Binary Impact Sensitive Explosives

[ns4life]

I have been making binary exploding targets for long range rifle shoots. My primary recipe is a mixture of blackhead, Ammonium perchlorate and Ammonium Nitrate. Does anyone else have any experience making targets as such? If so, what formulas work best for you?

[qwezxc12]

Mumbles,

 

Does this violate your 'no HE discussion outside of the HE forum' rule?

 

I wanted to ask before I contributed to ns4life's question...as I make home-brew binary targets as well.

 

thx.

[Mumbles]

mmmmmm, I don't know how to handle this one. I'll allow it for now as long as it stays in a reasonably pyrotechnic domain, but will probably modify the title later. If it gets too HE based I may move it.

[ns4life]

Mumbles Posted on Apr 27 2007, 04:40 PM mmmmmm, I don't know how to handle this one. I'll allow it for now as long as it stays in a reasonably pyrotechnic domain, but will probably modify the title later. If it gets too HE based I may move it.

 

 

Thanks, for allowing this. It doesnt have to be HE targets (although those are the fun ones).

[qwezxc12]

I use two different mixes:

 

85 NH4NO3

10-15 Bright Al Flake

 

This is fairly insensitive stuff; I only use this for .223 / .308. The Bright Flake keeps the mix fluffy and at a relative low density. The more Al you add, the brighter the flash and less brisant the boom. I've found that if you compact it at all, you'll only get a partial reaction, if at all. I mix it in a ziplock bag by shaking, and either use as is, or transfer to a plastic soda bottle. Minimum target mass I use is 225g...not sure what the critical diameter to perpetuate the reaction is; small targets may not perform. I've never bothered with Dark Al, but I did try it with 10% Xylene / CH3NO2 (similar to a certain patented product)...it worked fine, but for use as a target, the expense wasn't worth it . An example of ~225g of the Al Flake mix was in this thread:

 

Shoots

 

 

44 CuO

10 Bright Al Flake

 

Standard CuO thermite...this will pop from a .22 Stinger. I make up film canisters for pistol practice or when I take friends to shoot. It's a nice reactive target and the cloud of Cu left over makes for lots of "Ooooohs".

 

This is a rather large amount (300g IIRC) inside an old equipment enclosure, targeted with a .223FMJ

http://www.apcforum.net/files/RTvsCuOsmall.jpg

 

Mumbles, please advise if you feel that any of this is inappropriate.

[ns4life]

Nice,

Ill have to try that formula out. Another variation to my formula is as followed

 

Ammonium Perchlorate 40%

Ammonium Nitrate 40%

Manganese Dioxide 5%

Flake Al 10%

Dark Al 5%

 

Ill will try to find the picture/video of when we shot 75lbs (1500 meters away) with my M2 Ramo while on a Vegas vacation.

[qwezxc12]

Ill will try to find the picture/video of when we shot 75lbs (1500 meters away) with my M2 Ramo while on a Vegas vacation.

Nice! Please do...the largest target I've been able to plink at here is 2 lbs.

 

I'm trying not to be insanely jealous...if your M2 is built on a Ramo side plate, am I to infer it's Class III transferable? (or are you a FFL/SOT?) I have a 50BMG, too...but unfortunately not in that league. It's a Ferret built up on a DPMS single shot lower:

http://www.apcforum.net/files/grab00146.jpg

 

Since a Ma Deuce is out my ability to acquire, I pay my respects to John Browning with my ORF1919A4 with a crank spade grip. As the only class III allowed in my state is an AOW , that and the other goodies in my safe are the best I can do.

[ns4life]

I'm trying not to be insanely jealous...if your M2 is built on a Ramo side plate, am I to infer it's Class III transferable?

 

Yeah, I have 35 transferables in my personal collection along with a few DD's SBS, SBR and AOW's.

 

I try to make a pilgramage to Knob creek or Nevada twice a year to get my fix since the 50 doesnt run well in the indoor ranges and all the outdoor ranges in my area frown upon full auto:(

[hst45]

While not technically a binary target, I have heard of an interesting idea for an interactive target as follows:

 

Place a propane cylinder at great distance. Place can of sterno behind said cylinder. Light sterno. Retire to fining line and puncture cylinder. FAE

 

I have never tried this my self as I have no desire to light the lower field on fire, but the fellow who told me this claims to have done it. That's not a guarantee of anything; hell, people claim to have seen bigfoot, but the idea does sound feasible. I think that perhaps some bic lighters may be in danger in the near future.

 

By the way, I'm WAY jealous of you two guys toys! My wife said if I come home with ONE more gun she's leaving.........I'm really going to miss that girl........

[ns4life]

Place a propane cylinder at great distance. Place can of sterno behind said cylinder. Light sterno. Retire to fining line and puncture cylinder. FAE

 

I have tried this method and it’s hit or miss if the propane will ignite. A small setting of charcoal briquettes burning behind will ensure ignition.

 

 

If you ever attempt this, try to be at least 800 yards out since I have seen shrapnel fly off these targets. They are fun while shooting in a pitch dark night. Turn on the NV an use a spotter round.

