bubbelpower Posted February 10, 2006 Posted February 10, 2006 I've always wonderd why some people get all start of the same siza, and somd don't. How could that be? My stars always becomes different sizes. This was split from a different topic, so that is why it starts off kind of randomly.
Mumbles Posted February 12, 2006 Posted February 12, 2006 Some become bigger than others because they arn't being completely cycled around. The top grabs the composition first. Then the bigger stars tend to stay on top, and the smaller stars go to the bottom. This just compounds it. I believe the tire star roller cycles the stars pretty well. From Quest: You have to use a set of star sizing plates to get the sizes you want out.
Kilo_G Posted February 13, 2006 Posted February 13, 2006 If you want to cut down on larger/smaller size stars you need to put your hand in there while the roller is rolling and churn the stars over them selves (do this basically from the beggining). The more you do this the longer it will take your stars to roll to size, however it should result in more even sized stars (because you are frequently moving each stars posistion it will prevent certain stars staying in certain positions) . With time and practice you will figure it out. Star rolling is something that takes practice and unfortuneately can end up costing because of the amounts of comp usually involved. Also certain type of stars roll differntly, mainly charcoal based stars and perchlorate based color stars. Also stars with high metal content/large metal chunks are hard to roll.
kwstag Posted February 13, 2006 Posted February 13, 2006 This is probably going to be your best bet: http://unitednuclear.com/stars.htm
Kilo_G Posted February 13, 2006 Posted February 13, 2006 Something I forgot to mention. If you're looking for cores try the dragon eggs from inside crackling balls. Each pack of crackling balls contains six crackling balls and each box contains 12 pack (I believe, can't remember right now). At any rate, they are small round balls and will obviously burn/disintergrate unlike other types of cores, mainly lead or vermiculite. These dragon eggs are quite pussy and you'll be lucky is you even hear a crack/see a pop, especially if they're being used in a nitrate based star. A box of crackling balls should give you (I would estimate) 1,000 to 3,000 cores. Alternatively, I've never tried it, but you could try buying the cheap crackling reloadable shells and robbing the shells of their dragon eggs, these dragon eggs are more powerfull.
Star_Roller Posted February 18, 2006 Posted February 18, 2006 I've tried to roll some dragon eggs didnt quite work well since they are super small. But I will try again later and when they burnt you don't really hear them the mostly just brake the stars up from inside out since the heating up. But this was just my own experience with them.
Mumbles Posted February 19, 2006 Posted February 19, 2006 Do you mean you tried to roll the dragon eggs themselves, or roll using them as cores? I don't think you could roll them. Rolling produces a less dense star than cutting, or in this case granulating. For the dual phase reaction, I think decent density is a key. Besides that, you'd have to roll on something like sand for them to even have a chance to work adequately. When they get too big, they stop working correctly.
Star_Roller Posted February 19, 2006 Posted February 19, 2006 Yes I used them as cores it doesn't work right but I've read some things about making formulas that do work like that. But I do not have the chems to do those so I wont be able to post about doing it.
Kilo_G Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I've never seen a problem with rolling on crackling ball dragon eggs. They key to rolling up from pretty small and somewhat light weight core (like crackling ball dragon eggs) is taking it slow. You only increase comp and water/alcohol as star size increases. If you can visually see that all the stars are evenly damp, add comp, let it roll for a minute or 5. If they are all still damp add a little more comp. Keep doing that until you can see that the stars are no longer visually damp/not picking up comp then add a sprtiz of water. DO NOT let a bunch of dry comp accumulate at the bottom of or leading wave of the stars and attempt to fix it by adding a bunch of water/alcohol, they will spike if you do. People are often not patient enough when rolling stars and that's usually what leads to junk/spiked stars. They want to put in too much comp or water/alcohol at once. Slow and steady and they'll come out fine.
Frozentech Posted February 21, 2006 Posted February 21, 2006 I've never seen a problem with rolling on crackling ball dragon eggs. They key to rolling up from pretty small and somewhat light weight core (like crackling ball dragon eggs) is taking it slow. You only increase comp and water/alcohol as star size increases. If you can visually see that all the stars are evenly damp, add comp, let it roll for a minute or 5. If they are all still damp add a little more comp. Keep doing that until you can see that the stars are no longer visually damp/not picking up comp then add a sprtiz of water. DO NOT let a bunch of dry comp accumulate at the bottom of or leading wave of the stars and attempt to fix it by adding a bunch of water/alcohol, they will spike if you do. People are often not patient enough when rolling stars and that's usually what leads to junk/spiked stars. They want to put in too much comp or water/alcohol at once. Slow and steady and they'll come out fine. Have you ever run into any problems with KNO3 leaching into the dragons eggs and spoiling the effect ? I've read about that happening, so when I made eggs I used the wax coating method to protect against it. They were used as the effect by themselves, with a hot perc prime under a BP prime, and worked ok, but it seemed like a lot of trouble to go through to cover them with wax. Is that unnecessary to do ?
Kilo_G Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 Ya, slightly, but it's hard to tell accurately. The crackling ball dragon eggs now a days are really pussy. You don't use them because you really want a dragon egg effect, they're not good enough for that. I just think they make an excellent core to roll on. I've seen the wax coating thing and I started laughing. It's silly to go through that much work. I have heard of (can't remember where), and wish someone could verify this, people using one of the MinWax products. MinWax is that shit in the aerosol cans that your grandmother sprays on her wood tables. I guess one of them has some kind of polymer in it that is just like wax and will protect the homemade dragon eggs (read dragon eggs that actually crackle) from nitrate leeching. I wish someone could show me the thing where I read that. Might have been a skylighter news letter?
