White flitter/Pearl... the bane of my existence...

[braddsn]

Ok so the white flitter and white pearl comets have always been my favorite for shell rising effect. But getting them to light out of the gun has proven difficult. The chinese use a lot of these comets and they are already lit when the shell leaves the gun. Half the time mine dont light.. and when they do they finally start glowing bright at nearly apex. Anyone have any tricks?? I am first priming top of comet with monocapa followed by bp layer. Right now I am using Jopetes white pearl comp. small cut stars glued to shell. Thanks!

[FlaMtnBkr]

Try mixing up a slurry of your choice. Perhaps NC lacquer with fast BP mixed in to a nice thick batter. Then dip or paint one side and sprinkle some BP on so there is a nice rough and chunky layer. That should light most any comet or star from the lift gases.

 

Could it also be that you have such a thick layer of prime that the prime is burning during the lift so the star isn't burning until close to apogee? I'm not familiar with the formula off the top of my head but maybe only prime the one surface so the sides start burning immediately instead of a thick layer of prime. Might help.

[Mumbles]

I'd second what FlaMtnBkr said. Slurry and granules will light almost anything.

 

I really only use comets for these rising tails, so this is more applicable to that. The other option is to tie a couple pieces of blackmatch over the top of the comet. You can do this in combination with priming as well. I've never had a rising tail fail to take fire from prime and blackmatch. Remember to inhibit the side of the stars/comet to get a longer tail that wont fall off from melting the hot glue.

[braddsn]

Ok... I will try the slurry/granule route. I am going to keep working at it.. I just don't understand why the flitter has to be so hard to light. Too much metal.

[JOPETES]

Hello Braddsn. Your problem is very easy solution. not surprisingly all stars with much atomized aluminum are harder to ignite than the compositions of colors. All my aerial shells on the ascension always carry one meteroro white pearl, this makes very beautiful ascension.

The first, in Pdf explained that the composition of white pearl or White streamer have to use two layers, the 1st IMPRIMACION CALIENTE can be mixed with 7-8% the same atomized aluminum white pearl the composition and below a layer of black powder. Can also use 1ªcapa MIX 50% WHITE PEARL +50% BP and below a layer of ........ THIS IS NOT FAULT, 100% WORKS !! .............. ................. use the same system priming meteroros in acension of aerial cover, meteroros to Roman candles and primed white pearl stars.

 

I sent an accompanying drawing.

[JOPETES]

For example, white pearl these stars have two layers of 0.5mm 1ª priming white pearl mix composition 50% + 50%Bp and 2ª layer 1mm Bp ................ 100% encencidas not problem ............. one of the secrets is that 1ªcapa of priming composition (hot mix primer or 50% + 50% p.blanca Bp) contains atomized aluminum particles that help far to the ignition on the star, and particulary, imprimacion caliente produced very hot....................http://translate.google.es/translate?hl=es&sl=en&u=http://www.amateurpyro.com/forums/topic/9812-videos-colors-an-effects-of-pdf-jopetes/&prev=search

Edited March 31, 2015 by JOPETES

[braddsn]

Jopetes, thank you for the advice. I will gi and try again using this method. So on top of comet i prime first with 50/50 monocapa/white pearl, then finally a bp layer?

[enanthate]

Jopetes, thank you for the advice. I will gi and try again using this method. So on top of comet i prime first with 50/50 monocapa/white pearl, then finally a bp layer?

50/50 white pearl / BP.

[schroedinger]

Also if you want a white streamer tail like seen on many chinese shell use ball milled C6 with + 10 % Ti.

[JOPETES]

Jopetes, thank you for the advice. I will gi and try again using this method. So on top of comet i prime first with 50/50 monocapa/white pearl, then finally a bp layer?

Braddsn, you have misunderstood me.

you have to apply on the star or meteor a first layer and can use two possible combinations that 100% will work:

--- 1º. mix composition 50% white pearl with 50% Bp

--- 2º. mix 7-8% atomized aluminum with 100% IMPRIMACION HOT (PDF)

3º. can we mix 7-8% atomized aluminum with 100% MONOCAPA (PDF). NOTE: I've never tried monolayer mixed with 7-8% atomized aluminum but surely works well.

Finally a layer of Bp over the first layer.

