Fuses

[mike_au]

I bought some 1.8mm FF, premium 2mm visco ... from PyroPlanet ages and ages ago. The problems I encountered were as following: ...

The premium visco had the problem of the black powder core falling out ...

What fuse does not have the problem of the black powder falling out?

 

I am going to buy some 2mm visco from Czort as it is dead cheap

 

I got some of the chinese visco and some falling leaf fuse from pyroplanet a little while ago, I have noticed the same problem with the falling leaf, but the visco seems pretty good. If I plan to store or transport something I dip the end in NC lacquer but the powder seems to stay put for a little while at least.

 

I assume you mean Czort in Poland? Have you dealt with him/them in the past? The price certainly looks good.

[Yankie]

I got some of the chinese visco and some falling leaf fuse from pyroplanet a little while ago, I have noticed the same problem with the falling leaf, but the visco seems pretty good. If I plan to store or transport something I dip the end in NC lacquer but the powder seems to stay put for a little while at least.

 

I assume you mean Czort in Poland? Have you dealt with him/them in the past? The price certainly looks good.

 

I haven't dealt with him but a few mates have ordered from him, they are still waiting on the stuff to arrive though, but thats mainly due to the incompetence of the Polish post and the festive season slowing things down.

[pyrogeorge]

i bought from czort some chemicals with no problem and he gave me some visco to test it,and it was very good visco.I will buy again in future,he is recommended seller

[mormanman]

I tried that stuff, or something very similar - Skylighter used to sell a firecracker fuse that was *two* strands of paper fuse joined. I also used it for fusing go-getters:

http://www.apcforum.net/files/1strowgogetters.jpg

I used two pieces (four strands) in a pipe for QM. It worked ok...enclosed it went up in a shot. It's main drawback is that it is NOT very flexible or durable; it's only a powder train wrapped in gampi paper. If you bend your QM, the gampi tissue the fuse is made of will crack. If you do this enough (like when folding the shell leader up), it can break and you face the real possibility of a hang-fire in the QM, which I did on several shells. If you do not like making your own Blackmatch (like me ), I suggest using this:

 

http://www.skylighter.com/images/web_pictures/gn1205.jpg

Thank you very much Qwezxc12, that was just the answer I was looking for.

 

I'm wondering if the is another place to buy it b/c it comes around to be $30 to even buy it.

Edited December 30, 2008 by mormanman

[Mumbles]

Qwe, are those ammonium nitrate based go-getters? I'd think you'd have problems with the whole nitrate thing if they are.

[qwezxc12]

Qwe, are those ammonium nitrate based go-getters? I'd think you'd have problems with the whole nitrate thing if they are.

 

Mumbles,

 

I'm guessing to mean Ammonium Perchlorate based...potentially forming Ammonium Nitrate by double-replacement from the KNO₃ in the fuse?

Yes, they are AP/Al based, and several people wondered the exact same thing: if they would turn the fuses to mush if I didn't use a KP based black-match. I decided to try them out and luckily enough, the Parlon/Acetone-Xylene binder system kept any appreciable reaction from occurring. I did make sure the fuse was nice and dry as well as drying the Acetone-Xylene mix with Damp-Rid before mixing as a precaution.

That particular picture was taken summer '07 on my first attempt at getters with a flash header. The video is in my gallery:

 

4in Go-getter Can

 

I've made 2 other getter cans since then, using the blackmatch from the Skylighter fuse with no problems. The only other change was to use 5um spherical Al instead of the 25-30um (they're more energetic). I want to try them with Hawk Mtn's uncoated flake, too, but I can only make them in the summer, 'cause I have no safe place for them to dry (solvent vapors) in the winter...bummer.

