Rkteer Posted April 11, 2016 Posted April 11, 2016 Hey guys new here. I have some questions on a home made visco machine, all the ones I have seen seem to have the thread spools just sitting there. Do they need some tension on them? I got some cheap thread off eBay which seems to be snapping every now and then. I am using a washer, spring then nut so as to put a little tension on the threads so they don't spin as freely. What size nozzle hole should I use between the first die and the funnel containing the powder?
FlaMtnBkr Posted April 12, 2016 Posted April 12, 2016 Not many people are going to have used a machine but there is a guy that was just making one and Lloyd will likely have a good answer for you. Maybe do a search and find that recent machine thread and message the guy. And Lloyd will probably show up on his own. I would say loosen them until you stop breaking thread. Probably wouldn't hurt to really loosen it up with just enough resistance so they don't keep spinning and unwind a bit when you stop. Then see if it even makes a difference in your end product having minimal resistance and you will know how important it is. As for the nozzle hole, I'm not sure what you are describing. Maybe a picture or a quick sketch would help? I would think the funnel nozzle would empty into the first sizing die and not sure what you would be using in between. If you get a chance, show us your machine when you are done! Always cool to see and some pictures, or a video of it in action and maybe of some fuse burning would be great. Good luck getting all the bugs out!
OldMarine Posted April 12, 2016 Posted April 12, 2016 Strange. I just PM'ed Twignberry about this very subject before reading the thread.
lloyd Posted April 12, 2016 Posted April 12, 2016 On all the commercial machines I've seen (including the 1/4" time fuse machine I own), the twine is not "unrolled" from the spools, but rather 'taken off the top", so there is zero drag coming off the spool, and no rotation of the spools. Any tension required is supplied down-line of the spools through spring-loaded dished washers on a smooth peg (like a sewing machine thread tensioner). Lloyd
schroedinger Posted April 12, 2016 Posted April 12, 2016 On all the commercial machines I've seen (including the 1/4" time fuse machine I own), the twine is not "unrolled" from the spools, but rather 'taken off the top", so there is zero drag coming off the spool, and no rotation of the spools. Any tension required is supplied down-line of the spools through spring-loaded dished washers on a smooth peg (like a sewing machine thread tensioner). LloydPropably to prevent the string tension pressing out the bp core, while spinning?
Twignberry Posted April 12, 2016 Posted April 12, 2016 Rteer, I'm still working on developing a next generation visco machine but happy to help you out in the mean time. If you could post some photos, I'm happy to help diagnose based off what I've found through my failures. In case you didn't run into it before, I detailed a few key parameters that worked for me such as spindle thru hole diameter etc in this posthttp://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/11131-kit-visco-machine/
Rkteer Posted April 13, 2016 Author Posted April 13, 2016 Sorry I didn't explain that too well. I have the funnel on top, there is a tube running from the funnel to the first die. I have a nozzle on the end of the tube with a chamfer on it leading into the first die. How do I add pictures with the mobile version?
lloyd Posted April 13, 2016 Posted April 13, 2016 (edited) "Propably to prevent the string tension pressing out the bp core, while spinning?"--------------Shroe, no. It's to prevent the (rather thin) yarns from breaking from the inertia of a spool. When I say 'spool', I might be better to say 'roll' or even 'cone' of yarn. They have a core tube, but no belled ends; so the yarn can be simply unwound off the 'top' (narrow end of the cone) with essentially zero force. They ARE tensioned slightly by the washer/spring affair I described after de-spooling, so that they feed smoothly and straight. The way the powder packs and the way the first wind is wrapped around the powder, it's unlikely that they'd displace any powder, unless their tension was large enough to break the yarn, anyway. Lloyd Edited April 13, 2016 by lloyd
Rkteer Posted April 13, 2016 Author Posted April 13, 2016 Thanks for the help guys! Twiginberry thanks for the help!I already read the thread you had ob your visco machine and the kit one too.There was a lot of very good info in there! Flam,I will get some photos of it up just can't seem to work out how to post them up!The nozzle I'm trying to describe is similar to the Olin projects one. If you Google Olin projects you should be able go find some photos of his one. I have a SS tube going from the funnel to the first die. So the nozzle attached to the end of the tube. Lloyd,Thanks for the info! I have seen some of the photos of your time fuse machine. Looks like quite a beast!