[braddsn]

Ok Jopetes. Now I understand what you are saying. Have 1 more question.... in your chart where the Monocapa formula is listed, it says you can use either MgAl, or Dark Aluminum. Which do you prefer? Is one better than the other? Also, when you put your final layer of bp on star, do you do it in star roller? Is final bp layer on star very smooth? Thank you!

[JOPETES]

Hello Braddsn.

 

 

1st question --- when a single layer is used to prime the stars is better to use black aluminum German 2micras, the stars light up best at high speed but add to the formula 1% boric acid dissolved in water-alcohol spray to roll the stars. To use a single layer in the star is enough 1mm max, no more thick.

 

2nd question --- For white pearl or white sauce stars, you have to apply layers of priming the same way as the stars of color, 0.5mm 1st layer (monolayer, hot primer or mix 50/50) and 2nd topcoat below 1mm Black powder.

 

3rd cuestion-- on aerial shells meteroros to apply 1st 1mm layer (monolayer, hot primer or mix 50/50) and 2nd layer below 1mm black powder.

 

4th cuestion-- Roman candles for meteor to apply the two layers in each of the faces of the meteor. see picture I sent in a previous post.

[braddsn]

That answers my question thank you!

[braddsn]

Ok I did some testing tonight with this prime method and it worked great! I will video some white pearl comets on shells very soon! I also switched from magnalium to dark aluminum in the monocapa and added boric acid to my water.

[JOPETES]

Ok, I'm very glad .Braddsn, I can say that these methods are those that are used in many factories fireworks. White Pearl is much more beautiful than the stars that contain titanium because aluminum reaches a very high temperature in the combustion and produces a white glow very intense unlike titanium is a more subdued luster and a white BECOMING into gold. You can see that the formulas white pearl and white willow contains a potent oxidant (Kclo4) mixed with a very powerful fuel like magnalium or black aluminum and other fuel combustion regulating (red gum), these three components are the basis for producing a powerful combustion heat and temperature to combust aluminum particles to achieve a very intense white sparks, however with a simple black powder you mix that produces a low-temperature combustion can easily combust titanium particles but even if you use a mixture very powerful base Titanium will only shine a little more intense brightness reaching saturation.

As explained in the PDF, the white pearl can add 15-20%, this depends on the length of the bright tail. I tested up to 25% but if you add more quantity mix brightness begins to fade a bit and becomes a little gold and stars are harder to ignition by excess aluminum.

 

finally you can try the monolayer with black aluminum and boric acid in a very small batch of stars and use a single layer and try Stargun to different shear forces and speed, or also can try two aerial shells 3 " with difefentes forces opening or speed and see the results. I suggest you do the test with stars containing nitrate barium as is the color green, turquoise,lemon yellow or green-lime that are the most difficult to prime .......... ., it's just a suggestion but very practical and you can see the degree of satisfaction.

[braddsn]

Ok. This is good. My tests last night were firing white pearl pumped comets from a star gun. With the step priming method they had 100% ignition. These I will use for rising effect on my shells. Another question, do you ever use the monocapa alone? Or will it always have a final layer of bp on top? I like the monocapa, it ignites stars well even at high speed.

[JOPETES]

Hello Braddsn, for me is a pleasure to talk with you and help you with all your questions whenever they are within my knowledge.

No doubt that the most effective method to prime the stars and comets or meteors is to use two layers as I mentioned in many post and the Pdf. The Chinese are not stupid and they know very well that the double layer method is the most effective but the difference is knowing what formulas or compositions must be used for the two layers and get the initiation or ignition at 100% even with very strong starts. It is also true that the Chinese sometimes used a single layer and is very effective even at high speeds. I've always used on most occasions the double layer, the 1st layer IMPRIMACION CALIENTE OR MONOCAPA Pdf (designed by mi) and below 2ªcapa end of black powder. On other occasions I have used only MONOCAPA but I've seen it more effective at high speed using black aluminum (the Chinese also use it) instead of magnalium. Of course it's more comfortable at the time of manufacture of stars or meteroros use a single layer of primer.

 

Whenever you use white pearl, white willow, green pearl or red pearl Pdf have to use all three methods I have explained in a previous post. In any of the three methods the composition contains atomized aluminum definitely helps to correct IGNITION.