Edited December 31, 2008 by qwezxc12

[Mumbles]

Is it just me, or are the go getters exploding? I like the tail the Aluminum based ones give though. I'd imagine subsituting in MgAl or even Mg could power them up too. I'd stick with that at least until I can get my hands on some more 5 micron Al. The $40 a pound, and 1lb a year thing from skylighter isn't going to cut it. I hear a certain someone is getting in a bulk shipment, so I'll keep my eyes out on the market for 10 or 20lbs. I have some 10890 (american dark flake -325 mesh), that would probably boost them a bit too. I wouldn't want to completely replace the Al so I could keep the tail. Ti might sink in the batter, but I bet Al flitters would be amazing if added.

 

It's good to know about the match too. I had always suspected that the parlon binding would take care of it.

 

I have a similar drying situation as you. Someone gave me a call the other day about go-getters after seeing a post on passfire I made about drying solvents. I was going to make up a batch to show him on new years, but alas, no place to dry them. It looks like it's tube rolling, and star cutting for now.

 

For those interested, this skylighter page has the formulas we're discussing:

http://www.skylighter.com/skylighter_info_...le.asp?Item=103

[BPinthemorning]

Thanks, mumbles, I was reading what you were righting, and didn't know what context to put it in.

[qwezxc12]

Is it just me, or are the go getters exploding? I like the tail the Aluminum based ones give though. I'd imagine subsituting in MgAl or even Mg could power them up too. I'd stick with that at least until I can get my hands on some more 5 micron Al. The $40 a pound, and 1lb a year thing from skylighter isn't going to cut it. I hear a certain someone is getting in a bulk shipment, so I'll keep my eyes out on the market for 10 or 20lbs. I have some 10890 (american dark flake -325 mesh), that would probably boost them a bit too. I wouldn't want to completely replace the Al so I could keep the tail, without adding anything extra. Ti might sink in the batter, but I bet Al flitters would be amazing.

 

Yes, they are...it was my first attempt and I inserted the fuse too far into the tube - right through the getter mix into the flash. Instead of the burning go-getter comp igniting things in sequence, the fuse burnt through on most of the tubes lighting it before the burn was complete.

 

I've stayed away from using Mg or MgAl, because I have not dichromate coated any. AP/Mg mixes (like strobes) all require coated Mg. Again, the Parlon and non-aqueous binder may prevent that reaction, but I haven't experimented. Hmmm...good thoughts on the Al. I have lots of American Dark and Eckart 5413; perhaps replacing a portion of the 30um spherical Al (thus keeping the streamer-like tail) with 10-15% of fine flake, like 10890 or 5413 would speed them up, too.

 

The video attached is a 6in green getter can using 30um Al from last summer. IMO, using straight 30um makes them too low thrust when using the heavier commercial spiral tubes.

[psyco_1322]

Been out of the loop for a few days, so I'm catching up.

 

I bought some of that double strand paper fuse from SL the first time I ordered from them. It was about useless except for lighting test objects and single fire star guns. It was quite brittle and tore easy. It was separable into two thin single pieces, but it would often fail to stay burning. It would just be going along and then bam it would stop.

 

The three strand super fast paper fuse is a life saver, really great stuff. So many uses for it. I often look for SL specials that include it in the free stuff they throw in. Thats usually when I make my teeth grinding orders with them and spend a few dollars. It burns at a relatively fast rate in short pieces, almost instant like QM, but in longer pieces like 4"+shell leaders, you will notice a second or two of burn time on the leader. If took apart, into the three strands, it makes even a faster QM. One piece in a 1/8" tube makes a snap when it goes off, great for all your small shells 2" and under where space might be limited and quantity is needed. I use a 3/8" tube rolled from a length of 2 3/4" wide gummed reinforced craft tape, it is then flattened and loaded with 3 strands of the "black match"** with out the paper. It makes for a reliable, fast quick match.

 

**I would like to make the note that I do not believe that the match this fuse is made of is black powder based. First off its not even black, its a dark gray color, not black as if it were black powder. If you burn a piece, you will notice it does not burn with the characteristics of black powder based black match at all. On top of it all, if you use it in ammonium perchlorate based go-getters, it does not react with the AP as if it were black powder. Numerous times I have made go-getters with it and even after letting them set for weeks to see if they would turn to mush, they did not. My best guess is that they are some like of KP match, possibly with a few percent of Al it.

