DJPork Posted November 29, 2007 Posted November 29, 2007 Hey everybody. Just wondering, are stainless steel balls suitable for using as milling media for BP? All I know is that they are much less likely to spark than regular steel, but how much less likely? Do they only spark on freak occasions when they strike against each onther with enormous force, or is it possible for them to spark in my (slow) mill? Up untill now I had been using 2p coins, which don't mill that well. I know a guy who can make me some 1/2" stainless steel balls. Thanks.
Bonny Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 Hey everybody. Just wondering, are stainless steel balls suitable for using as milling media for BP? All I know is that they are much less likely to spark than regular steel, but how much less likely? Do they only spark on freak occasions when they strike against each onther with enormous force, or is it possible for them to spark in my (slow) mill? Up untill now I had been using 2p coins, which don't mill that well. I know a guy who can make me some 1/2" stainless steel balls. Thanks.Even if they may spark on freak occasions, it is not worth the risk. I'd go with lead or brass.
WarezWally Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 I know of someone who is using iron rod cut up into small pieces, I told him hes going to kill himself but he wont listen. Any suggestions?
crazyboy25 Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 if your friend is stupid enough to use iron media he is stupid enough to belive this was caused by not using the correct milling media:http://www.breadonthewaters.com/add/0888_nuclear_explosion_large_clipart.jpg but seriously show him how powerful and easily lit black powder is.
WarezWally Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 I referenced him to the AFN ball mill experiment where they intentionally blew one up. I was scared shitless and I'm using lead media, I don't think it phased him at all which is... disturbing to say the least. If he wont listen to reason maybe his will listen when the thing goes off.
asilentbob Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 OP:Musket balls are great. I have read that SS doesn't spark, but i don't believe it. 1/2" are a little small since its not as dense as lead IMO. Solid brass rod would be a good source of media, just cutting off every OD in length and sanding the edges for lots of cylinders... WarezWally:Go up to the gun store... buy some .54 lead musket balls... when hes not watching sift out the iron media and put the musket balls in... Happy X-mas! *I'm in your ball mill up-grading your media* Iron rod or steel rod if its heavy enough and big enough would work well for milling home made Al powder or MgAl since its much harder than lead. I would love to get about 3 or 4lbs of 3/4" and 1" SS balls for a good price... but thats not going to happen... waaay too expensive... I'll have to try to remember to look into solid rod prices at the local hardware store...
Bonny Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 I would love to get about 3 or 4lbs of 3/4" and 1" SS balls for a good price... but thats not going to happen... waaay too expensive... I'll have to try to remember to look into solid rod prices at the local hardware store... You would be better off trying a scrap yard for the stainless (or any steel and even some Al for that matter) They usually charge by weight so it will be much cheaper than any hardware store. It is always hit and miss as selection changes.
pudidotdk Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 One must remember that SS and steel are two different things.Steel will guarantee a blow-up of your mill if milling BP, whereas some types of stainless steel (the 300 types) are suitable for milling BP.
Mumbles Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 I don't know if I would go as far as to say they're suitable. Safer than normal steel or iron, yes. Milling individual materials, yes, and probably one of the better choices. Given the price difference between SS and brass, there is really no reason to use something you are unsure about it's safety. A quick ebay search gives pretty similar pricing for brass and SS (304 grade at least).
pudidotdk Posted November 30, 2007 Posted November 30, 2007 Well, off course you can not be 100% sure that it won't spark. I'm just kinda trusty on this one, I know a professional pyrotechnician that has made tons of black powder batches (literally?) with SS media. It doesn't promise it won't spark, but I trust passfires little note on SS as a good choice for milling media for BP.
DJPork Posted December 1, 2007 Author Posted December 1, 2007 Okie dokie. No need to take pointless risks if I am unsure what type of SS these balls are. Perhaps I shall 'borrow' some brass wieghts from the physics department. Thanks for imput. Maybe stopped a serious accident.
Mumbles Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 Don't be an asshole and go stealing things. Lead is very cheap and will make a quite suitible media. Even for a rather large drum, 1kilogram or so BP capacity, the lead media will still run you less than $30.
deadman Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 Or.......even free. I got my lead from spent tire weights and my mold was a 2x4.
WarezWally Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 Ive got way to much lead laying around SS does spark just that it takes a lot of impact force for it to happen.
ActiveA Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 I use coins... 5c works fine, I tested them trying to get them to spark with no success, or i use Lead fishing sinkers. Works fine.
DJPork Posted December 1, 2007 Author Posted December 1, 2007 Before using my 2ps as media, I held a magnet over 'em. A couple were magnetic for some wierd reason, so I didn't use them and just fired in the rest. Not exactly perfect method of determining if they're safe or not... Meh, I've made kilos of the stuff (I find using coins takes FOREVER to get decent BP) without problem. Oh, and about the stealing thing... I'm not trying to completely justify it, it IS wrong to steal, but the weights I have in mind have been gathering dust at the back of the store room for as long as I've been at that crappy school. In experiments and such, we only evey use these other steel wieghts. As well as this, I need like 10 of them, there is an entire droor full of them. I'll look around for free media first, ($30 is money I don't have) but if that fails... I know it's wrong.... Just not too wrong to not actually do it. edit: lol... "I'm trying to completely justify (stealing)". That's quite the typo .
