What exactly is in "pyrogen" mix?

[pycharm]

I've googled and cannot seem to find answer. Looking to make my own ematch for rockets.

[SeaMonkey]

DuckDuckGo is a far better Search Engine than Google.

 

Pyrotechnics Pyrogen

Edited February 26, 2021 by SeaMonkey

[ronmoper76]

im searching for the same thing. all i keep getting is the same crappy skylighter link. i wanna make my own,not pay them for a kit

[SharkWhisperer]

im searching for the same thing. all i keep getting is the same crappy skylighter link. i wanna make my own,not pay them for a kit

My gawd, the collective IQ of the recent posters here is nosediving. Pyrogens for rocket igniters? Composite or BP? Doesn't matter. That shit is simples. SIMPLES, ffs. If you cannot concoct a hot pyrogen coating and electrical ignition system for rockets (or anything else), you should rethink working with energetic materials. If you are making rocket igniters and don't know how to calculate your continuity and all-fire currents, accounting for battery internal resistances and shooting wire length/resistance, then you need to do a whole lot of studying before you continue. There is SO MUCH published information on many, many pyrogenic compositions and igniter designs that this query is to me simply amazing.

 

I appreciate that this is the Newbie section, but don't act like a helpless/hapless idiot that needs their bottoms wiped, ffs. READ.

 

Damn, there's 899 friggin Youtube videos on the topic, mostly crap using matchheads (don't), some ok, but point being the info is out there already.

 

And using the word "wanna" in any serious electronic communications sounds childlike.

Edited February 28, 2021 by SharkWhisperer

[Arthur]

You will NOT find a unique answer for the formula of pyrogen, simply because there are thousands of possibilities. Once you find a formula you consider whether you have all the chemicals, then you either look for a source of all of them or you look for a formula that uses ingredients you have. It's usually far cheaper to buy a kit than to buy a pound of each ingredient. It's also much more predictable to buy igniters from a place that makes millions perfectly than to do any diy.

[ronmoper76]

look on the naka rocketry site. i found a half dozen igniter formulations some basic all the way up to super ignitors that would supposedly light the most stubborn of rocket propellants. they have a method using graphite and nail polish as a first dip to create a conductive lampblack like substitution that supposedly will create resistance anywhere from 3 to 10 ohms i think it was called,depending how thin or thick your graphite dip solution was. He also had numerous other compositions using a nichrome bridge wire which you can purchase a huge roll of for cheap at just about any local vape shop. Im gonna go the bridged route instead of trying to rewrite the conductive lampblack wheel. not enough info out there on lampblack subs.

[SharkWhisperer]

look on the naka rocketry site. i found a half dozen igniter formulations some basic all the way up to super ignitors that would supposedly light the most stubborn of rocket propellants. they have a method using graphite and nail polish as a first dip to create a conductive lampblack like substitution that supposedly will create resistance anywhere from 3 to 10 ohms i think it was called,depending how thin or thick your graphite dip solution was. He also had numerous other compositions using a nichrome bridge wire which you can purchase a huge roll of for cheap at just about any local vape shop. Im gonna go the bridged route instead of trying to rewrite the conductive lampblack wheel. not enough info out there on lampblack subs.

You will have much better luck using a nonconductive pyrogen on a resistance wire before you can sort out conductive igniter mixes. The formulation isn't so difficult--most aren't. But the igniter physical construction is difficult for new folks to replicate consistently. And what's your expected firing resistance/conductance? I'm guessing you don't even know what an ohm is,but will come up with a smartass answer after you consult Wikipedia. Life might be simplified for you if you buy some cheap 11.8" Chicom igniters from Ebay--you'll have enough work calculating your battery requirements for firing those generally reliable and functional igniters.

 

What kind of electrical firing system do you have or are planning to make.What are the electrical characteristics of your battery? Type, volts, internal resistance, max current draw?

[pycharm]

My gawd, the collective IQ of the recent posters here is nosediving. Pyrogens for rocket igniters? Composite or BP? Doesn't matter. That shit is simples. SIMPLES, ffs. If you cannot concoct a hot pyrogen coating and electrical ignition system for rockets (or anything else), you should rethink working with energetic materials. If you are making rocket igniters and don't know how to calculate your continuity and all-fire currents, accounting for battery internal resistances and shooting wire length/resistance, then you need to do a whole lot of studying before you continue. There is SO MUCH published information on many, many pyrogenic compositions and igniter designs that this query is to me simply amazing.

 

I appreciate that this is the Newbie section, but don't act like a helpless/hapless idiot that needs their bottoms wiped, ffs. READ.

 

Damn, there's 899 friggin Youtube videos on the topic, mostly crap using matchheads (don't), some ok, but point being the info is out there already.

 

And using the word "wanna" in any serious electronic communications sounds childlike.

