Where to get star cores?

[grimreefer24601]

Doesn't lead shot produce dangerous fallout? Shouldn't something more likely to burn up be used?

[OldMarine]

I've been hunting with lead shot for years with no collateral damage. #7 shot and below are negligible in weight and usually burn along with the comp rolled on them.

The sorry old guy who got me hooked on pyro actually studied up on lead shot as cores and that was what he found. Small shot gets vaporized in the star.

[schroedinger]

Lead Shot is one point of where minds turn apart. I for my part tried lead whot once and never again. It is quite hard to get it to first start taking up comp. There is no reson to cover them in clay like it sometimes get's mentioned.

But the main point is that many lead compounds are very toxic and i don't like to put it out in an unknown form, specially vapors are very reactive. But i also don't see any other reason to use it. If you can get them use moleculare sives, they work much better.

 

Else I prefer the use of rape seed, cut stars or make microstars (Starch binders make production of them a lot easier compared to dextrine).

[joeyz]

meowmix, i assume your asking this because you want to roll stars with multiple star effects.

 

from my own experience... in "snow ball" rolling stars, you can skip the core media of bird shot or seeds entirely.

 

remember, one of the reasons why bp coated rice hulls is used in a shell is to reduce weight. lead adds weight (its like adding a 9mm bullet to your shell). starting from ground zero of putting lead shot or seeds into a star roller takes time to roll and build up. i found it faster and easier to cut my stars then roll them while they are damp to make them round. i find this method most favorable, especially when building a multi colour star with 2 effects, examples: tiger tail to yankee flashers, tiger tail to red, green to red, red to silver to blue, tiger tail to sunrise yellow, etc.

 

steps without any lead shot or seeds?

 

1. mix your core composition in container like a plastic bowl. make your wet pizza dough with water/alcohol. lets use yankee flashers as an example composition to build a core instead of lead shot or seeds.

 

2. lay your pizza dough on a table board cutting board, flatten and sqaure the dough to desired thickness (framing). for this example i will want 1/8" thickness.

 

3. place a 1/8" screen over the top and press lightly to create cutting line markings on the pizza dough and cut your stars. if you dont have any screen, just eye your row cuts if you can with ruler or tape measure. let the stars sit until they are just damp but firm, partially dry.

 

4. toss the core stars into the roller and start rolling at moderate speed. the corners of the soft but firm cut stars will quickly start to round out, transforming from square to round cores. start tossing a couple of teaspoons of your next dry composition. periodically lightly mist the the stars with water or alcohol as needed and add more dry mix as you see the dry mix all absorbed by the core stars. repeat this process until the stars reach your desired diameter, example 1/4". i found this process the easiest, fastest and cleaner. the larger the core diameter the easier it is to snowball roll to larger size because it has more mass surface area to absorb the dry compositions.

 

NOTE 1:

if you need a hot prime for a cold core star composition, add that thin layer first before adding the next desired color/effect composition. sometimes the outter layer effect isnt hot enough to fire off the cold core star when it reaches the core layer.

 

NOTE 2:

if your making just one effect star, lets say a bunch of 3/8" red stars or whatever, then just cut your pizza dough into desired size squares and your all done and let it dry out. the effect in the sky is the same as a rolled star. the main reason why stars are rolled is because people use multi effect compositions (2-3 layered effects), it gaurantees an even burn transition from one color effect (example: tiger tail) to the next colour effect (red star). but if you really want round stars, take part of the tiger tail composition and make into pizza dough cut 1/4" stars, then toss damp stars into roller to round off the pointy square edges and apply the rest of the dry composition by the spoon full until you reached your 3/8" mark. a friend of mine said, "hey joe, check out these 3/8" tiger tails i made, took me just two hours to make." i said, "check out my 3/8" square tiger tail stars, took me just 15 minutes to make."

 

so why do chines factories roll all their stars? many reasons. standard, flexibility, pass fire, round semetric breaks in packed ball shells, etc. they also stock up a variety so they can quickly test, mix and match variety of things (shells, mines, rockets, cakes, roman candles etc), pulling one color of stars off the shelf and adding a second and third layer effects for something else. also, imo, round stars take fire easier then square stars in compacted fireworks. the round taper star and triangle hole inbetween stacks of stars allows better pass fire, wraps 3/4 of the star in fire and quickly passes fire to the next row of stars or other things in a firework. square stars do work just fine, italians do it all the time, famous for cylinder shells. when making square stars, attention to detail, good priming on some types of stars, and off setting the row of stars, especially when building a square wall in cylinders. i have had no problems with cut square stars in normal ball shells. as a havit, i will toss my damp cut stars into a bowl (with bp meal) and shake & swirl around for a few minutes to round off the edges for a better pass fire.

 

there are many methods and purposes of use so it basically all just depends on what firework art your trying to make. hope this was helpful.

 

sorry if i got carried away. and not questioning anyonoe's star making. just sharing methods/steps to all of no need for lead or seed, get faster results, save time, electricity, having to acquire lead and seed resources. no matter if lead, seeds or 1/8" cut star cores, you still have to make a core from something. i just find easier using this jump start method with something you already have.

Edited August 29, 2016 by joeyz

[Mumbles]

Lead is often used as a core for begininers because it's easy. Yes it's heavy and toxic. It tends to burn up with the star though. There isn't much of a fallout hazard from what I know, but you are still releasing lead into the environment. Being rather heavy, the stars and cores are less likely to clump together which can make them attractive to start with. They also roll pretty nicely for the same reason. There are a lot of options out there though. They're not as easy, but a little practice will get seeds, molecular sieves, granular comp, or whatever other core you choose to work.

