psyco_1322 Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 Mumbles I think you said it yourself, "fuel of choice". Not all fuel that can be used for fireballs are going to eat at a plastic shell. Anyone know what plastic is used for shells anyways? Some sort of PVC is my guess. Hell you could use rubbing alcohol, it surprising give a nice orange flame and isnt going to hurt the shell much. I would say a powder fuel, like gilsinite, would be way more efficient.
Chris Posted September 25, 2008 Author Posted September 25, 2008 Anyone know what plastic is used for shells anyways? Polystyrene
spitfire Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 The problem with solid fuels like cremora would be the caking of the powder. I was thinking about lampara shells, witch use a bottle of fuel(gas). I've seen dozens of 6'' cilinder lampara's on Malta, they use butanegas tanks surrounded by a flashcharge. The little blue ones used in a campingstove. wonderfull effect, very very loud thumps with nice orange licking flames. But using this as a pistil... the shell might become a little big for amateurs to shoot. Maybe some kind of small bottle made of soft, flimsy plastic...?
tentacles Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 (edited) Gilsonite would work in an aerial fireball, it doesn't cake or pack down much - if at all. Certain types of airfloat charcoal could also work - although I would imagine it would do just fine if you packed it in tight and broke it hard. Creamer/gravy base would be bad because it will clump up under pressure (soft and sticky). Shooting propane/butane tanks into the air with flash strapped to them is absolutely INSANE. That's just about the dumbest idea I've ever heard - I don't believe the maltese would shoot steel tanks into the air and blast them apart with flash. The thin plastic/aluminum butane tanks, possibly, but anyone shooting metal into the air is just asking for trouble. Edited September 25, 2008 by tentacles
Richtee Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 (edited) Loosely tied to the lampare theme.... any ideas/opinions? Well, I dissolved about 500 grams of gunk in acetone, and poured thru a 20 mesh screen to remove wood chunks, etc. Will evap and then cook it to a powder... damn this shit's STICKY. Smells good tho... grin. Edited September 26, 2008 by Richtee
tentacles Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 Freeze it before you attempt to powder it. Better yet, wait til winter and ball mill it outside, it'll mill to a finer dust and be less likely to clump. You CAN buy rosin powder from various sources. It's also used as a binder/fuel in some comps. I think you can sub it for japanese rosin most of the time.
Richtee Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 Freeze it before you attempt to powder it. Better yet, wait til winter and ball mill it outside, it'll mill to a finer dust and be less likely to clump. You CAN buy rosin powder from various sources. It's also used as a binder/fuel in some comps. I think you can sub it for japanese rosin most of the time.Huh...thanks...make sense. Since I have a virtually unlimited supply, I'll try to cook this batch and freeze another. And maybe one more batch to pour in the outhouse...LOL!
bobby9101 Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 (edited) @MumblesThere is something called poor man's napalm, which is styrofoam dissolved in gasoline.This may work a little better because the dissolved styrofoam would slow down the speed at which gasoline could break down the plastic shells; however, this will create a smaller fireball in the air, yet the fire will last much longer. Make sure your shell is propelled high enough or else the poor man's napalm may come back down to good ol' earth still burining. Just my two cents Edited September 26, 2008 by bobby9101
psyco_1322 Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 You would have to nearly vaporise that liquid styrofoam for it not to come back down. But how does gelled alcohol sound? Easier to work with.
oskarchem Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 Well gelled alcohol (at least here) has trouble burning, I really have to heat it up for it to flame up, and it doesn't make a fire ball... What about just using plain alcohol?
Mumbles Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 You'd want to use Isopropanol or longer chained to get the nice fireball color. I'd also prefer 99% IpA for flamability reason. I am going to ask the guy tomorrow what he uses for a fuel because I'm curious now. I bet a mixture of denatured alcohol and kerosine or something like that may be useful. I think the gelled gasoline would be a poor choice for several reasons. Primarily because it's still going to dissolve and attack the shell casings. I'd also prefer not to have a bunch of flaming gobs of fuel rain down to earth in a 500 foot radius.
Richtee Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 (edited) Huh...thanks...make sense. Since I have a virtually unlimited supply, I'll try to cook this batch and freeze another. And maybe one more batch to pour in the outhouse...LOL!Well, cooking it produces a very brittle "amber" that crushes and grinds easily. Sticky as hell...rosin I guess. But it's not very good in a "creamora". When mixed with a strong oxidizer it burns brightly tho. But I figger won't work for my intended purpose. Ah well. Off to wipe my hands off with acetone..heh. On edit: Might make a good binder with the acetone solvent tho... Hmmm Edited September 27, 2008 by Richtee
Mumbles Posted September 28, 2008 Posted September 28, 2008 Damn, so I completely forgot to ask today. I was hanging out with him all day, and it completely slipped my mind. On the plus side, my shells preformed well. Videos to come.
