What should I do.....

[WindowLicka]

I have these chemicals and wanted to know what Stars I could make with them?

All are in 1 lb. amounts.

Potassium chlorate, potassium perchlorate, potassium nitrate x2

Barium nitrate, barium carbonate, strontium nitrate, strontium carbonate

Chlorinated rubber

Surfer

And several meshes of charcoal

 

After looking at my inventory I noticed I have absolutely no metals to work with.

Besides the stars I was going to make up some fountains, gerbs ,ect. For a mini display for my kids on the 4th this year. The past 3 years I went down and bought from the phantom booths that spring up all over here around the 4th, only to plunk out my hard earned ca$h for inferior junk they push that's overpriced and underwhelming to say the least.

Is there anything else that I might wanna add to the chemicals I already have to make for good gerb and 3" shell star compositions?

I see a lot of comps with the chess I have call for red gum and was toying with getting it. Gerbs without metals seems lacking. What is the most spectacular metal to add to a gerb?

 

I figure I have a decent start on assembling a good little show for my kids this year I just could use some help from some people that know which compositions they liked enough to mention are good ones.

[lloyd]

You really don't have the makings of anything, there, except for black powder.

 

Charcoal gerbs are quite attractive!

 

Lloyd

[Mike]

Charcoal gerbs and shells.

For stars use C6, C8, Willow or TT.

You can often get atomized Al at local art or automotive shops, sold as an additive for epoxy. The paint stars also often carry flake al.

[WindowLicka]

Really? Nothing but black powder? Seeing how that was the first thing I mixed and milled, that's a bummer.

I been wasting my money on all the wrong chemicals it seems. I got the barium and strontium nitrate and carbonates because I thought they would make red and green comps eventually. Then I got the parlon because They need a chlorine donor it seems. A lot of star comps Seem to also require red gum also.

 

What would you get Lloyd, if you only had what I listed and you wanted to make some red and green 2" & 3" shells, along with some fountains and mines?

 

For a deep green What is needed barium chlorate? The strontium nitrate makes deep enough reds. When it comes to metals is it just up to your individual taste in effects? They just cost quite a bit more than a lot of the oxidizes and colorants. I just don't want to buy metal 'X' only to find out it's only used for (blank), and I don't incorporate it into the fireworks I'm set on making for the 4th.

 

I know I'm coming across like a noob but hey, it is what it is. I'm not asking anything but your opinion because I respect what you've accomplished and want and value your input. So if you wanna say I got nothing, go play with some charcoal fountains, that's alright.

[PhoenixRising]

Mike just listed some comps for you: Tiger Tail, Willow, C6 or C8 are all charcoal, nitrate, and sulfur.

 

Some 200-325 mesh Magnalium and Dextrin would get you a long ways with what you have. Until you get some metal fuels you are pretty much stuck. Hope this helps.

Edited June 6, 2016 by PhoenixRising

[BlueComet24]

This might be a good starting place to help you find compositions you can make: http://pyrodata.com/composition/filter-advanced

Use ctrl+click to select multiple chemicals/types/authors/etc in a column. You should further research compositions that you find, and remember to not mix chlorates with sulfur.

Here's another: http://www.pyrodb.org/compositionIndex.php5

 

"Nothing but black powder" is actually a large variety of different (but mostly similar) compositions. For stars, you'll need dextrin, so go bake some cornstarch.

I like 8:3:2 KNO3:sulfur:BP for gold fountains torches.

16 Sr(NO3)2, 4 KNO3, 5 sulfur, 1 charcoal, and 1 sawdust makes an okay red for flares.

I'm going to assume you have sugar, in which case you can make rocket candy. It's great fun for smokes flares, rockets, I've even made stars from it, but remember that it likes to fly.

