"Salutes" vs "firecrackers" ?

[DrJones]

I know what a salute is and does, and am curious the distinction between a big, loud firecracker and a "salute." Must salutes employ flash? Does 50-mg of flash make a firecracker, or a salute? How small of a load can a proper "salute" contain, and still give the report of a "salute"?

Is it true that originally, "M-80 type salutes" (back in the 1950s) had a flash charge of 3 to 5 grams?

Did "silver tube salutes" have the same configuration and load as "M-80s"?

 

Is there a world record or similar for "largest salute ever fired"?

Thanks for helping me count how many pixies can dance on the end of a visco fuse.

Edward

[Carbon796]

Firecracker's are toys for the general public. Salutes are pyrotechnic devices deployed with artistry and skill.

[Richtee]

In perspective, I guess the ants thought I nuked them with that 50mg cracker.

 

I kinda like Carbon’s definition. A firecracker will raise a blood blister. A salute will take your fingers. Maybe arm. Maybe torso. Pound bottom shots are pretty common in the big stuff.

[DrJones]

I seek to understand current, accepted nomenclature and jargon. From a "scientific" point of view, technically, is there not a clear difference between a "firecracker" and a "salute"? Maybe (I do not know) every firecracker is a "salute", but every "salute" is not a firecracker. Is there not a clear definitive line that separates "firecrackers" from "salutes" among pyrotechnic professionals? Maybe not. Just wanna get my terms and definitions correct. Thanks. Edward

[Richtee]

Well, to my knowledge, Either can be the other. It’s just maybe “understood” when “salute” is said, it’s likely larger than a “firecracker” I suppose.

 

 

Don’t think there’s a Webster’s solution.

[SharkWhisperer]

I know what a salute is and does, and am curious the distinction between a big, loud firecracker and a "salute." Must salutes employ flash? Does 50-mg of flash make a firecracker, or a salute? How small of a load can a proper "salute" contain, and still give the report of a "salute"?

 

Is it true that originally, "M-80 type salutes" (back in the 1950s) had a flash charge of 3 to 5 grams?

 

Did "silver tube salutes" have the same configuration and load as "M-80s"?

 

Is there a world record or similar for "largest salute ever fired"?

 

Thanks for helping me count how many pixies can dance on the end of a visco fuse.

 

Edward

Before becoming popular as a commercial item, US military M-80s (randomly assigned name now used for some 7.62 mm ball ammo) were spec'ed at 9/16" ID x 1.5" length, had paper endcaps, and contained 2.75 g of flash (i believe standard 70/30). This was not a full tube--likely about half full.

 

Most commercially sold M-80s were similar, but highly variable--the Chicom manufacturers used whatever the cheapest ingredients were at the time of manufacture, as they still do, and the flash formulation and content probably varied greatly across device batches. They were banned by the '66 Child Protection Act, and a few years later made illegal by the ATF. Consumer Silver Salutes were also highly variable. As were cherry bombs, though the flash content was obviously lower using a 3/4" diameter thick-walled sphere. In some countries (Eastern europe comes to mind) it is still possible to legally get reasonably large FP salutes containing 100+ grams of FP, formulation probably as variable as ever. Modern fireworks store/stand silver salutes and M-100s, etc., sold commercially and legally in the US are a misleading bait-n-switch because they (technically) can contain no more FP than a single 1.5" regular firecracker (50 mg, though there's probably significant variation across batches).

 

Containment is not so essential with decent FP. Even small piles (<1 gram) of well formulated FP will deflagrate violently without containment if ignited in an open pile. Anything that can deflagrate can be made into a salute. With BP, solid containment is essential--reconstruct a cardboard M-80 using the fastest BP dust and it will give only a modest "pop" and a lot of smoke. Well contained, with thick walls and solid capping, and you can get it to explode violently, as would occur with pipe bombs, for example. A reasonable salute can be made with BP, as is often done where chlorates/perchlorates are difficult to obtain. Slower nitrate-based "FPs" also exist but provide less brissance than regular 70:30, but more than metal-free BP.

[Carbon796]

Firecrackers are small class c type devices. That are usually multiply strung together in "strings" and make a litte bit of racket. You wont find many real fireworkers making or persue-ing them. Other than the noobs and kids. Often mistaken for small caliber fire, back fire from cars.

 

Salute, think single fired aerial salute/report.

 

Reports, think inserts. Usually part of another device. Think, color break and report shell. Or 9 timed report shell. Or a color and report ring shell,

 

Bottom shot, the final report/effect of a shell. Traditionally used with cylinder shells. Usually a larger and more authoritative report, than previous ones in the same shell.

 

Salutes, report inserts, bottom shots. They have authority, theres no mistaking what they are. You can feel them in your chest when they function. You won't feel a pack of firecrackers function. Unless you trip and fall on them. Salutes, reports, and bottom shots are usually deployed with function and artistic use in mind. The only use for firecrackers are annoying your neighbors and ridding yourself of evil spirits.

Edited March 17, 2021 by Carbon796

[SeaMonkey]

A couple of Pyrotechnic Glossaries:

 

Glossary of Pyrotechnic Terms

 

 

Pyrotechnic Terms

 

Both have definitions for "Salute" but neither for "Firecracker."

 

Could it be that Firecracker is more of a consumer or marketing term while

Salute is the official Pyro Term?

 

Terminology tends to change with time.

[DrJones]

Thank you for the sensible explanations. By the way, if memory serves, in China firecrackers are called "bim-pow," a term I like. I used to know what that meant literally translated. Are firecrackers still made in Macau?

 

I once made a few hundred following Weingarts drawings and instructions of the traditional Chinese way. They were good, even with my lousy loads, but my fuses never matched a Chinese fuse reject.

 

When was Visco born?

Edward

[DrJones]

"Pyrotechnician" tells me "Salute, think single fired aerial salute/report."

 

I did not know that salutes were only aerial reports. I thought for years that a "silver tube salute" was a salute, as well as other ground-level concussion-generating fireworks. I thought there were both "ground salutes" and aerial salutes. I guess if it explodes other than in the air, it's a firecracker?

 

Edward

[Carbon796]

They are both salutes. But silver salutes have been illegal to sell, own, make and use, since 1966. So your stuck with 50mg firecrackers. Which are miniature toy salutes. If your interest is in buying and using class C, safe and sane type devices. Edited March 17, 2021 by Carbon796

[kingkama]

I don't know if was the bigger of its kind but the 8" we shoot 2 year ago was my bigger salute Shell.

[Wiley]

I know of at least one 50 pound aerial flash salute that was fired at a PGI convention. I was also told that it was maybe a little noisier than normal large salutes.

 

A 1-pound bottom shot is a pretty little guy. A 4 or a short 5 would hold about that much. Of course that all depends on the wall thickness of the core, how dense the comp is, and how it was loaded. Some just scoop it full and call it done, others tap the case on the workbench or use a vibrating table to settle it solid. That changes how they look and sound.

 

When you see videos of daylight shells being shot at PGI, or big 8-12 competition/exhibition shells at PGI/winterblast, odds are that the bottom shot holds something between 2lb (short 6) to 25lb (tall 10 or 12).

Edited March 22, 2021 by Wiley