Flyercracker concept

[OrionSpectre]

The Flyercracker is an idea that has been floating around in my head for a few years that I decided to advance to the blueprint stage. I started and hastily finished the drawing in the first half of my school day, and I have poor handwriting and drawing ability, so I apologize for any illegibility. I would appreciate any feedback, so if you see a potential design flaw, please let me know. I wish to make this information open source for anyone to build upon, so if you want, you can attempt to create it, as I lack the knowledge and tools to do so. Also, I don't know what fuel type would work, so I just put the only easily created types of solid rocket fuel I know of on the paper: KNO3, pressed gunpowder, and pulverized charcoal. I suspect these would give horrid results for this purpose, so I would like to know alternative fuels.

[FlaMtnBkr]

I hope you have thick skin as some may see some potential safety issues were you to attempt this. But having an active imagination and wanting to experiment is a good thing.

 

That said, that is just a rocket with multiple salute inserts and parts look over complicated and other parts will potentially need to be more thought out if you want an artistic timed report heading. Check out this vid if you want to see what can potentially be done:

 

 

You really just need to make a reliable rocket motor. From there you can add all types of effects including multiple salutes. If you don't care about timing of the salutes it can be an easy to make rocket, again after you get a reliable rocket motor.

 

You can also make some much simpler devices if you don't mind two bangs that don't go very high in the air. Do a search for a double voice cracker.

 

I suggest you keep reading and learn how fireworks are made. And once you get a better understanding you can possibly start experimenting with some of the easier devices that have well documented designs that you can follow a set of instructions. For now, read, read, read and learn as much as you can and see if this is a hobby you want to pursue as it can be very time consuming and expensive if you let it. Though it can also be really cheap if you stock to BP based effects and stick with the smaller sizes.

 

Keep at it and as you start to learn the traditional techniques, your designs will get better and more practical.

[OrionSpectre]

If only I had the capability to manufacture. My main idea was a rocket that threw off firecrackers with firework stars in them, an idea I've had since I was ten. The first idea was rather stupid now that I look back on it, attaching a few of those strung together packets of firecrackers with the fuses joined and under the rocket. Good thing I never got to test that idea out, knowing me, I probably would have gripped it. This idea was supposed to keep the fuses lit at all times by keeping them from winds, but I'd probably need to put some oxidizer in there to keep it lit. The more I think about it, the less feasible it seems.

[OldMarine]

The double voice crackers are a hoot! I make and keep them in several sizes for when I need a pick me up and to smell some powder. They also make use of scrap pieces of rocket tube.

I'd also recommend tourbillions as a simple bit very satisfying device. No bang involved but the dome shaped display of sparks is awesome and you can vary the metals in the comp for differing effects.

Edited November 16, 2016 by OldMarine

[OrionSpectre]

I really need to learn. I'm sorry, OldMarine, but I didn't understand most of those terms. Well, time to read up on pyrotechnic devices.

[OldMarine]

Danny Creagan has some great stuff on his blog with good directions. You should bookmark it. Here's an explanation of double voice crackers which I think you'd really enjoy building: http://www.creagan.net/fireworks/doublevoice.html

[OrionSpectre]

I'm kind of 14 years old, so...

[OldMarine]

I'm kind of 14 years old, so...

What does that have to do with anything? You know how to read and appear to have a desire to learn pyrotechnics. Just keep reading and learning and you'll progress. I was just reading the PGI bulletin from October and there were people younger than you offering entries in several categories.

I'd suggest you study the safe and proper manufacture of black powder which will open a whole world of wonderful flying, sparking, popping things you'll thoroughly enjoy, including those we mentioned above. Just remember, safety is the most important factor when messing with pyrotechnics. Never be afraid to ask a question here and use the search function as much as possible because 99% of the questions you would pose have already been asked and answered a dozen times or more.

Don't get in a hurry to do the stuff in the videos I know you've been looking at on YouTube because most will fuck you up. For tutorials I'd recommend Ned Gorski or Paul Moulder but not many others.

Don't mean to come off as a bossy ass know-it-all (I'm Not) but you'd have heard it from the rest eventually.

Be safe and have fun!

[Richtee]

I really need to learn. I'm sorry, OldMarine, but I didn't understand most of those terms. Well, time to read up on pyrotechnic devices.

 

Jr...it’s time to do ALOT of reading. I had about written ya off as a K3WL. Keep your appendages for turning pages for a while.

[OrionSpectre]

I've never built anything explosive, incendiary, or dealing with fire in my life. Closest I've come was probably yesterday evening, when I got my parents to fill a small jar with hydrogen peroxide and rubbing alcohol to test vapor ignition, although we couldn't put it out until my mother put a Halloween candle holder thing, bur it touched and broke the jar, putting two holes in it, the larger of which was directly above the fuel line, scarily enough. Do you think the peroxide did anything, because I think it kept the fire going, since I couldn't blow on it and put it out. Though it was neat seeing that blue flame in the wind effect. I think it acted as an oxidizer.