Rkteer Posted April 15, 2016 Author Posted April 15, 2016 Hey guys wired up the pulse width modulator to the collection drum and loosens all the threads back off. works so well now it's awesome. Coming out with 1.8mm fuse. How do I upload photos to the forum? Can't seem to find a way on my phone?
lloyd Posted April 15, 2016 Posted April 15, 2016 I've got to tell you: I LOVE the combination of precise machining, screw fasteners, and friggin' boxing tape! BTW... where the heck is your lacquering station? The fuse will not be serviceable without being 'fixed'. I'd also recommend that the takeup reel be of a larger diameter. Once you begin lacquering, you'll find that allowing it to "take a set" of that small a radius will be undesirable when you come to use the dried fuse. LLoyd
Rkteer Posted April 15, 2016 Author Posted April 15, 2016 Haha got to love it hey?Yeah mate Im making the part to hold the tracer threads. Just couldn't help myself and had to try it!! As for the laquering station, I'm still making it. I'm going to have it spun around that collection drum 3 times then pulled through a nc bath then have a 10m dryong section to the other motor. The other motor will have the real collection drum on it and a slip oring drive between the motor and the collection drum. That way I shouldn't have to worry about the drum diameter as fuse runs on.
Rkteer Posted April 18, 2016 Author Posted April 18, 2016 Does anyone know of come interesting compositions to make fuse with? Such as falling leaf fuse or anything like that?
Arthur Posted April 18, 2016 Posted April 18, 2016 You will need to wind it eventually, once it's lacquered, something the size of a bike wheel would be good (OK maybe a smaller one say 20").
Rkteer Posted April 18, 2016 Author Posted April 18, 2016 Really didn't think I would need to wind it around that bigger diameter. Does it need to be dry before being wound?Like will it stick together when it dries otherwise with nx laquer?
lloyd Posted April 18, 2016 Posted April 18, 2016 I think you will need a larger 'advance spindle'. That tiny thing will damage the fuse -- always a little, sometimes a lot. Yes, if the fuse is not impeccably dry before spooling it'll be worthless when you TEAR it off the roll again. Take it from a guy who's made thousands of meters of fuse -- the drying path (tunnel in my case) is always about 25% shorter than it needs to be, no matter what length you make it! LLoy
Rkteer Posted April 18, 2016 Author Posted April 18, 2016 Haha thanks for the info Lloyd. I will be having a much larger take up reel. How long should I have it to dry before the final take up spool?
lloyd Posted April 18, 2016 Posted April 18, 2016 Rkteer,To be clear, yes, you need a larger takeup spool than the tiny advance roller you're using. But you also need a larger advance roller. That tight a radius in the process WILL damage the fuse. How long a span it takes to dry the lacquer depends upon a number of variables; most notably the temperature and humidity, and the solvent content of the lacquer. The more viscous it is, the longer it will take to dry. The lower the temperature, the longer it will take. The higher the humidity, the more it will tend to 'blush', and the longer it will take. I built a 'drying tunnel' from 1/2" polyisocyanurate foam board and 1x2 (inch) lumber. My tunnel was only twelve feet long, but the fuse made four full courses through it (on pulleys), and I drove heated air from a common hand hair dryer into the column. No, NOT directed right at the fuse, lest it damage or ignite it! The air went through several baffles before the flow got into the drying tunnel. This served not only to 'temper' the air a bit, but also to catch any sparks that can (will!) come from a hair dryer. Even then, if I didn't control the temp and humidity in the room, there were times when it would end up "not quite dry". Then there was the exercise of having to spool it off slowly from one end of a 24' room to the other end to a take-up reel. I remember only one occasion where I had to do that twice before it was thoroughly dried. Mine was not NC coated (PVA-sized and sealed), so I cannot speak directly to your situation, except to say that you'll probably need to experiment on the generous side of "long" to get it just right. LLoyd
Rkteer Posted April 18, 2016 Author Posted April 18, 2016 Ah I get you now Lloyd. Thanks for the patience and explaining that to me. Would 100mm be sufficient for the first advance roller?
lloyd Posted April 18, 2016 Posted April 18, 2016 Yes, for visco-diameter, I'd say that's about right. For 1/4" time fuse, it's more like about 300mm. LLoyd
Redrocketman Posted June 20, 2016 Posted June 20, 2016 Hi guys, where I am you simply can't buy fuse, therefore making it is my only option? At the present stage in my life, 3 kids, running the business etc etc etc, I simply don't have the time at present to design one. Can you buy smaller than commercial weaving machines, or can anyone help with a link to a reliable design if I have to go down the 'construction ' pathway? Any help would be greatly appreciated
memo Posted June 20, 2016 Posted June 20, 2016 (edited) have you talked to twignberry on this forum ? he makes a machine and lives in oz. might be you best bet. i would have bought one , but the shipping to central america is a deal breaker I just read page one and I see you have talked with him, now all you need to do is buy one. his price wasn't bad. memo Edited June 20, 2016 by memo
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