Swede Posted June 12, 2008 Posted June 12, 2008 I agree with bonny. I've got that same "ball mill" and it makes good BP given the proper ingredients, but even with a jar correctly charged with good media, it takes 18 to 24 hours. I bought one of the eBay "hobfir" mills too, and it is a much better unit, but I still use my rock tumbler to mill straight chems and the occasional small BP batch. Be sure to check every few hours to be sure the mixture is not clumping or otherwise avoiding the media. If the jar isn't correctly charged, it seems much of the mixture finds its way into zones in the jar not impacted well. There it sits, rotating in place, and not getting ground much at all. If working on a budget (aren't we all, to some degree) electricity for a long mill session is cheaper than a $200 to $500 "real" ball mill. Hell, I bet you could hook a mill to a gerbil wheel, and with enough gearing, the gerbil can make BP... in a month perhaps! Rodent Power!
Mumbles Posted June 12, 2008 Posted June 12, 2008 To buy a "proper" mill, this is probably the cheapest place. Around $175 plus shipping for a mill that can handle approximatly a kilo of BP. You will have to supply media. http://stores.ebay.com/Ball-Mills-N-Rock-Tumblers
DeepOvertone Posted June 12, 2008 Author Posted June 12, 2008 Thanks everyone, I will be staying with my small mill for a while. I've just heard that long milling sessions can take their toll on the little rubber belt on these things. Even though I am on a budget, I dont mind spending some cash if its worth it.
FrankRizzo Posted June 12, 2008 Posted June 12, 2008 Thanks everyone, I will be staying with my small mill for a while. I've just heard that long milling sessions can take their toll on the little rubber belt on these things. Even though I am on a budget, I dont mind spending some cash if its worth it. Upgrade that little rubber band with something more substantial. McMaster Carr sells "2L-Section" V-belts for under $5 that would be perfect and last *many* times longer than the original one.
DeepOvertone Posted June 25, 2008 Author Posted June 25, 2008 I'm happy to report that I finally got around to milling my powder for allot longer to see if it helped. It certainly did!! I took a portion of a 4 hr mill time batch and milled it for about 18 more hours. I compared one gram of each. I poured the powder into a piece of paper folded in half to make a little trough. The powder covered about 10 inches of the trough. I did notice that the longer milled powder was much less dense and covered more of the length of the paper. I lit them both and the stuff that was milled for longer certainly burned faster. The old stuff caught the paper on fire but the new stuff barely burnt a few little holes in the paper. This is exciting for me because the old stuff pressed into a 3lb end burner was able to get itself off the groud, albeit it barely made it 50 ft in the air. And that was an END BURNER!! I'm just imagening this stuff made with proper charcoal milled for a long time and pressed into a core burner. That sucker would be mean.... I'm going to ram up another end burner and see how much more power this additional milling has given me.
DeepOvertone Posted June 25, 2008 Author Posted June 25, 2008 SUCCESS!! It had plenty enough power to lift itself. I don't know how much of a header I could put on it but for now I know my BP is getting much better. It burned for too long IMO so I'm gonna have to get some better charcoal and try it so see if I can get more power out of it. I guess I could always just drill a bit of a core and that would increase the power and decrease the burn time. Anyway, a big THANK YOU to all that have posted their comments and ideas.
FrankRizzo Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 Photon: Next time you order charcoal from Skylighter, order their 80mesh product. I've found that it makes BP with ~25% more power than that made from their airfloat. My guess is that the airfloat is the waste from one of the major lump charcoal mfgs in the US and likely contains considerable amounts of inert minerals and ash. The 80-mesh is more likely to be actual charcoal, it's less messy when loading into the ball mill, and you can use it as-is for additions to BP rocket propellant for spark generation.
Photon_Junkie Posted June 26, 2008 Posted June 26, 2008 I can give that a try. However, I am finding my powder is still pretty good. On my 2F I have had to decrease it by 20% in both my starmines and aerial shells. It was a bit too hot for both. I now lift a standard 2" shell with about 9 grams. At 12 grams the things were whistling and frying my mortars. After talking with you all, I do have to admit want to try an make my own charcoal. If no other reason than to build a campfire!
iclazion Posted July 15, 2008 Posted July 15, 2008 From a newby to a newby. My first real descent fireworks assignment I tackled with the help of every one here was a 4" aerial shell. Yes you got that right 4" not 2. So with 13 years of making really crap green powder/meal "slow burning black powder" I finally took the dive and made my bp the way it should be done. With all the advice of every one here, sending in my step by step photo's and comments they all helped. On 7 days after new year 2007 I slid my ball shell with 3 star header into the tube by means of a robe and expected the worse. A flower pot. I lit the fuse, and waited, and waited and waited till the quick match made it's all familiar bang, and a huge flame licked out of the pipe. A glowing golden light trailing into the air. Booom, perfect gold glitter filled the air. With the people here you will have the same good luck and fortune, trust me. good luck and stay in touch.
KAP Posted July 20, 2008 Posted July 20, 2008 Hi Frank & MumblesAre you saying that you are having better results with the 80 mesh? and to add 25% more that the stock 75-15-10 or is it 25% of the whole amount? I also picked up some of the Cowboy Brand charcoal Mumbles, and was wondering if this % increase also applies. I have the Thumblers AR15 with the octaconal Rubber drum with 1/2'' ceramic media and it keeps caking up the ends after 8 or 9 hrs. I know the materials are dry and have used many different sources. It also seems like I needed to add more cowboy charcoal to increase the burn speed. I want to be a cowboy charcoal fan, got a big bag. Thanks, KP
LGM Posted July 20, 2008 Posted July 20, 2008 Cowboy brand is hardwood charcoal and I have never been able to make very fast BP from it. Just use it when you want sparks.
Richtee Posted July 20, 2008 Posted July 20, 2008 Hi Frank & MumblesAre you saying that you are having better results with the 80 mesh? and to add 25% more that the stock 75-15-10 or is it 25% of the whole amount? I also picked up some of the Cowboy Brand charcoal Mumbles, and was wondering if this % increase also applies. I have the Thumblers AR15 with the octaconal Rubber drum with 1/2'' ceramic media and it keeps caking up the ends after 8 or 9 hrs. I know the materials are dry and have used many different sources. It also seems like I needed to add more cowboy charcoal to increase the burn speed. I want to be a cowboy charcoal fan, got a big bag. Thanks, KP You should read the new "Charcoal tutorial" by Niter in the Tutorial Forum...
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