a newbs progress and question thread

[RiderX]

I think it might be worth it getting a star plate for the smaller sizes but here's something ancient from this site I found for when you get up to needing 1/2 inch stars.

Just thought I would link it cause its a damn useful idea.

 

http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/1932-cubic-stars-using-a-light-diffuser/

nice thank you the way im going ill never need stars that big lol

 

 

one thing i didnt flim last night was the mini shells i made

basically i took my 1id x 2.5 long tubes sat the paper plug in far enough for the right timing with the visco fuse and filled that end with hot glue then i put in a lil bit of bp and about a half gram of flash , dumped in a few stars , then some more bp and and sealed it with the paper plug and wood glue.

 

 

they actually worked really well , i used 6 g of bp to lift them out of 6 inch long 1 1/4 id tubes, it was just an experiment on my part to see what it would do, if i would have known they were going to work so well id have filmed them

[RiderX]

i think i figured out what im doing wrong with the stars ( to much water )

 

quick question as i cant find a specific answer , can i bind the d1 with red gum and alcohol , would cut my drying time down alot

Edited July 30, 2017 by RiderX

[Mumbles]

You really can't over wet stars and cause them to get soft. It pretty much works basically the opposite of that. Not wetting enough wont activate the binder. Overwetting will cause them to take longer to dry, and might affect the glitter, but it wont affect the star hardness. A proper cut star composition is somewhere around the consistency of modeling clay if making a patty. It should be a bit more crumbly if using a loaf box.

 

i don't think red gum will work. Glitters are fairly sensitive to their conditions, including binder. I believe nitrocellulose works, but most other non-aqueous binders don't.

[RiderX]

You really can't over wet stars and cause them to get soft. It pretty much works basically the opposite of that. Not wetting enough wont activate the binder. Overwetting will cause them to take longer to dry, and might affect the glitter, but it wont affect the star hardness. A proper cut star composition is somewhere around the consistency of modeling clay if making a patty. It should be a bit more crumbly if using a loaf box.

 

i don't think red gum will work. Glitters are fairly sensitive to their conditions, including binder. I believe nitrocellulose works, but most other non-aqueous binders don't.

hmm ok then i got the water amount right , i just went threw a tub of stars i have left over and if i squeeze them in my fingers most of them crumble but a few are staying together even with alot of pressure , i must not be getting the dextrin mixed in well enough

 

ill try one more 100 gram batch and screen mix the ever living crap out of it

[MrB]

ill try one more 100 gram batch and screen mix the ever living crap out of it

 

Or... Try something different. Add the dextrin to the water, on the side. Perhaps even using hot water. That means you need to have a pretty good idea on how much water you actually will use, but will on the other hand make sure you get your dextrin everywhere where there is moisture.

[rogeryermaw]

It's probably been said here but a couple of processes that may help:

 

After you have wet the comp, pack it well and rub it through like 8 mesh screen to help distribute the moisture well and observe a good dwell time, meaning after that last screening, put your loose comp into a sealed container for an hour or two before you attempt to cut so your dextrin can fully activate. You'll notice a big difference in how the patty feels when you sink your knife into it. It will hold together much better.

[RiderX]

 

Or... Try something different. Add the dextrin to the water, on the side. Perhaps even using hot water. That means you need to have a pretty good idea on how much water you actually will use, but will on the other hand make sure you get your dextrin everywhere where there is moisture.

i wouldn't have thought of that thank you

[RiderX]

It's probably been said here but a couple of processes that may help:

 

After you have wet the comp, pack it well and rub it through like 8 mesh screen to help distribute the moisture well and observe a good dwell time, meaning after that last screening, put your loose comp into a sealed container for an hour or two before you attempt to cut so your dextrin can fully activate. You'll notice a big difference in how the patty feels when you sink your knife into it. It will hold together much better.

hmm ill give that a go as well , non of the directions ive been following say anything about waiting after adding the water , thanks

[rogeryermaw]

That's a tidbit I've seen Lloyd post about. Made a big difference for me.

[RiderX]

making a ton of these lil bastards right now

lil bp in the bottom, couple stars sprinkle some meal on the stars then more granulated bp ontop with about a gram of flash ontop and cap

http://i.imgur.com/J0Q86nj.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/iK8cVrR.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/ELdtlyf.jpg

instead of using the plastic mortar bases what could plug the tubes with , for making cakes . with the plastic bases i cant get the tubes close to each other . would a paper cap and about 3/8's of an inch of hot glue be enough ? its 1.250 id tubes

50 tubes and some 5 second fuse and qm could make some cool cakes

Edited August 1, 2017 by RiderX

[PeteyPyro]

Looks like you're on your way to making cakes! I've used a hole saw to counter sink some 1 1/4" deep 'rings' into the edge of 2x4s, and then glue the tubes into the 2x4 with carpentry glue. I then 'toed' some 16 gauge brads, angled towards the center of the tubes base, for good measure. Quick and easy to nail rows of these 2x4s together for a reuseable cake.

[RiderX]

yeah sorta this is a much quicker and easier way for me to test my stars and stuff without using a ton of materials. but i am thinking ahead to making cakes

[Mumbles]

Letting compositions rest with the water is really helpful. I often see it referred to as tempering. Personally, I mash it all into a cake at the bottom of the bucket I use, and let it sit for about 30 min or so. It might be BS, but I like to think that pressing it all together allows the water to distribute more easily. Tempering is probably the most useful in charcoal compositions. They like to absorb water initially, and then release it later which can lead to overwetting if you're not careful. It's also really useful if you're going to press comets or stars. The smaller amount of water is harder to get evenly distributed, and tempering helps with that.

