Capsaicin(oids) Extraction, Chilli growing

[aquaman]

Thanks for that link. It just answered most, if not all my questions.

[Rogue Chemist]

Hotazel chilli, red savina is on the way to being similar, but its only got half the peppers or so, and are all green.

 

 

EDIT: Hmmm the dirt looks dry in my pot I just noticed from the picture.

[asilentbob]

Well... sad day...

 

We are moving... and most of our pepper plants are flourishing... might dig some of them out and replant them... hopefully the shock doesn't hurt them too much...

 

Then hopefully i can invest a little money into getting a red savina plant or 2... so many neat pepper plants out there... hard decision.

[aquaman]

I transplanted one of my pepper plants from a pot to the ground and it is doing very well. So if you can try to transplant it into a pot if it isn't too big. Just keep the soil a little moist as my plant kind of dried out when I transplanted (stress?). Well anyways just keep an eye on it and it should snap back to normal in a day or two.

 

My Habeneros are just about to bloom. A little late in the season but their small (about 9 in. tall) and when fall comes around I'll bring them inside.

 

 

BTW asilentbob, try getting the Naga Jolokia seeds. One of the hottest peppers out there...

[asilentbob]

I talked to my mom about it... and she said no... might be able to persuade her into letting me try to replant them... however... they are big... the poblano and anehiem plants are like 4-1/2ft high and doing very well. Habaneros are around 2-1/2 to 3ft high and the sweet and hot bananna pepper plants are around 3ft high.

 

Yeah i have read a bit about that variety in the past... im going to have to make up another list of types i want to get...

[crazyboy25]

I have about 65g bone dry cayne peppers and about 17g grams of some thai peppers also totally dry. both batches were homegrown and I want to extract the oil FOR FOOD PURPOSES. It must be safe to consume. So my question is what would be the best solvent I am considering:

 

 

acetone will it evaporate totally or leave nasty residual acetone? also im not too keen on it because the fumes give me a headache and I have to be there when boiling the oils.

 

vodka only 80 proof (40% alc) its obviously edible but will all that water make solubility a problem?

 

and...everclear pretty much perfect pure safe clean but I don't have any in the house and im not sure if its sold around here I will have to look.

[asilentbob]

Sometimes acetone is pure, but usually it has other nasties in it. Denatonium benzoate perhaps.

 

I'd go with either refluxing in vodka or everclear if you want a quick extraction. If you don't need it quick, just mincing up all the peppers and letting them soak for days or weeks will do it.

 

I moved... so all my pepper plants were left behind :C... Still want to do this extraction. Spring is coming up... I'm defiantly going to get a garden going again.

[Sylar]

I'm a bit sad to say that my pepper plant is withering ...

 

The older leafes all have fallen off, the newer leafes stay small and don't seem very healthy. I transported it to a larger pot around oktober (I think) and unclogged the root system.

 

I don't think it has root-bound problems right now, but I might be keeping it a little too wet. It also survived a cat attack in december.

 

 

I don't really know the specific pepper name, but the peppers that come of it are shaped like small paprika's without the ribs on the outside, about 3 cm long and 2-3 cm diameter.

[asilentbob]

Ok, well the garden is starting to get up again... I don't have any particularly exotic peppers like I wanted though . I have been watering the pepper plants a little less than I should, however I have been removing buds before they can turn to flowers and germinate for a few weeks now so that the plants focus more on growing than on growing peppers... They are getting to the point that its hard to remove buds before they flower and turn into peppers unless you check them every couple days. The plants should now be strong enough to support many peppers, and I'll probably stop removing buds pretty much now unless a few of the plants seem a bit behind.

 

I have a habanero or 2, some "salsa" peppers, cayanne, poblano, anaheim, and more that I can't really remember. I also have some room left in the garden should I happen to end up getting some more peppers exotic or not. We also have some tomato and bean plants.

[ST1DinOH]

Today i did very mild research on hydroponics and im thinking of making either an ebb and flow system or a drip system. Mabey both. Drip seems a little better due to what i have available currently. Possibly using as little as a plastic soda bottle of whatever size, media such as vermiculite, thin aquarium air tubing and an aquarium air pump set on a timer. Most of you could probably figure it out from there, its pretty simple. Still if i get around to it ill take pictures and make a tutorial. My only concern is that the aquarium air pump could possibly get damaged if it was a small pump and used on a big system.

 

ahhhh

 

hydroponics...

 

finally something i can help with.

 

first off you need to locate a local store or find a online shop thats got decient shipping and prices. there is a lot of options depending on how much you plan on growing.

 

flood and fill tables are probably the best way to grow large amounts of plants, but online they sell several options for small single bucket systems that each work as separate units or together in a system.