Brian809 Posted October 5, 2008 Posted October 5, 2008 Here's a few I did sat. night, They're all 4" plastic ball shells. These are the first 4" shells I've made and surprisingly they all worked but could have been burst harder, I used kp for burst with flash as a booster and didnt tape them just shot them plain. D1http://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0060.mpg Blonde Streamerhttp://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0061.mpg Ruby Redhttp://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0063.mpg Saluteshttp://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0064.mpghttp://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0062.mpg Brian
Richtee Posted October 6, 2008 Posted October 6, 2008 http://www.pyrobin.com/files/dscn0062.mpg LOL.. "HELLO?!?! C'MON!" BaLOOIE
Mumbles Posted October 6, 2008 Posted October 6, 2008 Is it just me, or are the first two videos cut short? All I see is the rising tail. In the Ruby Red video, it looks as if the stars are still expanding when the video cuts out too.
Brian809 Posted October 6, 2008 Posted October 6, 2008 (edited) The video should play until the stars all go out, plays completely on my end but I need to get a better camera as that was a nikon coolpix in video mode with my daughter recording. I did a bunch of 3" paper shells before we realized the camera recorded w/sound and yeah I know the salutes are kinda obnoxious but there are 2 things my brother loves, the thump! of the launch and big booms so I make 1 or 2 for him seeing it's his neighbors that put up with us! The ruby red was a 4" shell with 3/8 pumped stars and amazingly they worked, took forever to dry! LOL Richtee, my sister just answered her phone when that launched and everyone including me thought it was going to be a low shot as it went up and was on it's way back down before bursting. I have a question for you guys, When making shells do you just line the outer wall with stars or do you make them like the passfire tutorial and fill both hemi's completely with stars? Brian Edited October 6, 2008 by Brian809
psyco_1322 Posted October 6, 2008 Posted October 6, 2008 Mumbles the videos played fine for me, clear to burn out of stars. Might need a quicktime update or something. Those were very nice shells Brian. If you want the best symmetry on your shells than you will have to put the strs around the outer wall of the shell. Follow that with a layer of tissue paper and then your burst. This is how most people make their shells. The Passfire method will not get the best round burst but will appear to be more dense and full of stars, in which it actually is. Its also a waste of stars IMHO. This page on Passfire shows the differences in breaks: http://www.passfire.com/archives/issue4_2/build4_2_1.asp-Note: If you are not a Passfire member, you will not be able to view the above link. Get a membership and see what your missing out on.
Brian809 Posted October 6, 2008 Posted October 6, 2008 Thanks for the compliments guys, Like I said those were my first 4" shells and also the first time using plastic hemis and I didnt tape or paste the shells just glued them shut and fired them so there might not have been enough pressure for the kp to really get going. That is how I make my shells also, line the outer wall with stars then tissue paper with burst in the center with a flash bag. I was just wondering because on some of the videos here they are getting huge breaks from 4" shells. Thanks guys,Brian
FrKoNaLeaSh1010 Posted October 7, 2008 Posted October 7, 2008 Well if you were to paste or tape your shells you would get a bigger break. Those shells were very nice but like you said you could definitely get a bigger and stronger break by taping/pasting and if that doesnt work then add a little more burst. As for the star arrangement in the shells for smaller shells like 2" and below you can have the stars just thrown in mixed with the burst but for a more symmetrical and even break in the larger shells you should put the stars on the outside of the hemi with the tissue paper in the middle with a tube going into the center of the shell with the burst and booster in the middle. Also In my opinion KP definitely needs strong shells with lots of pasting/tape to get up to pressure to get a real good burst so keep up the good work and try pasting or fiber reinforced tape next time and I think you will see some improvement. Also what formula were those blonde streamers as they dont look like the blonde streamer I made a long time ago.
Brian809 Posted October 7, 2008 Posted October 7, 2008 (edited) I'm not sure where I picked up the formula I think it was skylighter, but I agree with you they didn't look much like blonde streamer I'm going to try a different formula but here's the one I have written in my book: Potassium Nitrate-45Charcoal Airfloat-29FerroTitanium 40-325 15Sulfur-6Dextrin-5 And thanks for the tips on getting the shells to break harder Brian Edit:I looked at my notes again and the formula is from passfire and they're bleser blonde streamer#1 stars and I see where I made a mistake with the FerroTitanium, maybe thats why they didnt look right! Edited October 7, 2008 by Brian809
pyrohusband Posted October 7, 2008 Posted October 7, 2008 Hello guys, Iam looking forward to gaining good information from these forums to make my own aerial shells. I have been a huge pyrotechnic nut for a very long time and feel it is time to take the next step to making my own shells. Thanks for all the helpful information here guys.
pyrogeorge Posted October 8, 2008 Posted October 8, 2008 join passfire.com.It is the best site from information,how to make tools-shells everything..just the best site
mudmanc5 Posted October 8, 2008 Posted October 8, 2008 Skylighter plastic bombette . Are these safe to fill with FP I Want to use a few of these for reports in a 8'' round shell and I'm not to thrilled about pasting an 8'' shell with these inserts if there's a chance of causing static with all the shaking involved
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