 

I hope that answers your questions correctly.

[braddsn]

Yes, you answered my question thank you. The monocapa is GREAT and now I will be trying it with Dark Aluminum. All of my colors that I use now are from your PDF. They are the best colors I have used and perform very well. Also the blue formulas contain magnalium and therefore maintain ignition better at high speed. Tomorrow night I will video some shells using the white pearl comets. I also will be testing the blue star formula that contains 'hexamine'. I do have one more question. When you add the final layer of BP on color stars, do you apply this layer in the star roller? Because if applied in the star roller, the finished star is very smooth on the outside, and sometimes ignition is easier if you have a 'scratchy' outer layer with fine granules of bp.

[JOPETES]

Hello Braddsn.

 

Yes, the final layer of 1mm black powder should be applied to the star roller. This layer has to be very well attached to the 1st layer (monolayer, imp.caliente, step priming) and roll the star very well, but just down .................. will apply the black powder with little water-alcohol and you have to roll the stars until you see that the surface is a little rough and rugous. This is a technique that requires experience and gradually acquired with practice. making stars shot in the star roller is an art but worth it. I do not like all the videos posted to cut stars, I seem botched job and never the same result are obtained with round stars and calibrated on a screen stars.

 

I need to know if the black powder you use this mixed in a ball mill for a long time in very fine powder or is mixed briefly in ball mill but enough so that the mixture is homogeneous or if you mix simply a sieve until well mixed and homogeneous.

 

I need to know what type of coal used you for layers priming (this is super important) and finally, can you post some pictures of stars that can be seen up close and are finished with the final layer of black powder and also a star halved to see the layers ??

[braddsn]

I will take some pictures soon and post them. 1) My black powder is milled in 1kg batches in a ball mill. My ball mill makes very fast bp in 3 hours of milling. 2) The charcoal I use is Eastern Red Cedar. It is very reactive and makes fast bp. I use this same high quality charcoal in all of my pyro (priming, charcoal stars, bp, etc). The coal I use in the Monocapa prime is ball-milled (airfloat). Here I will post a video of my very first batch of bp that I made a year ago that was ball milled for 2 hours with the Eastern Red Cedar charcoal.

 

[JOPETES]

Ok. the black powder that looks in video pretty good . The black powder made ball mill for 2-3 hours is fine to touch and to apply a final coat of 1mm can be a little smoother. if you want a slightly rougher surface can use black powder milled in a ball mill only about 40 minutes ((depends on the ball mill) is enough for a well-mixed gunpowder so homogeneous. A method used in some factories pyrotechnics is simply mix the ingredients (charcoal, KNO3, sulfur and dextrin) into a fine sieve 3 or 4 times until the mixture is perfectly homogeneous. This method is the safest, the powder has a slower combustion but, no matter, the stars light up perfectly and the surface of the final layer is rougher. You can also use ground black gunpowder 2-3horas and right at the end add some black powder mixed in strainer and roll stars with little water-alcohol. (you can make a lot of black powder for use exclusive in the final process).

[braddsn]

Ok so, I made a new 2kg batch of white pearl stars. I rolled the stars, then mixed 50/50 white pearl/monocapa and primed .5mm, then finally 1mm bp on the outside. They light well testing out of the star gun. Next week I will test in a shell.

[Nhatnguyen]

Try mixing up a slurry of your choice. Perhaps NC lacquer with fast BP mixed in to a nice thick batter. Then dip or paint one side and sprinkle some BP on so there is a nice rough and chunky layer. That should light most any comet or star from the lift gases.

 

Could it also be that you have such a thick layer of prime that the prime is burning during the lift so the star isn't burning until close to apogee? I'm not familiar with the formula off the top of my head but maybe only prime the one surface so the sides start burning immediately instead of a thick layer of prime. Might help.

[Nhatnguyen]

Ai đó làm ơn có thể cho tôi biết được không, tôi đã sơn lót 2 bước đầu tiên là 0,5 mm đơn lớp mooncapha vì tôi được nghe nói rằng số nguyên tố này rất tốt, và sau đó tôi đã phủ 1 mm bp lên chúng , nhưng chúng đã bị thổi mù với những ngôi sao màu đỏ của tôi, quả thật lớp bp cuối cùng của tôi khá mịn và bóng