SKC Posted February 8, 2020 Posted February 8, 2020 Recently I've come to know the existance of a special salute. I too do not opt for making sound unless it is inevitable and is fully aware of the fact that we don't discuss it here. But this is a different scenario. Generally if any pyro device bursts that produces a flash of light followed by a report sound. But what I'm stating about is only produces sound Without Any Flash. I'm also informed that very few village pyros of my country can make it. For this amazing effect I intend to know about this, perhaps learn to make too. Simultaneously I do not encourage discussion of this if it is not safe to make or this is not the proper platform for discussion. Posting out of astonishment. In the worst case I don't mind locking of this thread.
NeighborJ Posted February 8, 2020 Posted February 8, 2020 (edited) "Dark report", They are usually made from non-metal, high energy fuels such as whistle. Edited February 8, 2020 by NeighborJ
Arthur Posted February 9, 2020 Posted February 9, 2020 Sound is an important part of a fireworks display, but not the only part!
Piccaso Posted February 9, 2020 Posted February 9, 2020 (edited) @ Mumbles Please delete if this violates forum policy as I can see it as a grey area.I have also been interested in dark reports. I know the US military includes a chemical in their artillary propellant that reduces the flash. How ever I can't remember it's name off the top of my head, I think it's a sodium of some sort. There are dark reports comps available but some of them are more sensitive than standard 70/30. This is a Chlorate mixture so it will be extremely sensitive! Mix by diaper method only in small amounts and with extreme caution. This is dangerous stuff. It is shock, friction and static sensitive. Only mix when the humidity is above 70%. REMEMBER CHLORATES REACT WITH ORGANIC MATERIALS. Mumbles if this is not good for standard forum posting please delete.The one I know is ......Potassium chlorate 58Antimony Trisulfide, Dark Pyro 25Asphaltum powder, Gilsonite 17 Edited February 9, 2020 by Piccaso 1
SKC Posted February 10, 2020 Author Posted February 10, 2020 Yes I know that this is not the right forum to discuss over the topic I've raised. I do not have access to the right platform of this forum, just the effect raised my curiosity level higher. Neither I intend to practice it without proper guidance. Thanks.
pyrokid Posted February 10, 2020 Posted February 10, 2020 This is absolutely the correct forum to discuss this effect. My personal experience with dark report composition consists of a small number of 1" salutes with composition 50:50 KClO3:Sb2S3. Light output is much lower than typical aluminum flash but they are more quiet. On a side note, I made a report device with a chlorate/red gum composition one time that also had a low light output. It seems that a variety of organic fuels might be used for this purpose.
SharkWhisperer Posted February 10, 2020 Posted February 10, 2020 PK, was the KClO3/red gum also just a straight 50:50 mix, or did you have some sulfur or trisulfide (or something else) in it as a sensitizer. If so what ratios? How was the sound output of the red gum formulation compared to the chlorate/trisulfide binary mix?
Mumbles Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 This is a topic I've thought about a lot actually for some specialized effects Against a dark sky, whistle probably still makes too much light, especially with sodium fuels. Even common dark salute comps have a dull red flash. The one with gilsonite are going to be better. Far enough up in the sky is going to help. I'm definitely interested in this red gum comp.
pyrokid Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 I'm sorry, it was about ten years ago and I don't remember the composition. My note taking skills were rather substandard. I think there was some charcoal present. Let me see if I can put something together for a test.
pyrokid Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 (edited) Here. See the Allen composition on the far right side of the table Edited February 11, 2020 by pyrokid
Arthur Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 I doubt it's possible to make a totally dark salute with pyrotechnics, but with a low flash compound and good show scripting probably a low light salute would suffice.
Maserface Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 Here. See the Allen composition on the far right side of the tableIm interested in what the document you are looking at is, I have a copy of the Allen formulary and its intriguing when it gets referenced elsewhere.
pyrokid Posted February 11, 2020 Posted February 11, 2020 It's some copy of that huge formulary database that's been around on the web forever. This one is a ~100 page pdf hosted at fireworking.com with Wouter Visser's name attached to it.
Crazy Swede Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) Some people claim to have succeeded using potassium perchlorate and hexamine in granulated form to produce low light emitting salutes. I doubt that is efficient though. Whistle mix based on potassium perchlorate or potassium chlorate with potassium benzoate does not produce much light, especially not if the mixture is made fuel lean to avoid the incandescence of carbon particles. It is of course important to avoid any sodium containing ingredients. Edited February 12, 2020 by Crazy Swede 1
SharkWhisperer Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) Some people claim to have succeeded using potassium perchlorate and hexamine in granulated form to produce low light emitting salutes. I doubt that is efficient though. Whistle mix based on potassium perchlorate or potassium chlorate with potassium benzoate does not produce much light, especially not if the mixture is made fuel lean to avoid the incandescence of carbon particles. It is of course important to avoid any sodium containing ingredients.That would mean no sodium salycilate as is the other usual whistle component. Edited February 12, 2020 by SharkWhisperer
Mumbles Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 Potassium benzoate is likely what is being implied. I can speak from experience that it's almost essential for applications where light output is important to control like colored lampares.
SeaMonkey Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 Tenney Davis in his classic work The Chemistry of Powder and Explosivesprovides details on NitroGuanidine and NitrosoGuanidine which areboth flashless and non-light emitting as they combust. They havehad some use in military powders long ago. Yes, these things really do exist. Pyro mixtures with easily obtainedchemicals which can do the same sort of magic are far more practicalthough. Not to mention far more interesting and fun. 1
Piccaso Posted February 15, 2020 Posted February 15, 2020 Here. See the Allen composition on the far right side of the tableThis looks like the formulas from The Green Man. I do like that site as it shows which mixtures are more sensitive than others.
Recommended Posts