 

I have a thought about fuses and go-getters. If you take a fuse, embed it into a liquid comp, let the liquid form around the fuse and dry; How do you expect the fuse to burn independant of the comp and through it? Especially if the comp burns rather fast, more faster than the fuse. I would think that the fuse would not burn through the comp, leaving a core, as it the belief of how go-getters function. It would rather burn along with the go-getter comp, all as one, not leaving a core. The comp would burn faster than the fuse, thus consuming the fuse as it burns. If something like fast thermolite was used, where it burns faster than the comp, I would see it leaving a core. Since black or kp match does not, I would not think it would act as a quick match effect since there is not a tube like area for the action to take place. I have been experimenting with a solution to my theory but only on some rather small go-getters, and not with enough of them to draw any conclusions.

 

I've made Al and magnalium go-getters, the magnalium ones do have quite a bit more punch. The Al ones didn't seem to leave the tail that the magnalium ones did. Though I think that because the magnalium was mixed in with Mg turnings, that it might be contaminated with Mg of the same mesh, and that could be leaving the nice white tails, as you see with Al ones. With either fuel I seem to like them oxidized with other things than AP, to stray away from the possibility of the unwanted reactions it has with our commonly used bp. I tryed qwe's formula that he gave out a year or so ago, that had the xCarbonate. I used strontium carb and was quite disappointed at the color. It was more of a pail red/pinkush look rather than a deep red. I'm not putting qwe ....(wow, just figured out the thing with his odd name, first three letters on the keyboards top and bottom rows, this makes me feel stupid now, lol. ok back to the sentence)...to blame for its quality of color, just pointing it out. It also lacked power for the effect I was looking for. I thought I would give it a try just to see how it was. Overall it seems to be comparable to other AP formulas I have tryed.

 

Ok, Im done. I had to pass some time waiting for the big 12 to get around so I can go make some noise. XD Happy New Years everyone!

[Ralph]

whell i am telling you that you will prbably laugh and think i am an idiot and i am not and this is good and before you judge please try it and see

 

i use what i call ralphs long time fuse

 

what it is is a spollete rammed with a mixture i will describe

take some smooth penut butter and mix in unpowdered (consistency of sugar is good) kno3 untill it is getting very close to the consistency you want a star mixture to be before you cut or pump it accept if you get to that point you have gone a little to far and you may want to add a litlle more penut butter than ad 1/10 of the total weight of the mix in finely powdered sulfur if you add more it will burn faster if you add less it will burn slower. i have found that regardleyy of penut butter and how runny or dry it is this method with out fail gives an almost dross free consistent burn rate

 

this fuse burns at 90 seconds per inch it is very slow but very hot it is very hot becuse penut butter contains alot of fat which contains 32kj per gram where as charcoal has between 5-15 kj per gram which mean that it can burn for far longer yet still give considerable heat

 

i have also found this works great as a port fire composition i recomend rolling your own tubes for this purpose as some tubes are to thick and will not be burned away i usualy prime this with half a cut star just for easy of ignition (this isnt HARD to light but when it is realy windy and some homosexual forgot to bring a lighter and you have to use matches it is far easier to light a jageded peice off tt ) i am working on makeing a penut butter flare composition and my preliminary tests are going well i will post when i have one down pat please enjoy

[Ralph]

i said smooth penut butter where you come from mabey they call ig creamy it burns with as large flame as i said and i am working on modifing it to work as a flare it is very very hot and makes a great pport fire becuse of the big flame coming out the top

hmm it dosnt realy smell like much i think try it and find out

 

i tried it becuse i relised the energy content of penut butter compared to traditional pyrotechnic fuels

 

 

please try it and give me some feedback it has worked great for me

[Richtee]

i said smooth penut butter where you come from mabey they call ig creamy it burns with as large flame as i said and i am working on modifing it to work as a flare it is very very hot and makes a great pport fire becuse of the big flame coming out the top

hmm it dosnt realy smell like much i think try it and find out

 

i tried it becuse i relised the energy content of penut butter compared to traditional pyrotechnic fuels

 

 

please try it and give me some feedback it has worked great for me

What if I wrap it in white bread?