 

Despite what Joeyz says, cut stars do take fire easier than round stars. They have a higher surface area for the same sized stars, and possess sharp corners and edges from which fire can easy light the prime. It really has nothing to do with how they're packed into a shell.

 

Commercially round stars are used for most things, at least in shells coming out of Asia. They work better for ball shells, which they specialize in over there. Rolling stars also scales well. It really doesn't take much longer to roll 10kg of stars vs. 1kg of stars. If you were cutting or pumping the the time is somewhat proportional to the batch size. It may not quite take 10x as long to cut 10kg of stars vs. 1kg, but it will be significantly longer. Each star type has it's advantages and disadvanages, as well as application where it's best. Eventually it's helpful to be proficient at all three methods.

[fredjr]

I used to use mustard seeds but after awhile I learned to roll with no cores. Simply put some dry comp in roller at low speed and lightly spritz with water. Takes a little practice but simple once you do it a few times. It does help to have speed control, but a good star roller needs that anyways.

[ExplosiveCoek]

Or just use blasting grit .

[Nessalco]

I just learned to roll stars last year, but I use mustard seed with good effect.

 

KO

Edited September 4, 2016 by Nessalco

[OldMarine]

I see molecular sieves sold for this purpose. Is there an advantage to using them or is it purely an economic/availability thing?

[dagabu]

I see molecular sieves sold for this purpose. Is there an advantage to using them or is it purely an economic/availability thing?

 

They work very well for starters, I have plenty if you want some, I'll send them 1st class if you can pay the postage? You simply add them into water (dont add water to them, you can boil the water!) and pour off the extra water, set them out of a towel to shed the extra water, put them on a paper towel and pat dry.

 

Use sparingly, I think there are about 1000 per teaspoon?

 

I just drop them into an ice-cream bucket, add a teaspoon of my comp without coarse metals and swirl until its all gone. I do this until I get them to the size I like for the star roller. 3/16"?

 

Winokur #1 white strobe is pretty cool to roll on the cores, just the first coating though as the strobe burns slowly. It has both Potassium Dichromate and Barium Nitrate, be forewarned.

TR's White Strobe is also very nice, just one coating too since it's slow. With one coating, I get just one bright flash at the end. the real benefit is that used to bring it up to 3/16" and using a faster comp over that, you get a very pleasant sky full of shimmering as the strobe burns off.

Topped off with Truely Red by TrueBluePyro, the stars can be kept REALLY small and the shell can be filled with twice the count to give a HUGE cloud of red followed by the shimmering/strobing. It's an amazing effect!

[OldMarine]

I appreciate the offer Dave but my star rolling is limited to a Rubbermaid cake pan for now! I've bought a HF cement mixer but am waiting on the stealth mod parts before i mess with it.

[calebkessinger]

The seives I have are larger than anything else I've ever used which should be very beneficial. I haven't tried them yet though. They are at least twice the size #7 lead shot. If I ever get time i'm gonna make a Million of them !

[dagabu]

I think mine are about 3/32" across. They sure do roll nice!

[NeighborJ]

If you're gonna use an inert material like molecular sieve for star cores why not just use kno3 prills? At least they'll burn.

[dagabu]

Try them and report back with your results.

[starxplor]

So, I have never rolled stars, only used a plate so far. I am thinking about getting started manually rolling before trying to build a full machine that I am not sure where I would store it at this point.

I found these three examples and it brought up some questions:

https://www.amazon.com/Molecular-Sieve-Beads-500g-Bottle/dp/B00B95ZC12/

https://www.amazon.com/Dualspices-Mustard-Seed-Yellow-Pound/dp/B00UJ2H6WE/

https://www.amazon.com/Frontier-Mustard-CERTIFIED-ORGANIC-package/dp/B0001M0YLM/

 

1) I have never seen mustard seeds, how do the sizes compare to the 1/8in sieves listed above?

2) any difference between yellow or brown seed in pyro terms?

3) wow, the sieves are more than twice the price per weight. At that rate, can they really take up comp so much better as to be worth the price?

[braddsn]

Star, what you choose as cores will depend a lot on what size shells you intend to use the stars in. For example, when I started rolling stars, another pyro recommended peppercorns because they are fairly large, and pick up comp very easily. Perfect to learn on. However, because of their size, they ended up causing problems in my 3 inch shells. There is not a lot of room in a 3" shell, and with the peppercorns being so large, the final primed stars were too big and not many would fit in the shell, giving the break a sparse look. A friend turned me on to lead shot, and I am never looking back. They are heavy, very small, and pick up comp great. Plus, they are cheaper than any other cores that you will find. Those sieves that you linked are pretty large in terms of cores. They are 1/8". The lead shot that I use is .095". Here is a link to a smaller bag of shot in case you want to give it a try. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01C51TD22?psc=1

[starxplor]

Ahh, sorry, forgot to post about my situation. I am building 4in shells, so far using 1/2" TT/willow stars so I haven't had to prime on top of that size. Given my limited time per year to build up north, it is unlikely I am going to do anything bigger any time soon.

 

I noticed they also had a smalled, 1lb bag, but then saw the price was only half of the 4lb bag, heh.

 

I may try these, but I am still a bit worried about the whole lead toxicity thing.

[dagabu]

Why buy Molecular Sieves? Just open desiccant cylinders, they are full of them.

[calebkessinger]

I think I bought a couple bags from Karl at pgi. They were only 10 bucks each.. When a guy realizes how many cores that makes the price isn't really an issue.

Free is always good.. Tried for years to get my buddy to give me some from some of his desiccant cylinders and we just never made it happen.

 

To each his own. I'm gonna try em, and unless they suck or something funny happens I bet I fall in love with em.

[dagabu]

Cores are a funny thing, I can roll a batch one day and the next, I only get star turds and nothing grows! Good luck Caleb, I hope you do love them.