[RiderX]

so this might be a stupid question but assuming somone left the aluminum out of the d1 glitter comp what would the stars ended up looking like in the sky?

Edited August 2, 2017 by RiderX

[OldMarine]

Very bad Tiger Tail at best.

[rogeryermaw]

I'd think that much sulfur without the metal would be too slaggy to be very pretty. Would absolutely not be the first time I was wrong though....

[RiderX]

thanks i didtnt do it i was just curious is all

[RiderX]

It's probably been said here but a couple of processes that may help:

 

After you have wet the comp, pack it well and rub it through like 8 mesh screen to help distribute the moisture well and observe a good dwell time, meaning after that last screening, put your loose comp into a sealed container for an hour or two before you attempt to cut so your dextrin can fully activate. You'll notice a big difference in how the patty feels when you sink your knife into it. It will hold together much better.

did this tonight on a batch of TT and a Batch of D1 , huge difference thank you for the tip

[RiderX]

TT and d1 Test tonight if my bp dries intime , i have high hopes for both , thanks to the tips given to me here , i did slightly screw up cutting the tt as the patty was a little to thin so the stars are mor elike rectangles then squares , but they are rock hard and wont crumble with any amount of presure i can apply with my hands.

[Mumbles]

I know you mentioned that you live in an arid climate, but those stars can't be more than 18 h old. Are you sure they're dry already?

 

As an aside, but D1 without the metal is just basically a bad charcoal streamer with sodium bicarbonate in it. If the aluminum was ever left out, they could be crushed or ball milled back to a powder to fix the comp. The wetting, drying, and remilling process is said to improve the effect of some charcoal streamers actually. I'd need to re-read that though. I believe it's discussed somewhat in BAFN III, in the spider shell article.

[RiderX]

I know you mentioned that you live in an arid climate, but those stars can't be more than 18 h old. Are you sure they're dry already?

 

As an aside, but D1 without the metal is just basically a bad charcoal streamer with sodium bicarbonate in it. If the aluminum was ever left out, they could be crushed or ball milled back to a powder to fix the comp. The wetting, drying, and remilling process is said to improve the effect of some charcoal streamers actually. I'd need to re-read that though. I believe it's discussed somewhat in BAFN III, in the spider shell article.

it was only a 100 gram batch , with minimal water , hunidity was only 2% last night , , i even broke one in half and its bone dry on the inside. they were literally drying out as i was cutting them.

 

if i take a razor blade to one to split it its a nice solid split down the star , im actuall going to take a star outside and do a burn test right now

 

edit

 

hit the star with my lighter and it istantly lit up and burnt completely away , i do see one issue though i think i made the stars to small , have to get a shell up in the sky and see for sure though , ill put together a 2.5 inch shell tonight after work , im just home on lunch break atm

Edited August 2, 2017 by RiderX

[Mumbles]

Well, they sound good then. After you break one open the next time, try scratching the broken surface with a fingernail or knife or something. It should give a white streak all the way across when totally dry. Just an extra trick.

 

Were the stars harder this time around?

[RiderX]

Well, they sound good then. After you break one open the next time, try scratching the broken surface with a fingernail or knife or something. It should give a white streak all the way across when totally dry. Just an extra trick.

 

Were the stars harder this time around?

alot harder , the ball/patty also felt different and im not sure how to explian how , but i noticed a difference right away

 

i just put a ball shelll together that illpaste after work TT in one hemi and D1 in the other hemi, prolly wont look good in the sky but atleast it will let me see what the stars do

Edited August 2, 2017 by RiderX

[rogeryermaw]

if your humidity is that low, i'd like you to think about using some sort of humidifier in your working area. consider if static shocks are ever an issue where you live. usually more prominent in low humidity, i know around here in winter i get hit regularly and that limits what i will work on. many of our basic compositions are quite static sensitive. just a thought. safety is always the first consideration.

[PeteyPyro]

RiderX: I've 'won' 2 tiny relative humidity meters from eBay recently. They were ONLY $1.00 & $1.50, postage paid from China. I use them, along with my old Samsung Note 3's free hygrometer application to spot check humidity. I feel safer working with ✴energetic mixes✴ (flash, etc.), only when relative humidity is 60% or higher (like today). The risk of static discharges is lower as the relative humidity goes higher. My new Samsung s7 edge doesn't have a humidity detecting element inside of it (for what ever reason), and I don't always have my old phone with me in the shop. I do keep ALL phones away from my bench when I'm actively working, and only spot check the humidity before I start. Even a phone COULD be a spark source, so I leave it (them) by the door, just within earshot. I don't know how China can make and deliver such cheap peace of mind, but I'm very happy to buy it for a buck or two. I'm sure that you know this, but I am posting this for the 'newbs' reading this, as this thread is directed towards them specifically.

I attached a photo of SOME of my basic safety gear. Static Guard spray, dust/vapor respirator mask (dual cartridge type), ear muffs and plugs, safety glasses and goggles, hygrometers, leather palm gloves, bucket and jug of water, and D-Panthenol burn lotion, just for starters. Mostly from China too (except for the water).

Edited August 2, 2017 by PeteyPyro