In my defense, I googled numerous variants of "pyrogen mix" and all I could find was an unstable version using antimony trisulfide/lampblack.

 

I made a small bit of dark flash, mixed with NC lacquer and a bit of titanium sponge and dipped Bridge wire into mix, this actually got the job done.

[pycharm]

You will have much better luck using a nonconductive pyrogen on a resistance wire before you can sort out conductive igniter mixes. The formulation isn't so difficult--most aren't. But the igniter physical construction is difficult for new folks to replicate consistently. And what's your expected firing resistance/conductance? I'm guessing you don't even know what an ohm is,but will come up with a smartass answer after you consult Wikipedia. Life might be simplified for you if you buy some cheap 11.8" Chicom igniters from Ebay--you'll have enough work calculating your battery requirements for firing those generally reliable and functional igniters.

 

What kind of electrical firing system do you have or are planning to make.What are the electrical characteristics of your battery? Type, volts, internal resistance, max current draw?

You're quite the asshole, aren't you? Going off on people having conversations in "Newbie Questions" thread must really get you going.

[SharkWhisperer]

In my defense, I googled numerous variants of "pyrogen mix" and all I could find was an unstable version using antimony trisulfide/lampblack.

 

I made a small bit of dark flash, mixed with NC lacquer and a bit of titanium sponge and dipped Bridge wire into mix, this actually got the job done.

Sound like a reasonable pyrogen. Don't need flash-fine Al--you want a hot energetic sparky (Ti) burn, preferably long and hot and instantaneous versus brissant. Too much dip with flash and other comps can be a little too energetic and actually fracture the grain it's igniting. I'd dumb down your Al in the flash with larger mesh. BP is incredibly easy to ignite. Which is why the original Estes rocket motors just came with a piece of uncoated nichrome wire. APCP less so but still simple. Lift charges? Hell, just show 'em a photo of quickmatch or a spark and they fire, ffs. Not exactly difficult stuff.

 

Instead of limiting your search to the fruitlessly generic "pyrogen mix", why don't you expand your search and include "e match" "rocket igniter", etc. Sheesh, this is not difficult. And if you're lighting BP, you'd probably get equally good (and fast) ignition with an NC slurry of BP alone, perhaps heated up with a little metal. No need for the flash. Thousand ways to skin a cat. Or make "pyrogen mixes" for an igniter. Tons, and I mean, tons, of info available out there. Make small batches and use PPE--eyes and fingers don't quickly grow back.

 

If you're planning to store these for any amount of time, you will need to familiarize yourself with how your oxidizer might react with your bridgewire, i.e, potential corrosion and ignitier failures.

Learn some basics about wire resistance/battery internal resistance, ohms, etc....the very basics....before you run as test current through an igniter and accidentally blow your own ass up. Kinda useful stuff.

 

Or like I said before...check ebay for some cheap, functional, generally reliable ematches.

[pycharm]

Sound like a reasonable pyrogen. Don't need flash-fine Al--you want a hot energetic sparky (Ti) burn, preferably long and hot and instantaneous versus brissant. Too much dip with flash and other comps can be a little too energetic and actually fracture the grain it's igniting. I'd dumb down your Al in the flash with larger mesh. BP is incredibly easy to ignite. Which is why the original Estes rocket motors just came with a piece of uncoated nichrome wire. APCP less so but still simple. Lift charges? Hell, just show 'em a photo of quickmatch or a spark and they fire, ffs. Not exactly difficult stuff.

 

Instead of limiting your search to the fruitlessly generic "pyrogen mix", why don't you expand your search and include "e match" "rocket igniter", etc. Sheesh, this is not difficult. And if you're lighting BP, you'd probably get equally good (and fast) ignition with an NC slurry of BP alone, perhaps heated up with a little metal. No need for the flash. Thousand ways to skin a cat. Or make "pyrogen mixes" for an igniter. Tons, and I mean, tons, of info available out there. Make small batches and use PPE--eyes and fingers don't quickly grow back.

 

If you're planning to store these for any amount of time, you will need to familiarize yourself with how your oxidizer might react with your bridgewire, i.e, potential corrosion and ignitier failures.

Learn some basics about wire resistance/battery internal resistance, ohms, etc....the very basics....before you run as test current through an igniter and accidentally blow your own ass up. Kinda useful stuff.

 

Or like I said before...check ebay for some cheap, functional, generally reliable ematches.

As I said before, I googled different variants of the term, and ematch, etc was apart of it. I don't plan to store any of my ematches, so anything that might break down over time isn't something I necessarily need to worry about, however, having a stable pyrogen mix is certainly preferred. The bridge wire I'm using is 26ga nichrome, and currently I'm using a 12v lawn mower battery with my two relay ignition switch. I'm not looking to do any shows, this is more of an exciting hobby. Hopefully one day I'll become the pyro artist that many of you here are.