 

if you want to grow a few plants i suggest this system:

 

http://www.hydroponics.net/i/214420

 

self contained and easy to use.

 

if you are doing more than a few and think 8 is you magic number...this one is perfect:

 

http://www.hydroponics.net/i/133883

 

but i personally don't like to do single units when growing more than 2 or 3 plants. single units are perfect for a single plant in a controlled environment, but beyond that a simple ebb and flow table is the only way to go. hydroponics requires lots of reservoir maintenance so simplifying everything down to a single reservoir is ideal. with the ebb and flow systems you are using a single large bucket or tub and it's all right there easily accessible by removing a single lid. no disturbance to the plants whatsoever.

 

the best way i can suggest to build a simple flood and fill table is to use the reservoir tubs for sale at these hydro shops. i've seen people try to make their own from wood and plastic sheeting but they almost always leak.

 

you need a water pump to push the nutrient mix up into the tray during the flood cycle. while the table is being flooded it will fill until it reaches the top of your overflow tube. this tube should be somewhat adjustable. if you tinker around at the hardware store you can find a pipe or hose that will mate up with a drain collar that you'll be able to slide up and down to adjust the water level. this tube empties into the reservoir below by gravity.

 

the other part you need to attach to the bottom of the tray is a fill/drain fitting. this should be flush mounted when finished to the very bottom of the tray at it's lowest point if it has a bevel. if there is no bevel then give your table a slight lift on one end and place the fill/drain mount at the lowest spot.

 

when in flood mode the pump will be pushing the nutrient mix up and out the fitting, but when the pump stops the nutrient mix will reverse the pump and drain back into your reservoir. the adjustable overflow tube works to keep the water level right where you want it.

 

the resivoir below should be at least %25 more volume than the table can hold. you need to account for minimum water level in the resivouir to allow the pump to function properly, the water the fill and overflow tubing can hold, and the table.

 

 

now here's an easy illustration of what the table should look like and how it should work:

 

http://www.simplyhydro.com/images/ebbfloana3.gif

you'll also want an aquarium air pump. roots like oxygen so it will promote plant growth to include an aquarium air pump with air stone in the resivouir to airate it. the water falling from the overflow should be allowed to splash a bit as well...this will also help incorporate oxygen into the water/nutrient bath. if you take the later step of enclosing your grow room and adding CO2 to the air then you will want to relocate the air pump itself to outside the room (more on this below).

 

palnts will do well in this simple setup (adjusting the PH and nutrient levels accordingly for the desired plant), but there are certian steps you can take to ensure higher yields.

 

carbon dioxide production can help tremendoously but it's expensive to do it right. you can do it cheaply by just burning some propane in the room with the plants but the best way is to get a co2 riostat system that dispenses co2 and can be adjusted to the desired PPM. the plants i was growing actually preferd 2100 ppm which was around 3 times normal air.

 

to accomplish this without being at the bottled gas shop twice a day you need to completely enclose the room and make it air tight. i order to not bake the hell out of you r plants you will need a temperature switch that will actuate some exhaust fans whenever the grow room reaches a critical temperature. when these exhaust fans kick on you want them to be located near the top center of the room and you need to install some dryer vent baffles to point inwards into the grow room near the bottom of the room.

 

when the room cycles it will draw fresh cool air in from the bottom of the room and out the top exhausting all the hot air. this will vent the CO2 that you produced but as soon as the room temp gets back to normal the rheostat will dispense the proper amount of CO2 to bring the PPM back to the desired level.

 

it's all completely automated and greatly increases the plant yield but you are now getting into 5-6-7 hundred dollars just to manipulate the air. in certain plants that have a better resale, this is no big deal, just returns on investment.

 

in pepper growing for pranks this may not be a worth while endeavor but if you like to take things to the extreme air control is the best thing you can do for your plants.

 

lastly lighting is crucial. you can go with cool white florescent, or you can go all out and get some 1000 watt HPS and MH bulbs. the degree at which you take this is up to you. but in our garden we used 1 MH on a light mover for 1/2 the time and 2 HPS bulbs for the "flowering" stage.

 

MH give you the blue spectrum of light which are perfect for vegetative growth. this will make your plants grow big and fast and thick. the MH is the red spectrum which kinda tells the plant it's fall and inspires it to begin to produce fruit/seed.

 

not knowing how peppers reproduce i don't know what you will need to do to produce better yields. plants that have two sexes will do much better if they aren't introduced to the other sex, plants that are a sexual will do better if there are more of them and they can pollinate off one another.

 

the plants i was growing you weeded out the males and concentrated specifically on the females. i'm assuming peppers aren't that complex in which case it will be very simple. just grow them together and keep some cheap oscillating fans operating in the room to stir the air and get those pollen grain moving in search of stamen.

