Bonny Posted April 24, 2011 Posted April 24, 2011 The main problem because I won't use it is its consumption - 3,6A at 230V = 830W ! If I run this thing for about a month, it's gonna eat my wallet for electricity bill. It would be useful if I could make a cell with 100A current pumping into it, but I really can't do that. So I'll look for another option. Why not just get a lab power supply and save all the hassle? Many of them are capable of 100A or more. I also don't see why a computer power supply (~20A) won't suffice...how much chlorate do you need?
Arthur Posted April 24, 2011 Posted April 24, 2011 "The main problem because I won't use it is its consumption - 3,6A at 230V = 830W !" quote 50AE That should be the maximum consumption at full load on all the outputs. It would be a poor computer power supply that is less than 80% efficient power in vs power out. Keep searching ebay for a big power supply unit.
50AE Posted April 27, 2011 Posted April 27, 2011 Currently I'm using an ATX power supply, but I want more than 20A of current. Say, 40 or 50 amps. Why not get a lab power supply? Because I'm poor. I'll just search for another transformer.
Bonny Posted April 27, 2011 Posted April 27, 2011 Currently I'm using an ATX power supply, but I want more than 20A of current. Say, 40 or 50 amps. Why not get a lab power supply? Because I'm poor. I'll just search for another transformer. You could add a second power supply (with some diodes to your cell) Or run 2 20A cells....
pdfbq Posted April 28, 2011 Posted April 28, 2011 (edited) You could add a second power supply (with some diodes to your cell) This works, I did it this way. On drawback though, you can not switch off your cell for a minute or so. When the cell is hot and drawing like 40 amps,when you turn back on your power supplies they will shutdown immediately as shortcut prevention (because they wont be up at exactly the same time) You have to let your cell cool down first or remove your anode and lower it slowly back into the mother liquid. Edited April 28, 2011 by pdfbq
WSM Posted May 18, 2011 Posted May 18, 2011 I've been using 1/2" OD titanium tubing for tubular leads and a couple weeks ago it dawns on me, why?! It isn't going to carry 300 Amps, for Pete's sake. So I start to look more closely at smaller tubing; specifically 6mm and 8mm offered on eBay. I figure I can seal them in 1/4" and 5/16" PVDF compression fittings and not have to worry about salt-creep eating my electrical connections; AND they will carry enough current to do the job ! Another plus is I'll use less solder to fill them (this just gets better and better ). I'm tied up with tool orders, so I can't do much before they're done, but after that, I'm on it! WSM
WSM Posted May 22, 2011 Posted May 22, 2011 MMO/titanium mesh is available on eBay the next three days. Check out eBay items:260786610645 330566322307 330566322005 This material is like the material SWEDE was selling (but without the straps) up till last year. I can vouch for the seller (quality material and fast shipping). No, I don't get a cut (heck, I wish I did; I'd take it in material ), but I am a happy customer ! WSM
pdfbq Posted May 23, 2011 Posted May 23, 2011 I know, I'm totally off topic sorry. Has anybody heard anything from Swede lately? I heard a rumor he was ill BUT thats just a rumor. Maybe it is totally not appropriate to ask a question like this here but every time I go to this forum I think about it.