Frozentech Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 Ya, slightly, but it's hard to tell accurately. The crackling ball dragon eggs now a days are really pussy. You don't use them because you really want a dragon egg effect, they're not good enough for that. I just think they make an excellent core to roll on. I've seen the wax coating thing and I started laughing. It's silly to go through that much work. I have heard of (can't remember where), and wish someone could verify this, people using one of the MinWax products. MinWax is that shit in the aerosol cans that your grandmother sprays on her wood tables. I guess one of them has some kind of polymer in it that is just like wax and will protect the homemade dragon eggs (read dragon eggs that actually crackle) from nitrate leeching. I wish someone could show me the thing where I read that. Might have been a skylighter news letter? Minwax eh ? I might give that a try in a couple weeks. Minwax actually makes a broad range of wood finishing products, stains, waxes, even some home polishes like you mention. I use Minwax wood hardener to make cardboard 2" mortar tubes last a long time, and on paper hemis for ball shells to prevent them from getting soggy when pasted... Maybe the wood hardener will work. Have to make up some more dragon eggs and see... meanwhile I will search throught the Skylighter tips. I got the melted wax coating from the fellow who wrote the Passfire article, and yes, too much work.
Mumbles Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 Moved all the unrelated to the article threads to it's own thread.
TheSidewinder Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 LOL, yeah Minwax makes quite a few products. They're actually very high quality. I use Minwax Spar Polyurethane on my work surfaces, and Minwax (Carnauba-containing-something or other) for furniture. One of the furniture waxes would propably do a great job of coating, but it would be a lot of tedious work, wouldn't it? M
bubbelpower Posted February 22, 2006 Author Posted February 22, 2006 http://img164.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bild0220pt.jpg My stars wont get round, they look like somekind of raspberries, Os some cores clumped together to one piece. But it's not. Can someone plz exlpain why this happens.
Chris Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 http://img164.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bild0220pt.jpg My stars wont get round, they look like somekind of raspberries, Os some cores clumped together to one piece. But it's not. Can someone plz exlpain why this happens. It can depend on the comp you are using. While I don't have any problems rolling most comps, charcoal stars do give me a headache. If stars start to clump together, as your stars apparently do, you are using too much water. My advice is use only as litle water as the stars need to pick up the comp. When the stars grow, you can start wetting them more.
Givat Posted February 22, 2006 Posted February 22, 2006 I'm using naskar and I didn't had too much problem in the rolling process. but I think using 60\40 water\alcohol in the sprayer helped a lot.
Kilo_G Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 Ya 60/40 is good, especially for charcoal based stars. I'd use a 70/30 or 80/20 for redgum fueled stars. You really need a 60/40 for charcoal based stars (some even use 50/50). Reason being is because if you use straight water it takes the charcoal/star longer to absorb it, causing you to spray too much water which gives you spiked stars. Alcohol, visually, softens charcoal and helps it be more homogeneous. You can use rubbing alcohol.
Givat Posted February 23, 2006 Posted February 23, 2006 I think the alcohol reduces the surface tension of water to make it easier to wet the charcoal.
bubbelpower Posted February 23, 2006 Author Posted February 23, 2006 OK,i think the problem was that i used too much water.Thx guys, I will try a new batch of stars tomorrow
Pennpyro Posted March 2, 2006 Posted March 2, 2006 I am having a problem rolling a Lampblack based composition, and was wondering if anyone has any experience with this. I am using the same process I use for charcol based stars, but the lampblack comp tends to start to form LOTS of tiny stars instead of building up on the larger stars. My stars are growing, but VERY slowly as alot of the dry comp is forming these tiny stars. I am using 60/40 alcohol to water, #8 shot as a core, and rolling in a hobby fireworks star roller.
Star_Roller Posted March 2, 2006 Posted March 2, 2006 I roll a lot of different star compositions and I for one dont like rolling comps with a lot of charcoal. You need to use a binder that will evaporate a lot. I use just straight rubbing alcohol which is at about 91 percent. If you are using dextrin in this it is better to have it mostly dry when rolling. Charcoal absorbs A LOT of water while rolling. Another thing you might try is getting a dish and glueing sandpaper with a very very low grit and seal it with the lead shot in side roughing up and denting the shot up before rolling a charcoal based star. Then put the shot in a little container with some dry comp (use as little as possible.) Then once you are satisfied on how much they are coated start rolling them from there but you want to roll it for awhile useing no binder liquids till they dont pick up anymore comp then do a very light spray over the stars only if you spray any of the comp that is why it starts rolling by itself.Any other q's you can PM me since I know how annoying it is to roll stars sometimes.
Pennpyro Posted March 2, 2006 Posted March 2, 2006 Getting the stars started is not my problem. I roll a thin layer of clay on the shot first, then start the comp. The stars begin to take comp fine and get to about 1/8". As I continue, I start to get the tiny self forming stars and the stars I want to grow dont take the dry comp very well. I just keep forming new tiny stars. I have resorted to reducing the number of stars in my roller to about 30 at a time so I can catch the formation of the small stars befor they get out of hand. This is very time consuming and annoying as I usually roll 200 or more at a time.
Star_Roller Posted March 3, 2006 Posted March 3, 2006 dont coat them in clay (why would you do that in the first place) Iv had cermics in highschool and all the attributes of clay. You dont want to use them try rolling with out clay and rough the shot up. And your probably spraying the comp with water amking it roll or it could be from the clay seeping through and forming with dry comp.
Pennpyro Posted March 3, 2006 Posted March 3, 2006 Coating shot with clay works fine and does not have any adverse effect on the star. It is the recomended first layer if using shot because it is so smooth (Introductory Practical Pyrotechnics by Tom Perigrin). I have made thousands of stars this way and have never had a problem with any comp including high charcoal content stars. Lampblack just seems to have different properties when rolling.
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