[andyboy]

What if I wrap it in white bread?

 

Pyrosnack?

 

 

Anyways, it's sounds like a nice thing to try but I think I will stick to other fuels since peanut-butter is rather expensive around these parts and I never buy it anyway. There might be other substitutes that are equal in performance though. Vaseline, cocoa fat, motor-oil? I'll go and try some out now, see you.

[Ralph]

in australia penut butter is heaps cheap like $3 for 500g tub

[psyco_1322]

I have heard of a similar comp that really had no definite purpose that was made of peanut butter and KClO3. I tryed it with KClO4 but could not get a half decent burning so I gave up. Making it with AP (NH4ClO4) might be interesting also. I have a personal incendiary that is made of AP and boiled linseed oil.

 

So how do you go about consolidating this long time fuse comp? I would think that if you put it in a thick tube that doesn't burn away as it burns, that it would eventually burn through the side.

 

You might also want to try and work up a formula for it while your working on the flare version. That way its not a guessing game when it comes to mixing it.

 

Nothing ever smells good after it burns, not even candy canes made into smoke mix.

[psyco_1322]

I have actually never seen/smelt bio-diesel. Im not even completely sure hows it made or what it is. I have heard about it as a high powered (?) replacement for normal diesel. In modified engines it put out a lot more powder.

[FrankRizzo]

Biodiesel doesn't smell like french frys, it smells like diesel. The raw, filtered, used fryer oil that some guys in warmer states use in their diesel vehicles does indeed smell a bit like fried food. The smell is actually from the bit of uncombusted oil that ends up in the exhaust.

[thebobman]

1.8mm chinese visco

2.2mm chinese visco

white strobe fuse

purple flying fish

red flying fish

green crackling fuse

 

all off cannon fuse

[Mumbles]

And what is that in relation to? I can sit here and list types of fuse too, but it does nothing useful.

[Ralph]

I made spooletes out of this i just ram it into a tube normally about 3mm wide and i made them 3" long if I need a port fire i just use a 20mm id tube hand rolled with just a few tuns of paper so it does burn away and that's it and every time i make it regardless of the diameter it seems to burn at 90 seconds per inch

 

 

stay safe

[Mumbles]

90 seconds an inch is an asininely long burn duration for anything besides flares or lances, of which this is neither. Might I suggest looking into useful and practical pyrotechnics.

[Ventsi]

I actually tried Ralph's Pyro butter and pressed it into a 3/8" like i would make a normal portfire.

 

It burned with a large flame {purple-ish}.

And INCREDIBLY slow!

 

I would recomend this for Portfires or torches,not especially bright or hot but a little Al should do the trick

I might do Ralph a favor and upload a video.

[FrankRizzo]

I actually tried Ralph's Pyro butter and pressed it into a 3/8" like i would make a normal portfire.

 

It burned with a large flame {purple-ish}.

And INCREDIBLY slow!

 

I would recomend this for Portfires or torches,not especially bright or hot but a little Al should do the trick

I might do Ralph a favor and upload a video.

 

Purely academic curiosity here, and I imagine it doesn't because of the extremely high temperature, but does it have a burnt peanut butter smell?

[Ventsi]

Purely academic curiosity here, and I imagine it doesn't because of the extremely high temperature, but does it have a burnt peanut butter smell?

 

Haha

 

No its got more of a overfryed fish/burnt hair smell

Forgot to mention that, I guess it'd make a nasty stink bomb. =]