dagabu Posted May 23, 2011 Posted May 23, 2011 I know, I'm totally off topic sorry. Has anybody heard anything from Swede lately? I heard a rumor he was ill BUT thats just a rumor. Maybe it is totally not appropriate to ask a question like this here but every time I go to this forum I think about it. We really dont know. There is no answer to any form of communication that we have been able to think of. -dag
WSM Posted May 24, 2011 Posted May 24, 2011 I know, I'm totally off topic sorry. Has anybody heard anything from Swede lately? I heard a rumor he was ill BUT thats just a rumor. Maybe it is totally not appropriate to ask a question like this here but every time I go to this forum I think about it. No, nothing at all since last July that I'm aware of. Too bad, too; because there is so much to share with him and to learn from him, yet. His blogs are still a valuable asset, but I wish they were continuing... WSM
WSM Posted May 29, 2011 Posted May 29, 2011 No, nothing at all since last July that I'm aware of. Too bad, too; because there is so much to share with him and to learn from him, yet. His blogs are still a valuable asset, but I wish they were continuing... WSM Though we haven't heard from Swede, I recently did hear from tentacles. He's been out of touch due to the past year being devoted to his family (he's been a dad almost a year now,...Congratulations, tentacles!!!). Tentacles has worked with Swede on the various aspects of LD electrode plating and chlorate as well as perchlorate making on a small scale. I look forward to his future contributions here . WSM
WSM Posted May 29, 2011 Posted May 29, 2011 After spending most of the day turning metal to fill a rocket tool order, I took a break by finishing a pair of custom electrodes for a friend (see photo below). We decided to offset the placement of the leads so the plastic fittings (Kynar) wouldn't interfere with each other and also allow any spacing desired for the electrode plates. I filled the 6mm CP titanium leads with lead-free solder to increase conductivity and lower the heat of the electrical connection. Titanium leads are probably 10% as conductive as copper, and that inefficiency expresses itself as heat which won't do the plastic compression fittings any good at all . The solder I used is 95% tin and 5% silver. Luckily, I had just enough to do the job. I shudder to think what it will cost to buy another pound of it ! The nice thing about the smaller leads is that the ID of the tubing is 4mm which is about perfect for tapping with 10-32 threads (which I did, but the cost of special taps for titanium was not trivial). After filling the leads with solder I cleaned the threads with a tap and inserted stainless steel machine screws and a pair of stainless steel washers in each one for electrical connections. The plastic fittings include a Kynar nut because my friend's tank has a thin lid and won't lend itself to drilling and tapping like I do for mine. They remind me of a type which would work for a "bucket cell". These electrodes should provide years of service and lots of clean chlorate for the new owner . WSM
50AE Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 (edited) Nice job WSM! One thing about my chlorate production. Each time I refill the cell with fertilizer KCl, bubbles are evolved and then an... ughhhh, disgusting smell. It's not chlorine, it's not an irritating odour, it's like something sweet, shit, and vomit are mixed together. It almost made me puke infront of my cell today. And then, a white foam like from someone's mouth appears on the surface, making the thing even more.. unattractive. Also, this KCl seems to be acidic, it lowers the pH a little bit. Edited May 31, 2011 by 50AE
WSM Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Nice job WSM! One thing about my chlorate production. Each time I refill the cell with fertilizer KCl, bubbles are evolved and then an... ughhhh, disgusting smell. It's not chlorine, it's not an irritating odour, it's like something sweet, shit, and vomit are mixed together. It almost made me puke infront of my cell today. And then, a white foam like from someone's mouth appears on the surface, making the thing even more.. unattractive. Also, this KCl seems to be acidic, it lowers the pH a little bit. Thanks, 50AE . I've never had agricultural KCl so I don't know what's in there, but it sounds nasty . You may want to purify it before it goes into the cell. Perhaps one or two recrystallization cycles before it goes in? If it is acidic maybe the addition of a small amount of an alkaline potassium salt (preferably one compatible with the cell's chemistry) would help. Weak KOH would likely help. At the very least, dissolve and strain the fertilizer KCl through a sieve before recrytallizing, to remove any solid contaminants that may be there. The bubbles/foam might be some sort of protein (especially if some sort of fecal matter is in there) and you definately want to remove any of that. If the nasty stuff doesn't appear until the salt is added to the cell, you may want to set aside some of the mother liquor (mainly KOCl) to treat the salt solution before filtering and recrytallizing. At least the potassium hypochlorite will help sterilize the solution ! Hopefully, some of these suggestions help. Let us know. WSM
50AE Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 It's only the odour that disturbs me. Though the product is great and cheap and I used if for KClO3 since long time ago. But I just wondered why the smell.
WSM Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 It's only the odour that disturbs me. Though the product is great and cheap and I used if for KClO3 since long time ago. But I just wondered why the smell. If it works and you're okay with it, keep on using it . I DO hope you're running the cell outdoors , though .
