Which smokes are bad and which are really bad.

[ITCHI]

We all love the smell of BP smoke and such but which smokes are to be totally avoided and which smokes are not so bad to catch a whiff of now and then?

[tentacles]

Sugar candy is supposed to be nontoxic, but obviously breathing smoke is not a good thing.

 

Anything with HCE is godawful to smell. I understand it's mildly toxic, but the smell itself is truly remarkable.

 

I would avoid anything with realgar in it, obviously.

[weknowpyro]

I would suggest to avoid any Nitrogen Oxide fumes, either being monoxide or dioxide.

I did a little experiment a while back, trying to work out how much Nitrogen dioxide (NO2) you have to inhale before it kills you.

I worked out on a small scale that in a 600ml beaker you need at least 3 litres of Nitrogen dioxide to be fatal. So I would guess my shed would fill to the top with about 20,000 600ml beakers, so 600ml x 20,000 = 12000000 beakers,

12000000 x 3 = 36000000 litres of Nitrogen dioxide, for it to be fatal.

So either my calculations are wildly ridiculous (Which is extremely probable) or in fact, it just goes to prove that Nitrogen dioxide is harmful, but you would need a lot of it to be fatal.

[teknix]

It depends on the amount of time expose and to what concentration. There are toxicity values for nitrogen dioxide here if your interested:

 

http://chem.sis.nlm.nih.gov/chemidplus/jsp...on/Toxicity.jsp

 

Other chemicals are also listed on that site if you want to look up some stuff for other smokes and what might be in them. for nitrogen dioxide they have the lethal concentration for humans listed as 200 mg/L for 1 min exposure.

 

So you would need about 2.4 kg of nitrogen dioxide in your shed to kill you in 1 min. Now it would require less of a concentration if you were to stay in there longer.

[crazyboy25]

i made a smoke mixture a while back 75 slulfur 25 potassium perchlorate it was awfull. sulpfur dioxide burns your eyes nose and lungs. although it isnt bad outside if there was no wind or you did it indoors it would be suffocating the smell of sulfur dioxide is so bad that is what they imagined hell as. "fire and brimstone" brimstone is sulfur priests imagined hell as full of fire and burning sulfur now imagine fire sulfur and potassium perchlorate (its awfull)

[weknowpyro]

Thanks for correcting me anyway, I somehow thought my calculations were abit over the top. Yeah I did write down the times it took when I did the experiment, but when I wrote it up, it had the calulation only without the times in, so I have kind of forgotton on how long it took.

[Mumbles]

Just in general I try to avoid high barium stars. Barium poisoning is pretty aweful I have found out.

 

I've heard of some people wanting to avoid BP milled with lead media, but I don't really see the point in this. BP smoke can also generate a small bit of KCN, just FYI.

[fight fire with fire]

Read somewere that burning PVC isn't the best smoke, it contains chlorine! And chlorine gas on a humid day will form muratic acid with the water. Not to sure ow true that was but, iremembered it.

[Mumbles]

Oh, I wouldn't be worried about the HCl. It hurts and isn't pleasant, but not overly toxic compared to other things produced. What I'd be concerned about is Phosgene. I'll let you do your own research. Not fun stuff.

[mormanman]

Just in general I try to avoid high barium stars.  Barium poisoning is pretty aweful I have found out. 

 

I've heard of some people wanting to avoid BP milled with lead media, but I don't really see the point in this.  BP smoke can also generate a small bit of KCN, just FYI.

I think its the same reason they made UNLEADED GASOLINE because the exsost (I can spell) is fatal because of lead poisoning so I'm going to use brass media. But thanks for pointing that out I never would have thought of that.

[Frozentech]

I think its the same reason they made UNLEADED GASOLINE because the exsost (I can spell) is fatal because of lead poisoning so I'm going to use brass media. But thanks for pointing that out I never would have thought of that.