[hst45]

So you've tried this? As I said I don't have the proper range for this, but it has always intrigued me. What is the size of the ball-0-flame, and what's the duration of the burn? I bet the effect is a blast (pun intended).

 

Cost of propane cylinder: $3.99

cost of 30-06 handload : .65

 

Mushroom cloud of flame at night : priceless

[ns4life]

So you've tried this? As I said I don't have the proper range for this, but it has always intrigued me. What is the size of the ball-0-flame, and what's the duration of the burn? I bet the effect is a blast (pun intended).

 

Actually the effect isn’t that impressive. It will make a large fireball with a small bang.

 

One of the better effects is taking a five gallon gas can filled with diesel and strapping 1-2lbs of binary target mixture to it. Put a road flare behind the target and have fun!!

 

Here a picture from the last trip to the range.

[Xenodius]

I personally use 95/5 mix of Ammonium Nitrate to Black Aluminum. My aluminum is 2 micron, (I think that equals out to ~2500 mesh, right? ) and 33 grams in an easter egg explodes hard enough to feel it on your chest from 120 yards. I shoot mine with a 22-250, 4250 fps, haven't tried anything else... also have a .17 HMR, 2550 fps, probably would work. They usually only leave a 2.5" mini-crater, but the dirt around them for 5 feet is just aerated.

 

I never realized CuO thermite was so sensitive to shock, as to ignite from a bullet... However I had a accident with 100g of that stuff 3 months ago, I was out of business for a month, and my face and hands are still pink...

Be warned.

 

Picture of me at 1 1/2 weeks: http://alkaspace.com/is.php?i=16829&img=SIMG0008.JPG

Sorry, its a bit blurry...

[hst45]

I shoot mine with a 22-250, 4250 fps

Hmm, isn't 4250 a bit optimistic? IIRC even a 40 grn v-max "only" get up to a little over 4100 fps in a 22-250. I guess the chrono doesn't lie, so if your going 4250 so be it. I'm pushing 50 grainers at just under 3800 fps and I thought THEY were fast! I try to cool them down a little bit from max velocity to keep throat erosion liveable.

 

Sorry for the tangent.

[asilentbob]

I have been meaning to try standard CuO/Al in a reactive target. Ceramic grade CuO and -325m coated flake Al. I think my dad would love them lol.

 

Adding a bit of Ti could be nice, might be lost in the Cu cloud though.

[Xenodius]

Hmm... Well it depends, my dad says a 40 grain with a full charge will go 4500, easily

[hst45]

, my dad says a 40 grain with a full charge will go 4500, easily

O.K. if it goes 4500, so be it. I've just never seen it done, but that dosen't mean it CAN'T, or HASN'T been done.

 

As i said, the chronograph dosen't lie.

[deadman]

Could your please resize the photo? Hmm, never knew thermites reacted to impact. Learn something new everyday I guess.

[Mumbles]

Well I suppose activation energy is activation energy when you get down to it.

 

Just think of thermites as slow flash powders. They are essentially the same, different burn rates.

[KAP]

I have been shooting Binary targets for three years but paying through the noze for a afternoon of fun with the guys, and the most popular one uses zirconium and says it is a molecular reaction that sets it off. I usually use my AR-15 223 rounds work fine.It has to be a high powered rifle to set it off.

I will try the al/amonium nitrate mix and see how that matches up to the others I have purchased.

[RUUUUUN]

The most Popular, Are you reffering to Tannerite Binary exploding targets? Those are just ammonium Nitrate and Aluminum powder, with like 3% zirconium as a reducing agent and 5% Titanium powder to add to the flash. I have compared them side by side with straight Ammonium nitrate/Aluminum, the Ammonium nitrate from cold packs, and the Aluminum from PyroAluminum, and I can say for a fact they are the same exact thing.

 

Except home made they are about 2 USDdollars a 250gram charge instead of 8.50 or what ever tannerite rips you off for.

 

 

 

*Edit* Yeah baby New page, no side scrolling to read posts!!!

[Mumbles]

The Ti and Zr may also help with ignition being that they are nice and spark producing. We've shot old flash salutes before for "target practice". Not sure what kind of gun, not really into it. I noticed that the Ti salutes went off easier than those without. We had a few bullets pass through the non-Ti salutes without setting them off, none of the Ti salutes though.

[KAP]

Ok,

I will stop wasting my money, the only thing is I would probably have to clean out a Walmart store of thier cold packs to have a afternoon of fun thit the guys.

 

KP

[KAP]

Sorry for the typo there on the last note.You will probably see more from me .

 

You know I had a feeling those Tannerite ingredients looked like some chem's I had seen before? but wasn't shure. I had heard that there was a US patten on the mix and Zirconium was one compound mentioned in the patten.

 

I just dont know where he got the Molecular Reaction out of this that kind of made it sound like it was special.

 

All I know and the more you mix the deeper the boom, it has helped me with the trigger flinch some .

I will also try some Ti salutes and see if there is a reaction there at the next shootout.

[FrankRizzo]

My experience mirrors that of Mumbles' with simple mixtures of perchlorate and dark aluminum failing to ignite sometimes with bullets. The addition of sulfur or titanium does make them ignite easier.