MgAl/Dark Al as BP additives.

[usapyro]

I am kinda curious if fine metals increase power much. I was thinking about it... And wouldnt fine -325 MgAl heat up the gasses much hotter than a Kno3/Charocoal/Sulfur burn and result in more power?

[usapyro]

I have been reading around and it seems some people use MgAl or Dark Al Vitamin F as a additive to give BP more power and a bright tail.

 

Anyone know what percents people do with that? +20%?

[calebkessinger]

I think it's way less than that even. I think the action is just creating a hotter flame front not really adding volume to the reaction.

Wish I knew more.

[usapyro]

Black Powder with +25% 7:3 and +10% bullet blended pine charcoal works real nice.

 

I am thinking of seeing how reliable the pressure characteristics of BP/SF with +25% 7:3 are.

 

Sugar Fuel is confectioners and ball milled Kno3.

Edited December 26, 2017 by usapyro

[CrossOut]

generally speaking, You want your fuel to produce more gas volume. for BP rockets, Adding aluminum or other metals may increase the reaction/ Burn rate however they also produce less gas volume.. 70/30 for example burns fast but doesnt really produce a whole lot of gas volume.. so while fuel consumption increases efficiency decreases. typically if you are after better performance, you will want to add something to catalyze the reaction speeding it up, but isnt consumed.. more reliably, you can change your fuel type to get a better gas volume produced ie Whistle. Alternatively you can change your tooling to allow for more BP burning at a single moment. In my case my i was making core burning nozzled rockets. i had to add charcoal to prevent CATOs by doing this i ended up losing a lot of horsepower for lifting in my motors. but it did allow for longer burn time.. I recently changed to making nozzle-less rockets using the hottest BP i can make. This allowed me get the lifting power that ive been looking for even if my fuel only burns for half a second.

[usapyro]

Been using BP/SF + 25% 7:3 for End Burners.

 

Very good characteristics... Not too pressure burn rate sensitive and tons of power.

 

I wonder if I should add 1% red iron oxide to the mix...

[NeighborJ]

There is a thread about the IBP motors which Seymour invented. It is similar but has some coarse metals added to increase the flame size for display purposes. I'll see if I can find it.https://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/11932-ibp-motor-propellant/?hl=seymour&do=findComment&comment=161409. Found it Edited December 31, 2017 by NeighborJ

[usapyro]

Yea, I was trying MgAl as an additive. Makes for a nice flame.

 

Interesting... He runs BP +30% 7:3.

[Seymour]

+ 10% MgAl + 2.5% wax.

DISCLAIMER/SAFETY: This fuel is based on BP. It is not BP, far from it. NEVER Ram this fuel. Treat it more like flash than BP. When it explodes it's like a weak-moderate flash. It's sensitivity will be high for a firework type mix. KP + Sulfur + 19% metals, MgAl and Dark Flake Al... There are many reasons this is not a beginner mix, or one I recommend others making, unless that are already quite experienced with Whistle Rockets and Flash Powder.

Original fuel/Main Variant is 60% good Black Powder (75/15/10), 30% Flash Powder (70/30 P/Dark Al), 10% MgAl (fine enough for flame not sparks) + Oil, Wax or such to taste.

I'm going to repeat myself a fair bit in this post, but hey. This fuel is called IBP, or "Insane Black Powder". I cannot remember who named it this, but it wasn't me. I just called it "6/3/1 Metal" but I'm happy to run with the name that stuck (since I never really named it)

If you make it, only ever press these motors, and good luck.

Obviously Ball Mill the BP alone, then mix in the KP and Metals by hand or with careful screening, before finally waxing (or oiling/petroleum jelly)it with a solvent-wax solution which you then dry.

Note that my two main aims for this fuel is burn speed and a decent, relatively bright flame from a BP based fuel. Not to say it is safe to treat like BP. It's got extra power compared to good BP (like the Paulownia BP I use to make it) but not a lot of extra power, maybe 10-20%... someone measured it and I seem to remember about 15% more impulse.

But the visuals are the idea behind this fuel, not power. For Power I either go fast and use Whistle or slow and use NH4ClO4 based stuff.

It makes wonderful End Burners (which I make many of) and awesome Nozzleless which seems to be what others make most of (and I make plenty too).

Indeed it's the cored nozzleless 3/4" ID motors that are the real aim in my special effects development that is the driving force behind my (controversial) BP + Flash (+ MgAl + Wax) Fuels.

Note that I also mess with the ratios a bit on occasion.

I've used some hotter MgAl and as a result got a few nozzleless ground salutes.

For End burners I still use the 60/30/10/2.5 but for Nozzleless now I use mostly:

57.5% BP Paulownia Corning Dust -40 mesh
30% Flash 70/30 KClO4/Dark Al
12.5% MgAl 100-200 mesh
+ 2.5% Wax

Though note that I tend to use shorter than usual cores on my Nozzleless rockets made with these mixes, and have a habit of using a BP grain charge to slam them out of a tube before they even light... So I have toned them down to be able to reliably handle this rather intensive ignition.

[Seymour]

If you are going for power with a BP fuel, I'd top it off at about 10% Al and leave it at that unless you're making huge motors.

The more reactive your Al (finer and ideally flake) the greater the chances it will fully burn inside the motor and not be lost out the back (like so much of the metals in my mix... but that's the idea, they burn in the exhaust flame very much intentionally.

With End Burners you need higher Surface Area Al.

If you cannot get or want to save your fine flake Al, decent MgAl will have similar but slightly less "power increase".

Of course you can always add KP too (like I did)... though of course this is not in the scope of adding Metal fuels to BP.

Note: This is and old Formula from an old member probably less active than me, Alan Yates. He calls the fuel "RP" for Rocket Propellant I assume.

Link to his (core burning Al containing BP based) fuel: http://www.vk2zay.net/composition/4

Link to his Motor details based on this fuel: http://www.vk2zay.net/article/15

Also, it just so happens that I'm working on a core burning (with Nozzle) fuel Based on KNO3, Resinox, MgAl and/or Al and a little Propylene Glycol, to soften the Resinox and make it act like Wax with great fuel properties.

Again I mostly just want big white flame and reliability, but I might see how energetic I can get it...