 

fans will help the plants in another way as well. they create micro tears and "wounds" on the plant to which the plants respond by growing much thicker and sturdier than the same plant with no air movement. this will keep the plants hearty and able to bear the massive pepper crop you will be getting from them.

 

the plants will be growing in plastic mesh baskets full of baked clay medium called "hydroton". it's a bag of red clay marbles, get the big bag you'll save money.

 

baskets:

http://www.hydroponics.net/images/131546.jpg

 

hydroton:

http://www.hydroponics.net/images-hf/20916_GM9_hydroton.jpg

 

before you start you need to figure out how many baskets you can fit in the ebb/flow table. space them out evenly to allow for the plants to grow but try to squeeze as many in as possible. think ahead here because you want to envision the plants at full growth, as big as they get. space them out so they aren't crowded when fully matured and producing peppers.

 

at this point it's best to construct a cover for your table that the baskets can slip into. you want the baskets to rest securely on the bottom of the table, but you want this cover to shield the nutrient bath from any light. this will stop the growth of algae in your water which will consume your nutrients and keep you constantly doing water changes and adjustments. with that cover on the table and the lid on the reservoir no light (or very little) should shine on the water.

 

now it's time to germinate your seeds...

 

take them and place them evenly spaced onto 1/2 a folded up damp wash cloth. the idea here is to place the seeds all over 1/2 the towel, then fold the other half on top. then you slide the towel into a ziplock baggie and place it in a drawer or cupboard (cool dark place). in a few days your seeds have sprouted.

 

now take the sprouts and place them into the wire baskets full with the hydroton rocks. then back fill more hydroton into the pots to prop the sprouts upright in the baskets reaching for your lights.

 

at this point all you need to do is monitor the PH and nutrient levels of the water. everything else s totally automated. depending on the plants and your level of controlled environment (light, CO2, nutrients, ect...) you can trick the plants into producing incredible yeilds in just a matter of months.

 

the only plant i have experience with could produce 4 times an outdoor one, from seed to harvest, in 4 months (considerably shorter time than an outdoor one).

 

for those who worry about having any left over nutrients or chemicals in their peppers all you need to do is switch to pure water rather than a nutrient bath during the last week of growth. this forces the plant to use up any of it's stored nutrients and ensures you only taste the plant, not the nutrients.

 

The peppers grow out of the centre of the flower as the flower dies. Buds are the green squishy thingies that unfold into flowers.

Yeah, you might want to cut them off untill the plant is bigger, a bigger plant can support more peppers. And I *think* the presence of peppers slows plant growth, I havent read up on this stuff since I planted them.

I posted a link a while back in this thread to the growing instructions.

 

yes, the more peppers a plant tries to grow the more nutrients the plant needs to devote to each pepper. in a hydroponics system this isn't a concern because you control everything and can give your plants more nutrients when need be.

 

when growing outdoors in "iffy" soil it may be best to pluck a few peppers to ensure the ones you leave to grow get more attention from the plant.

 

Pity, I had my red savina and hothazel outside, and the aphids came. Those are really really difficult to remove. The plants were flowering like nuts, but the dead flowers fell off and I only have a couple RS on the plant right now.

 

Me? Not like chemicals?

 

I tried a couple different anti aphids pesticides, but they keep coming back.

 

I think the flowers are falling off because of the time of year, and light and such, not because of the aphids.

 

lady bugs are the answer to the aphids and spider mite problem. they can be slightly annoying but those bastards will pick a plant clean of pests in no time. at the garden center ask about "beneficial insects" there might be more that i don't know about if ladybugs also eat peppers. they left my plants alone but i've never tried growing peppers before so i could be wrong.

 

I dunno what the fuck is wrong with my plants. The seeds germinate, but the plants dont get taller than 2". I am thinking too little phosphate. any of you have any ideas?

 

call around garden centers and ask what the ideal ph and nutrient balance is for your particular plant. they should have a garden guide that tells you the best conditions to grow peppers in. i'd imagine a hotter than average climate would be best, so if you live in northern climates it's going to be difficult to grow them properly unless you go hydro and control the room temp and CO2 ppm.

 

 

The gibberellic acid promotes fruiting and larger fruits. I'm not sure how that corresponds with capsacin levels within, but the peppers would be larger and more plentiful.

 

there is a product called "dip n grow" which i believe contains gibberelic acid. it's used to prep cuttings for cloning and can also be added to seeds and flowers in diluted amounts to promote growth. if you can't get this acid from a school lab then it may be available under this name. but check to make sure it's the sae chem. either way, whatever this stuff is, it works real well.

 

i swear by it.

 

had an over %90 survival rate transferring cut clones from the momma to the propagation tray.