Unleaded gas came about not because lead was killing anyone ( though it was accumulating alongside roadways and in streams, etc ) but for a much simpler reason. Lead poisons the catalyst of the catalytic converters the goverment mandated to reduce smog in the air.

 

Normal blood lead levels in the US today are about 20 micrograms/deciliter or less. 30 years ago it was about 30 micrograms/dL. Industrial hygiene laws ( MSHA and OSHA ) require people who work with lead to keep a level below 40 micrograms/dL, and treatment is required if it goes over 80.

 

Anyhow, bottom line, leaded gas exhaust wasn't killing anyone. You'd be be dead of CO poisoning much *much* faster. We as a society have pretty much bought into the whole "chemicals are bad" spiel.

 

I used to have my blood lead level tested 4 times a year, when I worked as an communications tech at the world's largest lead and zinc mine, and even working in the midst of it, I never went over 30 micrograms/dL

[TheSidewinder]

Some government agency did a soil sample test in and around the Twin Cities area about two(?) decades ago.

 

While the measured lead levels were still below Federal standards (at the time), they did find that anywhere cars passed by regularly (highways), or idled for long periods of time (downtown intersections), lead levels in that soil were sharply elevated compared to levels in areas far from roads.

 

Naturally, this gave the tree-huggers apoplexy and helped fuel, at least locally, the "ban all lead forever" attitude so many seem to have.

 

Frozentech, what were your levels compared to people NOT working near the lead/zinc mine?

 

M

[h0lx]

Frozentech, what were your levels compared to people NOT working near the lead/zinc mine?

 

Normal blood lead levels in the US today are about 20 micrograms/deciliter or less.

[TheSidewinder]

Oh, duh. Shoulda read more closely.

 

Still, that figure can be interpreted both ways depending on your perspective (or political agenda) :

 

1) Tree Hugger: What!?!?! You're FIFTY PERCENT HIGHER than average?!?!

 

2) Sensible Person: 30, huh? Well, that's not bad.

 

In my case, I handled toxic materials without proper gear for years when I was younger. Mercury was one of them. Ignorance was bliss, I guess. Now, however, I am careful to "suit up" whenever handling toxic or carginogenic materials. No sense taking unnecessary risks, after all.

 

And my mouth is still full of mercury-bound fillings...

 

M

[h0lx]

Ah, good thing the mercury fillings were in my baby teeth:) Btw when already talking about hazardous materials, precisely how toxic is hydrazine? I have heard different stories. I am thinking about buying some hydrazine sulfate.

[Mumbles]

Hydrazine sulfate isn;t too bad. I made it a while ago and did a lot of research on the safety. I even fouynd stuff about it being used to cure cancer. THe nitrate and hydrates, specifically the hydrate are many time worse for you and easier to inhale/get it in your sysem.I can't remember what I wanted to do withg it, but now I can say I've made hydrazine. PRobably some posts on sciencemadness if anyone wants to see what I was up to.

[Mardec]

Oh, I wouldn't be worried about the HCl. It hurts and isn't pleasant, but not overly toxic compared to other things produced. What I'd be concerned about is Phosgene. I'll let you do your own research. Not fun stuff.

I don't know for sure, But burning haloginated plastics, doens't that generates dioxines?

[Mardec]

And my mouth is still full of mercury-bound fillings...

Same here, but I can't hurt you normally. You could drink pure Hg and just crap it out, it's inert.

 

The most dangerous are the soluble salts and the Hg vapour. I wouldn't worry about the fillings..

[crazyboy25]

I even found stuff about it being used to cure cancer.

just because it can cure cancer doesn't mean its safe although i trust your research after all chemotherepy and radiation therapy are used to cure cancer and no one wants to get irradiated or swallow poison.

[Coolerguy09]

I know for a fact that adding Potassium Phosphate can be real bad because it is a SEVERE skin irritant and if it gets in your lungs theres no telling what might happen.