Mumbles Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 10 weights isn't going to be adequate to mill anything. Pyro is not a cheap hobby, if you can't aford even the bare requirements, perhaps you should look elsewhere. It seems you are lacking a few other things, such as maturity anyway. $30 is for a 1 kilo capacity mill. It sounds more like you're doing around 100-200g at a time. I wouldn't expect to pay anymore that $6 for some lead shot for a mill like this.
DJPork Posted December 1, 2007 Author Posted December 1, 2007 Yeah, using an old rock tumler a friend gave me. It's pretty dreadfull really, put any more than ~350gs of comp + media it slows down to about 1/2 an rpm. Pyro is not a cheap hobby, if you can't aford even the bare requirements, perhaps you should look elsewhere. Meh. Being 15, living deep in the country (no jobs I can easily get to) and in full time education shouldn't mean that I have to completely stop the only interesting thing to out here. Just means I buy dusting sulfur, fertilizer for KNO3, make my own charcoal tooling tubes and fuse. In my opinion, doing all this stuff yourself and on a budget makes pyro much more interesting and fun. I've always thought of buying expensive rocket tooling or premade black powder almost as cheating. If you buy your tubes, tools, BP, shell casings, fuse and whatever else, why not just buy some fireworks? It's cheaper. Just my own thoughts.
Mumbles Posted December 1, 2007 Posted December 1, 2007 So it'd be alright to steal rocket tooling, but not buy it huh? By your logic, why not just go get some lead and cast it yourself? It's more home made that purchasing lead media, or stealing brass, etc.
DJPork Posted December 2, 2007 Author Posted December 2, 2007 So it'd be alright to steal rocket tooling, but not buy it huh? ...No... I never said it wasn't "alright" to buy rocket tooling, I just said that I personally enjoy making my own tooling and find it much more rewarding to see a successfull device when you have put some real effort into it, rather than piling some bits and peices together. In pyro, like many things in life, the more you put in, the more you get out of it. By your logic, why not just go get some lead and cast it yourself? It's more home made that purchasing lead media, or stealing brass, etc. And why not make my own paper from the trees in my garden? Why not mine my own sulphur? Well, for a start the equipment needed to cast lead isn't something I can make, and to buy would cost a fortune. Sure, I would make the media myself if it were practical, but it isn't. I'm not proud of what I'm going to do, I know that it's wrong - which makes it even more immoral. The fact is, however that with me having no money, getting no allowance and being unable to get a job I can't buy the media for my mill. I go to a ridiculously over-funded school full of snobs and arseholes. I know for a fact they don't use the brass I want. That's not to say they definately wont in the future hence the whole me feeling bad about it. Having said that, I see little moral difference between buying something from any of the hundreds of companys that use sweatshops or whatever. Something which most people do all the time. Eh.. I'm exhausted right now, sorry if what I just said makes absoloutly no sense whatever. Night night.
Mumbles Posted December 2, 2007 Posted December 2, 2007 Yep, casting lead is so expensive. http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/1501720/2/istockphoto_1501720_2x4.jpg http://i.ehow.com/images/ehows/steps/spadebitstep1_L.jpg
deadman Posted December 2, 2007 Posted December 2, 2007 Don't forget the Very expensive steel crucible.http://www.reusacan.com/images/bean_can.jpg
oskarchem Posted December 2, 2007 Posted December 2, 2007 Hmmm... Yes Lead expensive...Did you think about getting some air gun pellets their Lead/antimony Melt it with a blow torch or a bunsen burner and do the tutorial on making media so a list of things you need:-Lead pellets 2$/150 pellets so let's say you need 5 boxes so thats 10$-Blowtorch 5$-Plaster 5$So that's a total of what approx 20$...
DJPork Posted December 2, 2007 Author Posted December 2, 2007 Ah, I was misinformed. I was thinking more along the lines of getting a cast from wolter pyro tools. so right there that's 70-80 bucks + I would have no idea where to get lead/pellets, so if I didn't find a way that's +$16 + blowtorch and god knows how much postage is for a massive lead bar/lead cast from America. Way over $100 overall I'm sure. Okay, so I can make my own cast. I thought that it had to be made out steel or something. That was dumb. Even if I could source it all for $20, that is still more money than I have right now. I literally have no money right now, except for a handfull of 2ps in my milling jar. I am going to try to make it on my own, but might be very hard on a budget of next to nothing. First question is, where can I get lead (other than from lead pellets) for a few quid? Other thing I need to know is: can lead hold heat long enough to reach 327 degrees under a wood fire? Thanks.
WarezWally Posted December 2, 2007 Posted December 2, 2007 Scrap metal yard, sheeting from your roof, tyre shops, gun store. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LETTERPRESS-LEAD-10p...1QQcmdZViewItem
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