You can also make BP rockets and helicopters. Helicopters only require a dowel and a drill bit, while rockets require special tooling, which is possible to make. Here are my blueprints for the tooling set I made for ¼" rockets: http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/gallery/image/3454-1oz-endburner-tooling/

[Mumbles]

It may not seem like it, but there is a vast amount of things you can do with just potassium nitrate, charcoal, and sulfur. If you've never built a shell or a fountain before, I'd highly suggest starting with just charcoal based compositions. They're safe, easy, and reliable. They also make a fantastic base to branch off from. You can start making comets, a whole variety of inserts, or rockets. Toss in atomized aluminum or MgAl, and you can start making glitters. Titanium or coarse aluminum can really add something new to streamers, inserts, comets, and fountains.

[Mike]

Get 200 mesh mg/al and red gum. Then you can make most shimizu formulas or veline.

[MadMat]

You have everything needed to make the green stars I make, WITH the exception of red gum and a binder (dextrin,sgrc ect.) You can make dextrin at home by baking cornstarch. So, if ordering more chemicals is a problem for you, for whatever reason, there's your answer for a binder. Just spread out the cornstarch in a thin layer on a sheet pan. Bake at 350-375 F, giving the cornstarch a stir and redistribution about every 15 minutes. It takes around 1-2 hours.

 

Anyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe dextrin is also available at home wine/beer making supply places. Dextrin is sometimes added when making beer. It gives a slightly sweet flavor and a fuller mouth "feel" (body?) to the beer.

Edited June 6, 2016 by MadMat

[Mumbles]

I've never seen actual dextrin, in the sense that we use it, in a homebrew shop. They have dextrin malt, which is a grain that contributes them to the beer which improves head retention and mouthfeel to some degree. They also sell maltodextrin which is closer. You could give this a try, but I'm not sure that it would work. In my experience (which may vary brand to brand) it behaves more like a sugar than dextrin. It's sticky and hygroscopic, but I'm not sure how well it actually binds.

 

In other words, it'd probably be better to cook it yourself. It's not perfect, but it will work.

 

The other think to keep in mind is priming. Metal-fueled colored stars are harder to light. You'll be able to make a hot prime out of the things you have, and the things you'll need to make colored stars however. It's just something to factor in when trying to plan out how much of everything you need.

[Arthur]

Fireworks before the chlorate era were all based on different ways of making effects with charcoal sulphur and nitre. Some dextrin added to your stock would let you make BP for lift and break charges and lots of charcoal star effects. You could become a very good fireworker if you mastered shells mines and comets using only variant BP.

 

Once you have made some really bad attempts at BP you will have some fountain mix! Once you have good fast BP you can make spollettes and Quick Match.

 

Then once you have perfected 2 - 6" shells and mines using charcoal stars you can add aluminium for brightness and bicarb for twinkles/glitter.

 

Then every shell can contain a different colour but by then your first batch of chems will be long gone. For a system I like the Veline colours but each colour can be done better with something else though veline is fully mixable to get mixed colours.

[lloyd]

I agree.

 

When I wrote that "all you can make" is BP, that's HARDLY a limitation for making really great fireworks! Some of my best (trophy-winning) gerbs were only "plain ol' BP" (with a little help).

 

LLoyd

[OldMarine]

When I first joined this site I posed the same question. I had only a few more chems than Windowlicka and was amazed by the options my small chem stash offered. Of course I've got the bug now and spend money like I'm going to the electric chair tomorrow!

[chuckufarley]

Of course I've got the bug now and spend money like I'm going to the electric chair tomorrow!

Ain't that the truth!

[stix]

. . . I've got the bug now and spend money like I'm going to the electric chair tomorrow!

 

F*ck the electric chair! Apparently the "Pyro Chair" is a far more satisfying option.

[OldMarine]

I'm out in my little shop labeling and arranging tubs and buckets of chems and various forms of BP amid my tools (press, mill, various grinders, multiple rocket and gerb tools) trying my darndest not to contemplate the amount of moolah involved. If it eats at me too much, I'll press up a gerb and let 'er rip!

[WindowLicka]

Man oh man, where to begin....

 

I'll keep it short by saying thank everyone who replied so much.

