Smokeless Powder Uses

[LiamPyro]

I happen to have a couple of cans of Hercules Red Dot smokeless shotgun powder I got from a family member who had it in their garage, and was curious if it has any use in pyrotechnics. Here's a photo of the can, if it helps:

 

[dagabu]

NC Lacquer...

[Jakenbake]

Yup with a little acetone or denatured alcohol it will make some decent NCL. Unfortunately that's about all it will make.

[taiwanluthiers]

smokeless powder requires extreme confinement in order to unleash its power... if you confine firework shells like this the shell will not likely survive the launch. Military shells launched with smokeless are made of metal.

 

They are good for NC lacquer used for dragon eggs, visco, etc.

[BurritoBandito]

Here's a Skylighter article detailing smokeless powders use in colored flame projectors. Edited September 4, 2014 by BurritoBandito

[LiamPyro]

Thanks guys! I think I'll do some research on nitrocellulose lacquer. Any tips in making/using it? I know absolutely nothing about it except that it is sometimes used as a binder or waterproofing agent.

[schroedinger]

You will need NC nearly only for making NC/BP Slurry for priming and for Dragon eggs. Sometimes it also gets used as a seperator between incompatible layers in stars

[pyrojig]

TO make the Lacquer you need to weigh out the acetone and the smokeless powder . A common ratio is 5% and even up to 20% can be used in making dragon eggs . Simply weigh out 100 parts of acetone and 5 parts powder for a 5%. You may need to stir it for a while , let it sit( covered /sealed) then re-stir .I do this for about 1/2 h till it makes a very nice green laq.

[BurritoBandito]

Not to be a pedant, but 5 grams of NC to 100 grams of acetone would be 4.76%, 5 grams of NC to 95 grams acetone would be 5% NC lacquer. Personally I use 10%.

[schroedinger]

Well if you got the time, just weight everything and pur0t it into the bottle. Then letbit atand for a week and shake if you pass by, works god too. Stirring often is just needed if you need the laquer fast.

[LiamPyro]

Would it make a difference that my smokeless powder is pretty old? Just take a look at the picture I posted of the container...

I'm assuming it's pretty much the same as the new stuff, but from what I've read, it might have some chemicals in it that have since been banned due to toxicity.

Also, NC lacquer can be used to bind globs of ignition composition onto the end of visco fuses, right?

[BurritoBandito]

"Would it make a difference that my smokeless powder is pretty old? Just take a look at the picture I posted of the container..."

I doubt the age of the powder will be an issue. Does it burn readily?

 

"I'm assuming it's pretty much the same as the new stuff, but from what I've read, it might have some chemicals in it that have since been banned due to toxicity"

I wouldn't worry too much about this either. Just don't eat it .

 

"Also, NC lacquer can be used to bind globs of ignition composition onto the end of visco fuses, right?"

Yes, NC lacquer is commonly used to make pyrogen for ematches, priming fuses, etc. Just mix some meal powder into the lacquer to make a slurry, and dip your items in. Generally speaking, it's a good idea to give the dipped object a light dusting of meal to help it more easily take fire.

[rogeryermaw]

Yes, NC lacquer is commonly used to make pyrogen for ematches, priming fuses, etc. Just mix some meal powder into the lacquer to make a slurry, and dip your items in. Generally speaking, it's a good idea to give the dipped object a light dusting of meal to help it more easily take fire.

nc generally takes fire pretty easily but i have had it fail before...i'm guessing due to how smoothly it dries? the dusting with meal has helped tremendously.

[LiamPyro]

"Would it make a difference that my smokeless powder is pretty old? Just take a look at the picture I posted of the container..."

I doubt the age of the powder will be an issue. Does it burn readily?

It lights easily with visco fuse, and burns completely with a yellow/orange flame. Here's a short video: Edited September 5, 2014 by LiamPyro

[LiamPyro]

"I'm assuming it's pretty much the same as the new stuff, but from what I've read, it might have some chemicals in it that have since been banned due to toxicity"

I wouldn't worry too much about this either. Just don't eat it .

Ok, thanks

Edited September 5, 2014 by LiamPyro

[BurritoBandito]

The video doesn't seem to load, but it sounds like it should work fine.