[OrionSpectre]

Also, how does one source KNO3 and saltpeter?

[Mumbles]

KNO3 and saltpetre are the same thing, so you only need to source one. It can be found in some hardware and home improvement stores as a stump remover. Spectracide is a popular brand, though there are several others. They'll run probably $7-8/lb so it's not the most economical long term source. A majority of people obtain it through online pyrotechnic suppliers or from farming or agricultural supply houses. It's a very common fertilizer, and pretty cost effective from this route. You have to invest in 50lbs or so at a time but it should only be $1-2/lb. It can be found through some online or in person ceramic supply houses too. There are a few other sources as well, but hopefully this will get you started. Let us know if you're struggling finding it and we can hopefully help out.

[OrionSpectre]

I'm sorry, I mistyped, I meant KNO3 and sulfur.

[OrionSpectre]

Also, money isn't the tightest it's ever been, but still, our budget should roughly be around $15, but I am perfectly open to (and wish for) starting with small projects.

[FlaMtnBkr]

$15 won't buy much in today's world, especially if you have to pay for shipping.

 

As mentioned, a bottle of stump remover can be a local source of KNO3 available in most hardware stores. Just make sure you read the label and that it is the right type. Sulfur can also be at a hardware or garden store. There are different types and I'm not sure which the best one will be. Dusting sulfur will work for making BP though it usually has about 10% clay added so that it is free flowing.

 

You can easily make your own charcoal and you can also buy it. Just make sure you don't use charcoal briquettes that are uniform squares and have a logo pressed into them. They are full of binders like clay as well as partially cooked charcoal and even small pieces of wood that probably help give food a smoke flavor. If you are going to buy it instead of make it, there are high quality sources on the internet or you can get lump or 'Cowboy' charcoal where you can see that each piece has the shape of the piece of wood it was made from. This is the type of charcoal that is used in the Big Green Egg brand/style of grill. The BGE brand of charcoal will likely be more expensive but that info may help a store employee point you to the right type. But making your own is by far the best bet and yields the best charcoal.

 

But there are many fun and interesting projects you can do without having to buy a bunch of specialized chemicals and tools. I really suggest you read everything you can and don't get impatient. Pick something you are interested in and search about it here and read everything you can. You will also learn about other things and give you more ideas to research. Pyrotechnics isn't exactly a safe hobby since it deals with fire and oxidizers that keep a composition burning so it's not easily extinguished. You need to learn the safe way to do things as well as the safety equipment you need on hand. You should also always start small until you understand the behavior of what you're working with. There are many safety items you should have and use depending on what you are doing. But you should always wear safety glasses and have a 5 gallon bucket of water and another of sand close by. There have been quite a few times I've been glad to have a water hose close by as well as a shovel to beat out small grass fires.

 

But I suggest you start with some small experiments and projects while you read and learn about the pyro hobby. There are lots of things you can do with things you probably already have on hand. You can make small match rockets with a kitchen match and aluminum foil. They don't always work and only shoot about 20' when they do work but it can be fun and I made hundreds as a kid. You can make a water rocket with a 2L bottle and a bike pump. A good smoke bomb is fun if you get some KNO3. Or if you can find instant cold packs that contain ammonium nitrate, you can make an impressive smoke bomb with just that and newspaper. Soak sheets of newspaper in a saturated solution of AN and water and when completely wet let most of the extra water drip off and then lay on the grass in the sun and keep turning it over until completely dry. Roll it up into a cylinder and light the very center rolls and after a few seconds thick white smoke will start pouring out. You can add more and more sheets to make it bigger. But it needs to be used right away because AN is extremely hygroscopic and will quickly get damp from the humidity in the air.

 

With the internet you can find literally hundreds of projects that are fun and let you learn about science, making things, and how stuff works and many use normal household items.

 

Anyways, I know I keep saying it, but knowledge is power and you will need to know things before you do them so it's best to read, read, read and learn as much as you can and as you get further in the hobby you will be better prepared and have a good idea of what to do.

[OrionSpectre]

Then, one question: If I were to mix Peroxide and alcohol, would it stay mixed? And if so, for how long, and will the HP be an oxidizer? I've read it's one of the most powerful oxidizers, but alcohol floats on it. Or is that ether?

[NeighborJ]

Nah, your wasting your time searching thru your medicine cabinet looking for fireworks supplies. The oxidisers you need are in powder form and often need to be quite pure. You will get yourself into trouble or hurt trying things from the Anarchist cookbook. If you can't find info on certain things here, then there is likely a very good reason for it. Mumbles guided you to the most readily available oxidizer we use, it is also the most useful. kno3 can be used for everything from black powder to sugar rockets and so much more. Talk of fireworks is welcome but talk of homemade IEDs are not and it will get you another locked topic, not to mention the loss of this valuable resource.

