Looking for advice on what sized aerial shell to start building as a beginner

[Indypyro317]

I’ve built very simple rocket headings around in the 2 inch size consisting of 70/30 mix and stars repurposed from other fireworks I’ve have a pretty good understanding of chemical and composition sensitivity from making salutes and have studied a lot of information on yt and Skylighter and have decided to try the 8” tiger willow shells from skylighters website but scaled down to 4 inches I was planing on using a hot bp granulated with 20% water  the lift and the same for burst or mill powder coated rice hulls I thought this would be a good way to get into shells and talked to a few shell builder’s at club events and most suggested a 3-5 inch shell with charcoal stars and bp only burst wanted more opinions on what I should start with or if this is a good idea for a first shell project plan on using wallpaper paste, paper shells, time fuse, kraft tape, premade lift cups and homade quick match 

[Indypyro317]

And I already have a 4 inch tube so the 4” just makes the most sense to me 

[Zumber]

You might start from 2 inch first.

I really have no idea of your site where you fire shell.

If there is lot of open space and there should be no any dry grass or flammable things around then it is fine to fire pyrotechnic shell.

Again if it is your first attempt you may fire dummy shell at inclined angle to test your lift.

If you have some experience then fire 2 inch shell then proceed with 1 inch increment.

[AustralianPyromaniac]

Overall good plan. A 4" is larger than what most people start with, but not too large as long as you have somewhere safe to launch it. Are you US based? Using charcoal stars means very few chemicals are needed, chemicals are cheap, no star prime is needed, the compositions are simple with few components and hard to mess up, and the stars are nearly insensitive to shock and friction. You have to assume your BP is going to be subpar as this is your first time, just use straight BP not rice hulls. Charcoal streamer comps are traditionally broken harder than an equivalent color star shell - the hard break sends the stars flying at such high speed they go straight out from the shell and do not droop prior to burning out, this is what makes the shell look like a "spider web".

My only advice is 20% water into BP is too much. Start with 8% and go up to around 15% if needed. 10% is enough for most people. The absolute minimum amount possible should be used

[Indypyro317]

6 hours ago, Zumber said:

You might start from 2 inch first.

I really have no idea of your site where you fire shell.

If there is lot of open space and there should be no any dry grass or flammable things around then it is fine to fire pyrotechnic shell.

Again if it is your first attempt you may fire dummy shell at inclined angle to test your lift.

If you have some experience then fire 2 inch shell then proceed with 1 inch increment.

Thanks for the help and yes I planned to made a shell full of sand that’ll weigh the same or close to my real shell to work out how high I want it to go I’ve shot display shells up to 3 inch on my property I just make sure it’s away for any trees it might run into on its way up and make sure my tube is secure enough 

[Indypyro317]

3 hours ago, AustralianPyromaniac said:

Overall good plan. A 4" is larger than what most people start with, but not too large as long as you have somewhere safe to launch it. Are you US based? Using charcoal stars means very few chemicals are needed, chemicals are cheap, no star prime is needed, the compositions are simple with few components and hard to mess up, and the stars are nearly insensitive to shock and friction. You have to assume your BP is going to be subpar as this is your first time, just use straight BP not rice hulls. Charcoal streamer comps are traditionally broken harder than an equivalent color star shell - the hard break sends the stars flying at such high speed they go straight out from the shell and do not droop prior to burning out, this is what makes the shell look like a "spider web".

My only advice is 20% water into BP is too much. Start with 8% and go up to around 15% if needed. 10% is enough for most people. The absolute minimum amount possible should be used

I am us based and have places to shoot it and also am in a club that has a nice shooting space where they shoot up to 12 inch , but at my home I’ve only shot up to 3 inch never had a issue, would you say there’s a big difference in break size with 3” and 4” I can’t remember where I read the 20% I was planing on making a pretty small batch of bp to start so I don’t waste all my chems from what I’ve read a big issue people have is using low quality charcoal I plan to use a red cedar or Paulownia the Paulownia is quite expensive tho thanks for the advice about the water 

[AustralianPyromaniac]

If you want to avoid wasting chemicals go with 3”. A 4” shell has more than double the internal volume! Bloody 3D shapes, very unintuitive. Break diameter scales much more linearly so a 4” break is not twice as large as a 3”. Viewing distance/ launch height and break strength also impact the perceived performance. 3” or 4” both will look impressive. 

[kristenbrown]

It's great to hear you're stepping into aerial shell building! Given your background with rocket headings and chemical sensitivity, starting with a 3-4 inch shell is a smart move. Here's some direct advice:

Shell Size

• 3-4 Inch Shells: Ideal for beginners—manageable size, good learning curve.

Burst Charge and Lift Powder

• Black Powder (BP): Hot BP granulated with 20% water works well. BP-coated rice hulls for burst are effective and reliable.

Stars

• Charcoal Stars: Simple to make, pleasing effect. Ensure uniform size and proper drying.

Shell Components

• Paper Shells and Wallpaper Paste: Traditional and effective. Easy to handle for beginners.
• Time Fuse and Quick Match: Test and adjust time fuse length. Ensure homemade quick match is safe and reliable.

Safety and Testing

• Safety: Always use protective gear, work in a ventilated area, and follow safety guidelines.
• Testing: Test components separately before assembling a full shell.

Learning and Resources

• Resources: Continue learning from Skylighter, YouTube, and pyrotechnics clubs. Experienced members can provide invaluable insights.

Starting with a 4-inch shell using BP for lift and burst is a solid plan. Keep designs simple initially to master the basics. Share your progress and ask for feedback from the community.

Good luck and stay safe!

[Indypyro317]

3 hours ago, kristenbrown said:

It's great to hear you're stepping into aerial shell building! Given your background with rocket headings and chemical sensitivity, starting with a 3-4 inch shell is a smart move. Here's some direct advice:

Shell Size

• 3-4 Inch Shells: Ideal for beginners—manageable size, good learning curve.

Burst Charge and Lift Powder

• Black Powder (BP): Hot BP granulated with 20% water works well. BP-coated rice hulls for burst are effective and reliable.

Stars

• Charcoal Stars: Simple to make, pleasing effect. Ensure uniform size and proper drying.

Shell Components

• Paper Shells and Wallpaper Paste: Traditional and effective. Easy to handle for beginners.
• Time Fuse and Quick Match: Test and adjust time fuse length. Ensure homemade quick match is safe and reliable.

Safety and Testing

• Safety: Always use protective gear, work in a ventilated area, and follow safety guidelines.
• Testing: Test components separately before assembling a full shell.

Learning and Resources

• Resources: Continue learning from Skylighter, YouTube, and pyrotechnics clubs. Experienced members can provide invaluable insights.

Starting with a 4-inch shell using BP for lift and burst is a solid plan. Keep designs simple initially to master the basics. Share your progress and ask for feedback from the community.

Good luck and stay safe!

Thanks for the advice and I plan on documenting my build to the best of my abilities so others can give tips for different steps they may have learned over the years I watch alot of pyro informative videos and read a lot I plan on starting with this ball shells and if they go good trying a cylinder shell or 2 break color and report cylinder that’s my goal I know this will take a lot time and error and large reports arnt to be played with