50AE Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 Of course I run my cell outdoors... Otherwise I would be kicked from home, especially with the pH control involved
WSM Posted May 31, 2011 Posted May 31, 2011 (edited) Of course I run my cell outdoors... Otherwise I would be kicked from home, especially with the pH control involved Yup, me too (and I own the place!!! But my wife would toss me and my gear out !!!). Speaking of pH control, I have a fancy peristaltic pump with accurate controls, I was considering using for the job. But, after careful consideration and through judicious eBay purchases, I was able to get the neccessary items to duplicate Swede's gravity fed pH system (see below and compare to Swede's latest blog on the subject). One of the features I like is power economy. The gravity fed system will use much less electrical power. All I have to do is determine the current usage (with a digital DC ammeter I got from China on eBay) and set up the delivery of dilute HCl to maintain the optimal pH for the system (my goal is 6.5 - 6.8, if possible). Swede shared the formula with me over a year ago and it worked great for him (>90% efficiency!). He also mentioned once that he's surprised more of us don't take advantage of the periodic great bargains available on eBay. I am able to get amazing items for sometimes pennies on the dollar. If it weren't for eBay, I wouldn't be near as far along as I am . WSM Edited June 1, 2011 by WSM
pyrojig Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 (edited) Dumb Q., but I havent found SWEDE's blog ... Does anyone have a direct link to it or is it just this thread he's been blogging? Edited June 2, 2011 by pyrojig
WSM Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Dumb Q., but I havent found SWEDE's blog ... Does anyone have a direct link to it or is it just this thread he's been blogging? Not dumb at all...(if you don't know, you don't know!). Go to the top of the page and go to the "Blogs" tab. When it opens, look for the one that has the sub-title, "you'll put your eye out..." Open it and read through...that's it! Good luck and have fun . WSM
Bonny Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Dumb Q., but I havent found SWEDE's blog ... Does anyone have a direct link to it or is it just this thread he's been blogging? The blog is great, but be sure to read this topic from start to finish... lots of great info and experiences shared.
WSM Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 (edited) The blog is great, but be sure to read this topic from start to finish... lots of great info and experiences shared. Absolutely true. In fact, I printed it out and filled a 2-1/2 inch loose leaf binder with all the blogs with an electro-chemical theme, and refer to it often. I believe Swede did the same, refering to it as an online notebook or lab book or something like that. You get the idea. I value his personal messages, too; which were direct helps for specific challenges I faced (am facing) in this pursuit. He also sold me the first MMO mesh I ever owned and several other items he had surplus stock of (at a reasonable cost), and I really appreciate the help. Like he said, there are so few of us out there doing this, we need to encourage each other (or something like that). It's too bad he's moved on to other pursuits; I miss his input here. Maybe tentacles will add some of his insights from time to time? I hope so... WSM Networking is an excellent way to progress your research! Edited June 2, 2011 by WSM
pyrojig Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Absolutely true. In fact, I printed it out and filled a 2-1/2 inch loose leaf binder with all the blogs with an electro-chemical theme, and refer to it often. I believe Swede did the same, refering to it as an online notebook or lab book or something like that. You get the idea. I value his personal messages, too; which were direct helps for specific challenges I faced (am facing) in this pursuit. He also sold me the first MMO mesh I ever owned and several other items he had surplus stock of (at a reasonable cost), and I really appreciate the help. Like he said, there are so few of us out there doing this, we need to encourage each other (or something like that). It's too bad he's moved on to other pursuits; I miss his input here. Maybe tentacles will add some of his insights from time to time? I hope so... WSM Networking is an excellent way to progress your research! Awesome ...Thank you !!!!!
50AE Posted June 2, 2011 Posted June 2, 2011 Added the recrystallized and dried batch to my whole stock. It's about 5kg total for now, I think I'm gonna let to 8kg and turn my cell off. 8kg should be enough for the whole year.The stuff is so bulky, when the crystals are big, unmilled
WSM Posted June 3, 2011 Posted June 3, 2011 Added the recrystallized and dried batch to my whole stock. It's about 5kg total for now, I think I'm gonna let to 8kg and turn my cell off. 8kg should be enough for the whole year.The stuff is so bulky, when the crystals are big, unmilled Excellent!Can you post a photo? WSM
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