboy Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 Carbon black is considered carcinogenic so I hope you are wearing a dustmask at least.
FrankRizzo Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 (edited) Toner is mostly styrene and polyester, the carbon black portion is actually suspended inside the plastic particles. So, using it as a fuel, you will mostly be burning a plastic. However, if you do find that it makes good spur fire or has some pyrotechnic use, please let us know. I've got a few huge bulk bottles in the storeroom here at my office that are for a model we no longer own, so they would be ripe for liberating. EDIT: Seems your not the first person to have the idea of using toner in a pyrotechnic capacity. Search the Google Groups archive of Rec.Pyrotechnics for "toner"...seems that it's fairly useless. Edited February 24, 2009 by FrankRizzo
mike_au Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 I read a post a while ago suggesting that carbon black and (I think) linseed oil made a good water proof(?) coating for the outside of cardboard mortars. I have just finished turning up plugs for a few cardboard mortars and was planning on trying toner and linseed oil. I'll let you know how it goes. Using it in daylight shells is a good idea, I have been wanting to try them out for a while but haven't bothered to buy the chalk. I might give that a go too.
Swede Posted February 24, 2009 Posted February 24, 2009 Try "Simple Green" or some other powerful aqueous detergents to clean the toner. I'm guessing if you use a non-polar solvent like MEK, it'll melt the plastic component, and the toner stain would then become permanent!
trag Posted February 25, 2009 Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) I read a post a while ago suggesting that carbon black and (I think) linseed oil made a good water proof(?) coating for the outside of cardboard mortars. I have just finished turning up plugs for a few cardboard mortars and was planning on trying toner and linseed oil. I'll let you know how it goes.. Once it polymerizes, linseed oil by itself will make a pretty good water resistant coating. Similarly for tung oil. Edited February 25, 2009 by trag
TheNitrateFellow Posted February 25, 2009 Author Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) Of course andyboy I wear a dust mask! Eack time I use fluffy powders I use a dust mask. I didn't know it was carcinogenic but anyway I don't like the idea of black stuff in my lung *sneeze* "Oh sorry, try washing it off with simple green." BTW, thanks swede for your idea, it worked well! My workshop is now light grey instead of opaque black. I tought of something... maybe toner would be useful for a cremora kind of thing? Would be impressive! Wooof! Huge ring of black smoke, along with burnt rubber smell... Yummy! I'll do some tests and post my results here. Edited February 25, 2009 by TheNitrateFellow
TheNitrateFellow Posted April 12, 2009 Author Posted April 12, 2009 Update on the cremora thing! A small-scale (film-canister) cremora was prepared with toner and another one with ordinary white flour, and both were fired (sadly no pictures, camera battery dead). The flour one did what you would expect from a flour cremora: not very impressive, but a good baseline for measuring performance. The toner cremora fired, but the toner not ignited and there was just an air-suspended mess, pretty much like the daylight shells psyco was describing. I am not much surprised since it is so hard to ignite as a pile on the ground. Fortunately it's winter so I can just shove the contaminated snow in a bucket of hot water and pour it down the drain. So, it seems that toner is rather useless to anything in pyro maybe except coating tubes?
TheSidewinder Posted April 12, 2009 Posted April 12, 2009 As you've discovered, copier toner is pretty much worthless in our hobby. Well, except perhaps to go in your Laser Printer so you can print out formulas of all things pyro... As said, it's a heat-activated polymer mixed with lampblack (and some other things to make a laser printer work better). If you ever want to see a REAL mess, put some on a t-shirt, cover with parchment paper, then put a hot iron on it. Voila! Instant t-shirt transfer printing.
psyco_1322 Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 ^^^ Then send the shirt through the wash with all you other clothes I say daylight shells.
TheSidewinder Posted April 13, 2009 Posted April 13, 2009 Are you speaking from experience, psyco? Actually, it *should* be OK to wash with other articles *if* you've ironed it thoroughly and all the toner is fused onto the shirt. If not? Then psyco has it right.
Recommended Posts