Just those 12 (or so)replies have given me several awesome links,

multiple star compositions (exactly what I asked for),

and some good sound advice.

I think the inspiration to ask what to do with what I got was your post OldMarine. I feel a certain compulsion to try and absorb all the pyro knowledge I can since I mixed my first batch of black powder.

It actually looked more brown than black and burned slow as hell. It's since been getting better and better.

Well again thank you all for the advice and I'll see you around here I'm sure.

[OldMarine]

OOOHRAH! And carry on!

[stix]

I like your attitude Licka, keep persevering and you'll get somethere. I'm not that much ahead of you except for some metals to play around with. Making dextrin as MadMat described is pretty easy. I found it satisfying and rewarding, with a nice healthy dose of accomplishment

 

Interestingly, a while back I bought some 'commercial grade' dextrin thinking that "finally I've got the proper stuff". I can't tell any difference. Either I can't tell because I don't have enough experience or I made some good dextrin, or the supplier makes theirs the same way and sells it as commercial. In any case, it works and I've got enough of it to last a lifetime.

 

I've never seen actual dextrin, in the sense that we use it, in a homebrew shop. They have dextrin malt, which is a grain that contributes them to the beer which improves head retention and mouthfeel to some degree. They also sell maltodextrin which is closer. You could give this a try, but I'm not sure that it would work. In my experience (which may vary brand to brand) it behaves more like a sugar than dextrin. It's sticky and hygroscopic, but I'm not sure how well it actually binds.

 

In other words, it'd probably be better to cook it yourself. It's not perfect, but it will work.

 

The other think to keep in mind is priming. Metal-fueled colored stars are harder to light. You'll be able to make a hot prime out of the things you have, and the things you'll need to make colored stars however. It's just something to factor in when trying to plan out how much of everything you need.

 

Yeah Mumbles, from what I've read maltodextrin is more like a sugar than dextrin. Apparently it's a good fuel for sugar rockets but I've never tested it. Here in Oz it's very expensive around $US50 per kilo. I believe the reason being is to dissuade drug-lords from using it to cut their drugs.

 

I was going to order some once, but erred on the side of caution. After-all, I'd much rather be on the 'pyro list' than the 'drug-lord' one.

[WindowLicka]

I have an unrelated question about flash powder made with potassium perchlorate. I know the chemical is good and it's the high purity stuff and not the Chinese stuff w/anti cake. So why is it that salutes made with chlorate go boom, no problem. But flash made with perchlorate spew out fire from the fuse hole no matter how well confined it is?

I know the two are like apples and oranges but every composition made with perchlorate, sulfur, aluminum, stuffed in a 9/16 x 1 1/2 tube won't salute for me? I plug them with paper end plugs glued with elmers-all. Then I hot glue the plastic end plugs on top of those. And I always hot glue the fuse in the fuse hole.

I mean it's really overkill, with chlorate flash The paper ends are all I need, no hot glue on them bad boys.

 

Anyone know what I'm missing ?

Edited June 10, 2016 by WindowLicka

[BlueComet24]

Perchlorate and chlorate are NOT like apples and oranges. They're like apples and... pears? They're pretty similar for most uses, but still noticeably different. It sounds to me like you're not mixing your chemicals together well, are not using good ratios, or have bad chems. What's the aluminum you're using, and where's your perchlorate from?

You should use 70% perchlorate and 30% aluminum, the finer the better.

[WindowLicka]

Homemade aluminum powder is gonna be the culprit most likely then. KP from pyrochemsource, I know it's not that chemical or the source. Most likely operator error with the mixing and my aluminum. What's the best grade aluminum for flash? 3 or 30 micron?

[OldMarine]

Here's an older thread I've found very interesting.

http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/223-the-best-flash-powder/page-3

[lloyd]

You're missing SOMETHING really fundamental! Just 7:3 perc/aluminum (by weight) makes a flash powder that is nearly able to explode in an open pile, much less contained in a tube!

 

Tell us about your aluminum!

 

Lloyd

[Mouse]

Cheers for the refresher o.m!!