 

good luck everyone, and if i can be of any more help let me know i'll do the best i can.

Edited August 20, 2008 by ST1DinOH

[oskarchem]

I'm interested in this extraction, might try it in the future; I have a quote from the French wikipedia, and I would like to know if this is true:

 

Wikipedia: "Consuming a large amount of Capsaicin gives you euphoria, or an intense sensation of pleasure"

 

Now this dosen't exacty sound true, and eavn if it is, it would most surely be the most painfule euphoria/pleasure in your life

[asilentbob]

Thanks for all that, but I had kinda already read about it lol.

 

I being a cheap bastard and obsessed with DIY can't really justify spending $50 on something to grow a plant that I can buy for like $5.

 

I did try making a bubbler system though with hydroton and 3L soda bottles where the plants roots are always in the nutrient system and the aquarium bubbler is constantly aeroating the liquid. The particular plant I tried it on didn't like it one bit as it hates excessive moisture... BUT there are other plants out there that would love it.

 

At some point I'll set up an ebb and flow system of some kind. I do have a pump that runs on 12V DC meant for pumping water out of flooded boats and such.

 

I just got a automatic drip system from harbor freight tools. Not necissarily hydroponics, but it will constantly water plants planted in soil for me, of which I have many. Hell I might be able to figure out some way to make an ebb and flow system out of it using a pump to supply the pressure needed or something, then have some kind of solenoid controlled gates or a gate to drain the nutrients out of individual containers. The automatic water kit was like $7 on sale from $8 and comes with like 50ft of hose line with many individual drip stakes included.

[ST1DinOH]

Thanks for all that, but I had kinda already read about it lol.

 

I being a cheap bastard and obsessed with DIY can't really justify spending $50 on something to grow a plant that I can buy for like $5.

 

I did try making a bubbler system though with hydroton and 3L soda bottles where the plants roots are always in the nutrient system and the aquarium bubbler is constantly aeroating the liquid. The particular plant I tried it on didn't like it one bit as it hates excessive moisture... BUT there are other plants out there that would love it.

 

At some point I'll set up an ebb and flow system of some kind. I do have a pump that runs on 12V DC meant for pumping water out of flooded boats and such.

 

I just got a automatic drip system from harbor freight tools. Not necissarily hydroponics, but it will constantly water plants planted in soil for me, of which I have many. Hell I might be able to figure out some way to make an ebb and flow system out of it using a pump to supply the pressure needed or something, then have some kind of solenoid controlled gates or a gate to drain the nutrients out of individual containers. The automatic water kit was like $7 on sale from $8 and comes with like 50ft of hose line with many individual drip stakes included.

 

well...

 

if you use a timer switch on a pump in a bucket you can easily have that bucket of nutrient solution feed the drip system. this way it'd be the same thing.

 

you just need to figure out how fast that water pumps.

 

in fact you'd probably need to plug the pump into a float switch, and the float switch into a timer.

 

this way the timer will kick on and pump the nutrient solution up to the drip systems bottle. once the bucket is empty the float switch turns off the pump just before it pumps empty. pump would stay off and by the time the nutrient bath works back to the pump bucket the timer is shut off.

 

thats probably the best way to do it using what you have.

 

with peppers and a drip system you might just want to go with rockwool cubes. these are different sized blocks of a thick wool padding looking material that is ideal for root medium.

 

nice part about the rockwool is you can buy small cubes which fit into medium cubes which fit into larger cubes, ect...

 

this way transplanting is a cake walk just put the smaller block into the next size cube and it's a perfect fit.

 

i've never used rockwool but i've seen great results with it. the added bennifit to rockwool is it's a very popular system for upscale hydroponics systems and they make thier own special designed nutrient chemicals for it. meaning thier website probably has a chart recomending the best combination of thier products to use in each scenario.

 

rockwool has a slightly higher PH so you need to lower the PH on your mix, make sure to ask whoever you buy it from what the offset is because i can't remember.

 

try to find a brew n grow near you....here's the site from one of them, there seems to be quite a few now.

 

http://www.brewngrow.com/

[tentacles]

No, it's true. I especially like the 'high' from hot asian chiles (thai in particular).

 

I'm interested in this extraction, might try it in the future; I have a quote from the French wikipedia, and I would like to know if this is true:

 

Wikipedia: "Consuming a large amount of Capsaicin gives you euphoria, or an intense sensation of pleasure"

 

Now this dosen't exacty sound true, and eavn if it is, it would most surely be the most painfule euphoria/pleasure in your life

[crazyboy25]

Came back and found a chili plant growing I harvested and got about 15 bright red peppers that look like habeneros. I forget what they are my mom says they are Cubans or hubans or something but I checked and no pepper matches that name.