[LiamPyro]

The video doesn't seem to load, but it sounds like it should work fine.

Alright, thanks! Sorry the video had issues loading

[MrB]

The video doesn't seem to load, but it sounds like it should work fine.

You need a new player, it works fine ;- )

 

And it burns just as expected to. That stuff is ok.

B!

[BurritoBandito]

You need a new player, it works fine ;- )

 

And it burns just as expected to. That stuff is ok.

B!

Yeah, I usually access the forum from my iPhone. I'm sure that's the problem.

[LiamPyro]

Yeah, I usually access the forum from my iPhone. I'm sure that's the problem.

It probably is! I tried to view the video on my iPad and it would'nt play it.

[MrB]

I tried it on my phone, and well... It works.

So, you guys just have crappy mobile devices, and truth be told... Apple, really guys, i mean, com on, really? ;-Þ

 

As if i should say anything. I got a linux based device, made by a manufacturer that pulled the plug on the OS right after releasing my phone, and then later sold it's mobile division to one of the "evil" companies... But hey, it play's .mov clips.

B!

[LiamPyro]

You need a new player, it works fine ;- )

 

And it burns just as expected to. That stuff is ok.

B!

Thanks for the confirmation! I had no idea how smokeless powder was supposed to burn.

[MrB]

Thanks for the confirmation! I had no idea how smokeless powder was supposed to burn.

Generally people don't. They expect it to go off with a load bang, and instantly. They have no idea what the concept of confinement is, they just know this stuff is pretty violent in a gun. I've had people give me this stiff by the buckets, a couple of years back, for the simple reason that it's "gone bad". I'm sure it can go bad, but it apparently mostly is about it turning acidic, eating away at cans, and casings, and smelling funky. As long as it's stored dry, out of the sun, and at a even temperature, it should hold out pretty much for ever. I know reloader using surplus stuff from WWII.

When i doubt, dissolve it all in acetone straight away. I suspect the solvent stop any negative impacts from time and environment, and as long as you keep it in an airtight bottle it stores pretty much forever. As long as it doesn't solidify completely you just add more cellulose thinner, or acetone, and go back to ignoring it. Knowing exactly what % your at for any given time would mean you need to keep track of what you start with, and keeping track of how much you've used. Writing the % on the bottle, and marking the level is how i'd do it.

(What i did with the buckets of stuff i got, that people thought was spoiled? Mostly i gave it away, or returned it, if possible. The rest i dissolved and gave / traded to other pyros. I had a different, purer source at the time. )

 

Anyway, good luck / have fun.

B!

[LiamPyro]

Generally people don't. They expect it to go off with a load bang, and instantly. They have no idea what the concept of confinement is, they just know this stuff is pretty violent in a gun. I've had people give me this stiff by the buckets, a couple of years back, for the simple reason that it's "gone bad". I'm sure it can go bad, but it apparently mostly is about it turning acidic, eating away at cans, and casings, and smelling funky. As long as it's stored dry, out of the sun, and at a even temperature, it should hold out pretty much for ever. I know reloader using surplus stuff from WWII.

When i doubt, dissolve it all in acetone straight away. I suspect the solvent stop any negative impacts from time and environment, and as long as you keep it in an airtight bottle it stores pretty much forever. As long as it doesn't solidify completely you just add more cellulose thinner, or acetone, and go back to ignoring it. Knowing exactly what % your at for any given time would mean you need to keep track of what you start with, and keeping track of how much you've used. Writing the % on the bottle, and marking the level is how i'd do it.

(What i did with the buckets of stuff i got, that people thought was spoiled? Mostly i gave it away, or returned it, if possible. The rest i dissolved and gave / traded to other pyros. I had a different, purer source at the time. )

 

Anyway, good luck / have fun.

B!

Thanks for the info! I always imagined smokeless powder burning with a fast "Poomph" like good black powder.

[MrB]

Thanks for the info! I always imagined smokeless powder burning with a fast "Poomph" like good black powder.

If you can see it, it just fizzels, just like the video. If you enclose it in a good containment, it will go "pop", and quite honestly, weight or volume being your measure, BP just doesn't stand a chance anyway.

B!