[patsroom]

I see that you tried a liquid fuel experiment, might I suggest "Ghost Mines" or at lease color flames in a container. At the very least it is not that much in cost and can be done in a controlled way. The one I am thinking about is the green colored one, even making orange a and yellow would be on the cheap cost side of things to get started.. Boric can be found in wal-mart as it is used for killing cockroaches ( a few dollars for 8 ozs) for orange-calcium chloride which can be found at any home brew store wine making store. They usually come in 2 oz. packs. And for yellow common table salts should do the trick.

For the fuel one can use methyl alcohol, now this can be found a Wal-mart in the car fuel additives for a few dollars.

Do not use a glass container for this as you seen what can happen, that is unless it is design for this use, like an alcohol storm lightern.You could use a steel bowl, even pour a little out on a hard surface or a pile of sand.

It does not take alot of the dry chemicals to get the color flames.

To find out more you can check out Skylighters Firework tips in Issue #14 at Skylighter.com and the best part is it is free to do so. I hope this is some help in getting you started in firework making and it is a step in how to make another great firework, good luck stay safe.........................Pat

Coloring agents:

• Red: Lithium chloride (actually any soluble lithium salt)
• Orange: Coloring agents:
  • Red: Lithium chloride (actually any soluble lithium salt)
  • Orange: Calcium chloride
  • Yellow: Sodium chloride
  • Green: Boric acid
  • Blue: (nothing - alcohol burns blue)
  • Violet: Potassium iodide

[OrionSpectre]

Should've been Pyrex, I guess.

[patsroom]

I'm sorry, I mistyped, I meant KNO3 and sulfur.

Yes stump remover is a good source for KNO3. but make sure it says Potassium Chlorate or KNO3 at a very high percentage. Now for sulfer, I have used the garden powder sulfur. IIRC it was 99% and it work for making black powder (the smell was never right when lit). Just read the labels to make sure it is 95% or better sulfur powder and acid free as you can get. Others here might help in that.........Pat

 

Edit- I should have said Potassium Nitrate not Chlorate, as chlorate is not KNO3. Missed it by this much.

Edited November 18, 2016 by patsroom

[FlaMtnBkr]

Patsroom, I think you mean potassium nitrate.

 

Stay away from chlorate until you have quite a few more years of experience.

[patsroom]

Patsroom, I think you mean potassium nitrate.

 

Stay away from chlorate until you have quite a few more years of experience.

Quite right, I did mean potassium nitrate as the type use in stump remover. Thanks for the catch.............Pat

[MrB]

 

I see that you tried a liquid fuel experiment, might I suggest "Ghost Mines" or at lease color flames in a container. At the very least it is not that much in cost and can be done in a controlled way. The one I am thinking about is the green colored one, even making orange a and yellow would be on the cheap cost side of things to get started.. Boric can be found in wal-mart as it is used for killing cockroaches ( a few dollars for 8 ozs) for orange-calcium chloride which can be found at any home brew store wine making store. They usually come in 2 oz. packs. And for yellow common table salts should do the trick.

For the fuel one can use methyl alcohol, now this can be found a Wal-mart in the car fuel additives for a few dollars.

Do not use a glass container for this as you seen what can happen, that is unless it is design for this use, like an alcohol storm lightern.You could use a steel bowl, even pour a little out on a hard surface or a pile of sand.

It does not take alot of the dry chemicals to get the color flames.

To find out more you can check out Skylighters Firework tips in Issue #14 at Skylighter.com and the best part is it is free to do so. I hope this is some help in getting you started in firework making and it is a step in how to make another great firework, good luck stay safe.........................Pat

Coloring agents:

• Red: Lithium chloride (actually any soluble lithium salt)
• Orange: Coloring agents:
  • Red: Lithium chloride (actually any soluble lithium salt)
  • Orange: Calcium chloride
  • Yellow: Sodium chloride
  • Green: Boric acid
  • Blue: (nothing - alcohol burns blue)
  • Violet: Potassium iodide

 

 

At best i'm of to a tangent...

The salts dissolve in the alcohol, and then acts as they burn? Would a stick, log, soaked in the alcohol, and then dried burn with a colored flame throughout? At all?

B!

[OldMarine]

If you soak a small almost rotten log with the alcohol chem solution it will burn in color. They sell the compressed wood logs than burn in colors now but I like homemade better.

[OrionSpectre]

Chlorate... Yay, exploding rocket motor! I guess it would make a cool show, though, minus the stars burning and subsequently maiming everything within, let's say, 10-30 meters. Don't go near a dud. Ever. That's reckless, even by my standards. But, seriously, safety is paramount! You forget your safety goggles, then the pyrotechnics forget your eyes are there. Plus, they tend to be rather indiscriminate risk sources. I don't want to end up... Like Tad. That story... It reminds us of the true danger rocket manufacturers undergo, and, quite vividly, the cost as well. I don't want to lose a limb or be able to reenact those hospital pictures I view all too often. Missing fingers, discolored flesh, holes in skin, scarring, scorched skin... Never play with fire.